Measure your cases...

T191032 · January 24, 2008, 09:47 PM

Hello,

I'm a new poster here, so for the "grizzled veterans" of reloading, this is nothing new, but might help another new reloader one day.
Although I've had catalogs of reloading equipment, and encouraged years ago when I was shooting more frequently to reload my own, it was only recently (last summer) that I purchased the equipment. Shooting is an enjoyable, though bit expensive, hobby for me. Very relaxing. After watching the steady increase in loaded ammunition, and shooters moaning over it, plus the fact that I had 2000+ 9mm cases sitting in my basement doing nothing I decided maybe I should invest now.
For those who worship at the blue (Dillon) or green (RCBS) alter, forgive me. I purchased the Lee Anniversary kit, along with 9mm Parabellum and .45 ACP Lee Dies from Cabelas. For my bench, part of the pre-planning I had made was purchasing a base cabinet, home-made workbench and a table from an auction, at $1.00 ea. The workbench became my temporary cleaning station (still need to replace/improve the top on it), while the table is a storage facility and placement of the reloading scale. The base cabinet had orginally been topped with tongue-and-groove wood that was old (!) and in terrible shape. Replaced it with 3/4" plywood.
At one time, all the brass had been sorted, but I had to consolidate and placed them into bags, so resorting was in order. After resizing/depriming (plus down time for the case that got stuck!) I found that despite words, you DO need to lubricate a carbide die! Life interveened and it was not until recently that I got my first 50 rounds loaded.
I followed the manual, Hodgdon "Clays" powder, NOT Universal, but "Clays" under a Meister 115 LRN bullet. Since I was looking for a low-recoil, accurate loading and not trying to duplicate factory specs, that I, the powder thrower and scale could agree with 3.1gr of powder (just couldn't tweak the 3.0 out of the powder measure). Turned out, when I spoke with the man who used to reload my ammo that is right about what he loads in 9mm, grain-wise. He was the one encouraging me to reload back then...
Just a note on the low-recoil factor. Massad Ayoob (pg224 "Gun Digest Book of Sig-Sauer"), Walt Rauch (Handguns, Talk Big, Carry Small - like .45s, shoot 9mm and .38 - I don't have the magazine close by) and Dave Spaulding (pg 91 One Very Important Pistol, "The Complete Book of the Model 1911") have all mentioned the value of the low-recoiling 9mm with relation to arthritis and carpal-tunnel. Familiar with arthritis, I do understand!
Anyway, the other night, I decided to check something. I looked at the various load manuals in my possession (the Loadbook with its compilation of several sources turned out to be handy. Have several sources to check. Got the Lee 2nd Edition of Modern Reloading, the two-book Hornady 4th Ed set (my first reloading handbooks), the 2004 and 2006 Hodgdon magazine-style books, Lyman 48th Reloading Handbook and the Stoeger Complete Reloading Guide, along with the smaller basic handbooks put out by Accurate, Hodgdon and Federal.
According to the diagrams, maximum case length is 0.754" for the 9mm Parabellum. There is some differences in the Trim-to Length offered by the various guides,
Accurate : 0.744"
Hornady : 0.744"
Lyman : 0.751"
Sierra : 0.750"
Speer : 0.744"
So, I was really interested in how my 729 Speer cases (now twice-fired, they came from a case of Black Hills Reman ammo I bought years back) would come out. If they were somewhere inbetween sizes, I rounded up or down, depending which was closer.
Under 0.745" : 28 With some under the recommended Trim-to 0.744"
0.745" : 71
0.746 : 159
0.747 : 181
0.748 : 154
0.749 : 99
0.750 : 26
0.751 : 11
Yes, I found it interesting.

rwilson452 · January 24, 2008, 10:52 PM

to answer your question indirectly I don't load 9mm. I do load 45ACP. I don't measure my cases. I just load and go.

Sevens · January 24, 2008, 11:34 PM

Wow, there's a lot to digest in there! I've got a couple comments.

The 9mm is a tapered (however slightly) case. So while a carbide sizing die can run without lube, it works better with it in the case of the 9mm. Also in the .30 M1 Carbine. They look like straight walled cases, but neither are. If you go ahead and resize most any of the other "straight wall" pistol/handgun calibers, you'll find that yeah, you really don't need lube.

As for case length, I don't go to great lengths (heh) in any of my handgun calibers. I obviously do in the two rifle calibers for which I load.

jhansman · January 24, 2008, 11:51 PM

Hey man, I forgive you for getting the Lee kit. In fact, I'll congratulate you, as I have the same gear. No need to explain or apologize. Many, many of us here use Lee equipment with excellent results and no regrets.

Your case length data is interesting, but I have never felt the need or desire to trim my handgun cases (.45ACP & .357mag). Perhaps I should do a random measuring? Happy reloading....

ConfuseUs · January 27, 2008, 07:59 PM

I just lock my calipers at the max case length in the manual and see if the cases will pass through. The ones that don't pass through or stick some get dropped into a separate pile for trimming.

Conservadude · January 27, 2008, 08:54 PM

It's a good idea to lube every 4th or 5th round when full-length resizing straight-walled magnum cases such as the .480 Ruger, .454 Casull, .460S&W, and .500S&W as well. These longer cases can generate extra heat while resizing, carbide or not, and can also sometimes get stuck in the die.

