Should I stop supporting a LGS

[Metal god]

So a buddy ask if I could help him choose a new longer range target shooting rifle . I said sure and met with him at his house to do some research . Now I shoot with him often as well as shop at LGS and gun show . I have a pretty good Idea as to how he shoots ( kind of a blaster , He will start to shoot slow and calm but often just keeps shooting mag after mag ) ,the ammo he is willing to pay for ( he does not buy high dollar stuff but will sometimes but not much ) , ability to shoot as well as knowing how recoil sensitive he is ( VERY ) . Knowing all of this I had done a little of my own research before going to his house and had a rig in mind ( Savage long range precision in 260 Rem with Vortex scope $1800 total ) I had/have others to suggest but that's the one I will recommend first .

First thing I ask him is what's your budget ? Turns out much less then I thought . 6 or 7 hundred (Rifle only) and he plans to use an OK Bushnell optic he already owns . Well I go ahead and tell him about the Savage but that does not go over well and he wants nothing to do with the 260 Rem . He says the 243 Win is what he has been looking at . I say no problem thinking it's a good cartridge and good ammo is every where . ( just the type of thing he needs ) .

So we start looking online and in that price range and caliber all we really find is Remington 700 heavy barrel in 243 . I kept telling him that he will want a heavy barrel and maybe even a muzzle brake if we can find it . ( VERY recoil sensitive ) He thinks his 357 lever gun with heavy octagon barrel kicks to much . He even complained shooting one of my ARs once . Which is fine I just have to make sure I steer him in the right direction taking all his factors into account . Ok he does not like plastic/synthetic stocks but he says the Rem 700 with synthetic stock will work .

Next day we meet at a LGS and start asking questions about the type of rifle he wants to the owner . We talk about the range he plans to shoot this TARGET shooting rifle ( 300 to 900 yards ) and explain most shooting will be done from a bench or mat prone . I ask the owner if he has a heavy barreled 700 in 243 in stock ? He says no but we have others in 243 .I then asked him to show us any 700 with heavy barrel in a synthetic stock . IH e brings over a Rem 70 ( forget the model ) but for the most part it was what we had been looking at the day before on line . I was thining this will give my buddy a good idea as to what he would get if he were to order one in 243 . First thing my buddy says is I really like wood stocks more . I explain that most Target rifles in his price range will come with a synthetic stock of some type . I also say you can upgrade later if you like .

The gun store owner then asked why 243 and heavy barrel . I mention ammo cost and availability and then I said heavy barrel for accuracy ( oops ) but at the time thought nothing of it . Really at the time I was not remembering everything my buddy and I talked about the day before just knew what we were looking for . First thing out of the owners mouth was you don't need a heavy barrel to shoot accurately and anyone who says so is wrong . ya ya I know . He then says I would not go with a 243 but rather a 260 Rem . He then goes over and brings back one of the most beautiful rifles I've ever seen that just so happen to be right at the price range my buddy told the owner his buget was .

What rifle do you think he suggested my buddy use for long range target shooting from a bench or prone ??? Teka T3 in 260 Rem with beautiful wood stock light thin sporter barrel Really ! but before I could say anything my buddy grabs it and almost immediately says I'll take it No but wait I say you likely will have a harder time finding ammo for this ( at this point I can't really think of all the reasons why this is the wrong gun for the task ). The gun shop owner says no problem I sell more 260 ammo then any other . I always have tons of it . I then look at my friend and he is just sitting there with a HUGE smile on his face . well Ok if this is what you want go for it .

So who should I be upset with The LGS owner for seeing what my buddy would likely buy rather then what he was really asking for . Or my buddy for completely disregarding ALL we talked about the day before and just impulse buying the rifle . I feel it's no different then asking to see some good bear rifles and the store owners says well this 500 S&W revolver will take down a bear and I have tons of ammo for it .