Brian

January 24, 2008, 09:47 PM	#1
T191032 Member Join Date: January 22, 2008 Location: Shenandoah Valley of VA Posts: 87	Measure your cases... Hello, I'm a new poster here, so for the "grizzled veterans" of reloading, this is nothing new, but might help another new reloader one day. Although I've had catalogs of reloading equipment, and encouraged years ago when I was shooting more frequently to reload my own, it was only recently (last summer) that I purchased the equipment. Shooting is an enjoyable, though bit expensive, hobby for me. Very relaxing. After watching the steady increase in loaded ammunition, and shooters moaning over it, plus the fact that I had 2000+ 9mm cases sitting in my basement doing nothing I decided maybe I should invest now. For those who worship at the blue (Dillon) or green (RCBS) alter, forgive me. I purchased the Lee Anniversary kit, along with 9mm Parabellum and .45 ACP Lee Dies from Cabelas. For my bench, part of the pre-planning I had made was purchasing a base cabinet, home-made workbench and a table from an auction, at $1.00 ea. The workbench became my temporary cleaning station (still need to replace/improve the top on it), while the table is a storage facility and placement of the reloading scale. The base cabinet had orginally been topped with tongue-and-groove wood that was old (!) and in terrible shape. Replaced it with 3/4" plywood. At one time, all the brass had been sorted, but I had to consolidate and placed them into bags, so resorting was in order. After resizing/depriming (plus down time for the case that got stuck!) I found that despite words, you DO need to lubricate a carbide die! Life interveened and it was not until recently that I got my first 50 rounds loaded. I followed the manual, Hodgdon "Clays" powder, NOT Universal, but "Clays" under a Meister 115 LRN bullet. Since I was looking for a low-recoil, accurate loading and not trying to duplicate factory specs, that I, the powder thrower and scale could agree with 3.1gr of powder (just couldn't tweak the 3.0 out of the powder measure). Turned out, when I spoke with the man who used to reload my ammo that is right about what he loads in 9mm, grain-wise. He was the one encouraging me to reload back then... Just a note on the low-recoil factor. Massad Ayoob (pg224 "Gun Digest Book of Sig-Sauer"), Walt Rauch (Handguns, Talk Big, Carry Small - like .45s, shoot 9mm and .38 - I don't have the magazine close by) and Dave Spaulding (pg 91 One Very Important Pistol, "The Complete Book of the Model 1911") have all mentioned the value of the low-recoiling 9mm with relation to arthritis and carpal-tunnel. Familiar with arthritis, I do understand! Anyway, the other night, I decided to check something. I looked at the various load manuals in my possession (the Loadbook with its compilation of several sources turned out to be handy. Have several sources to check. Got the Lee 2nd Edition of Modern Reloading, the two-book Hornady 4th Ed set (my first reloading handbooks), the 2004 and 2006 Hodgdon magazine-style books, Lyman 48th Reloading Handbook and the Stoeger Complete Reloading Guide, along with the smaller basic handbooks put out by Accurate, Hodgdon and Federal. According to the diagrams, maximum case length is 0.754" for the 9mm Parabellum. There is some differences in the Trim-to Length offered by the various guides, Accurate : 0.744" Hornady : 0.744" Lyman : 0.751" Sierra : 0.750" Speer : 0.744" So, I was really interested in how my 729 Speer cases (now twice-fired, they came from a case of Black Hills Reman ammo I bought years back) would come out. If they were somewhere inbetween sizes, I rounded up or down, depending which was closer. Under 0.745" : 28 With some under the recommended Trim-to 0.744" 0.745" : 71 0.746 : 159 0.747 : 181 0.748 : 154 0.749 : 99 0.750 : 26 0.751 : 11 Yes, I found it interesting.

January 24, 2008, 11:34 PM	#3
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,756	Wow, there's a lot to digest in there! I've got a couple comments. The 9mm is a tapered (however slightly) case. So while a carbide sizing die can run without lube, it works better with it in the case of the 9mm. Also in the .30 M1 Carbine. They look like straight walled cases, but neither are. If you go ahead and resize most any of the other "straight wall" pistol/handgun calibers, you'll find that yeah, you really don't need lube. As for case length, I don't go to great lengths (heh) in any of my handgun calibers. I obviously do in the two rifle calibers for which I load. __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

January 24, 2008, 11:51 PM	#4
jhansman Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2007 Posts: 680	Hey man, I forgive you for getting the Lee kit. In fact, I'll congratulate you, as I have the same gear. No need to explain or apologize. Many, many of us here use Lee equipment with excellent results and no regrets. Your case length data is interesting, but I have never felt the need or desire to trim my handgun cases (.45ACP & .357mag). Perhaps I should do a random measuring? Happy reloading.... __________________ Blessed is the man who has nothing to say, and cannot be compelled to say it.

January 27, 2008, 07:59 PM	#5
ConfuseUs Senior Member Join Date: April 26, 2007 Posts: 461	I just lock my calipers at the max case length in the manual and see if the cases will pass through. The ones that don't pass through or stick some get dropped into a separate pile for trimming. __________________ Overkill is better than underkill.

January 27, 2008, 08:54 PM	#6
Conservadude Member Join Date: December 13, 2004 Location: Knik, Alaska Posts: 65	It's a good idea to lube every 4th or 5th round when full-length resizing straight-walled magnum cases such as the .480 Ruger, .454 Casull, .460S&W, and .500S&W as well. These longer cases can generate extra heat while resizing, carbide or not, and can also sometimes get stuck in the die. Brian __________________ Yes, Samantha, there is a God and the United States is a good country

January 24, 2008, 10:52 PM	#2
rwilson452 Senior Member Join Date: June 10, 2004 Location: Tioga co. PA Posts: 2,647	to answer your question indirectly I don't load 9mm. I do load 45ACP. I don't measure my cases. I just load and go.