The funny thing is the gun cost $759 and my buddy asked what kinda a deal can you give me ? The store owner with out blinking says I can do $759 . Hmm grumble ok I'll take it lets do some paper work . The the store owner then states there is a new law in CA that requires my buddy passes a gun safety test before buying . It will be an extra cost of $30 . My buddy says I'm not going to spend another 30 bucks as well . What does the store owner do ? shrugs and says OK and puts the rifle back on the shelf . WOW he gave up a $800 sale for $30 . I get charging $30 if that's all the customer wants to do . I get that it will take time for him to do but My buddy can take the test while the owner does the other paper work ( here in CA that's a lot )

Anyways , Should I be upset at all with either ?

[redrick]

I don't see anything wrong , the .260 is a excellent long range caliber , the Tika is a good accurate mid priced rifle , and your friend who was spending the money liked it .

[3kgt2nv]

So what i got out of the story was your buddy wouldnt spend the 30 bucks the LAW required to be able to purchase the gun.

I could understand if nowhere else does this but expecting the lgs owner to violate the new law simply to sell an 800 dollar gun he might make 15% profit on and had to stock for your friend to look at. And expecting a discount is laughable. Im sure you shop at the same grocery store every week. When was the last time you wheeled your cart to the register and asked the cashier what can they do price wise for you.

getting a good deal is awesome i understand. I shop the same lgs for years. If they can they throw me a bone every once and a while. I never ask but i always appreaciate it

Of course you could buy it online pay a transfer fee and then still pay the 30 bucks.

[Metal god]

I agree and is why I told my buddy if that's what you want then go for it .

Do you really see nothing a-miss here . How many long range sporter barreled Teka T3 wood stocked rigs do you see on the line . I get that the gun is accurate . Heck My Ruger American is one of my most accurate rifle with the right ammo . It how ever would be WAY down the list of suggestions of long range bench guns I would recommend .

[Metal god]

I could understand if nowhere else does this but expecting the lgs owner to violate the new law simply to sell an 800 dollar gun he might make 15% profit on and had to stock for your friend to look at.

My point was not to ask the owner to break the law Why would you even think that ?? My point was he could just eat the cost of the test . There is NO law saying he must charge for the test . LGS charge because it takes time for them to give the test . That all could have been done while doing all the other paper work and really would have cost the owner VERY little if anything .

And expecting a discount is laughable. Im sure you shop at the same grocery store every week. When was the last time you wheeled your cart to the register and asked the cashier what can they do price wise for you.

I have never paid sticker price for a firearm . OK maybe once or twice but they always through something in . A mag , case , cleaning kit or Oh I don't know maybe the price of the test

[skywag]

Is it your rifle, or his?

[Metal god]

Is it your rifle, or his?

I assume your saying I should be up set with my friend ??

So a friend knows you're a big time off road nut and asks you for help picking a new 4x4 truck . How ever the dealer talks him into Focus .

No issues there ?

[3kgt2nv]

With guns its always an issue of i want whats in front of me.

As a long range shooter 600-1200 yrds the price range your friend was looking in is not where i would say to look for a rifle.

I would have said drop the range requirement a little to say 500 yrds. Do a 223 chambered cz 527 with a nice factory set trigger and a wood stock.

Beautiful gun shoots amazing ammo is everywhere(except for right now because of xm855). Best part is they are around 450 bucks.

Recoil will be slight and the extra money can be used to buy accessories or extra ammo

Just like a car dealer. The lgs wants to sell instock rifles vs what they dont have. It was more your friend ditching your plans and jumping onto something put in his hands i think.

Take it as a lesson learned and next time he asks for advise just take it with a smile knowing the same thing will happen.

Ive been thru something like this but it was with a family member and their first handgun

[Metal god]

I would have said drop the range requirement a little to say 500 yrds. Do a 223 chambered cz 527 with a nice factory set trigger and a wood stock.

OMG , That just reminded me of something . My buddy has a CZ in 223 . Not sure if it's the 527 though . He bought it at the same gun store . Thing is he told me about it before he bought and that he wanted a lighter recoiling target rifle . I told him make sure he gets the one with the 1-9 twist rather then the 1-12 twist so he can use heavier bullets . He came home with the 1-12 . Looking back I'd bet dollars to donuts the store owner did not have the 1-9 in stock and just said the 1-12 will work just fine .

So it seems this has happened to me before with all the same players . Shame on me .

[olddav]

Your assuming that he knew what he wanted when he asked you for help. In addition people will ask for advice/opinion and then proceed to tell you they "I don't think that's right". That's when you say "Ok" and move on to something else. Don't get mad at anyone! Not worth the effort or time, besides no will understand why your upset with them anyway.

[4runnerman]

Metal- I agree with you. You tried to help him get the rifle he would need for the task he wants to do. The Tika will work fine as long as he never enters comp with it. He will be waiting for barrel to cool most of his time. Sounds like if he is that recoil sensative-Maybe a 22 would be in line. You tried your hardest to steer him right and thats all you can do. I can not say that I am not a impulse buyer, but never when it comes to a big investment like a rifle. The tika( if it is a lite) is going to be a bad one for recoil. He has a 223, On a nice day ( as you already know ) the 223 is real sweet out to 600 yards or more. I think you said his was a 1-12. Well, maybe he can still get up to a 60gn or more to work for him..

[Sevens]

What is the big deal?! He asked for your advice and took a little, a lot, maybe some or none at all. His cash, not yours.

Your role was well defined and you did your part to the best of your ability. Would you be as cranked off if he decided to buy new golf clubs after your advice?

Next time, charge for your advice and ya can't lose.

[dakota.potts]

The gun store owner was doing his job as a salesman to sell a gun the customer would be happy with.

If I had the two guys you described come into my store and the buddy kept trying to push a gun that the buyer obviously didn't want, I would do exactly what the salesman did and keep showing the intended purchaser the types of guns that he actually wanted.

You may be right about what a good, accurate long range gun will be, but it sounds like the Tikka is exactly what your friend wanted at the minute and both were happy with the conclusion reached. Sometimes people don't want smart, they want what makes them happy, and the Tikka sounds like it made your friend happy.

As far as expecting the owner to eat $30 and whatever time it takes to administer the test, that's his choice. Maybe it was a bargaining tactic. As your friend thinks more and more about the gun, maybe he decides he still wants it anyways and the $30 test is reasonable. Not a practice I would necessarily condone, but I also don't expect a business owner to give up $30 in business when they're likely not making huge margins on the firearm anyways.

[Nathan]

Buddy's usually seek advice.....and then it is up to them what they do with it. I have a similar experience. You have to let them figure it out.

The LGS was doing what they do...they sell what they have in stock. He could see flashy was going to sell to your buddy.

When you guys get in the field, there will be some headaches, but just work through them.

In the end, it will turn out right.....just some people need to buy 2 guns to get 1.

I don't know CA, but often $30 is a sizable chunk of their profit.

[Metal god]

So it seems you all think I should get over my frustration at both my friend and the store owner . That is what I shall do or at least try . This seems to be harder said then done though . I assume thats because it's a friend I care about so there are deeper feelings involved then just an acquaintance that did not listen or stick to the plan .

As for the store owner , The fact I don't do a lot of my gun shopping there . It should not be a big issue . I do get what and why he did it . It just bugs me .

Thanks metal

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by Metal God

So it seems you all think I should get over my frustration at both my friend and the store owner

Yep. Life's too short to get cranked up over buddies who are idiots.

The lesson for you is to NOT go to the gun store with your buddy. Ever hear the expression, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."? Well, you now have two (at least) instances when your friend has asked you for advice, you have given him considered advice, and he has ignored it. This should the last time.

If there's a next time, give him a couple of suggestions and let him go to the gun shop by himself.

[AirForceShooter]

Your buddy is an idiot

The LGS didn't do anything wrong

AFS

[AllenJ]

Metal God, I feel your pain as I've been through similar situations. Move on and remember the lesson that has been learned, your friend does not listen. I have friends like that too, as I'm sure most people do, and they're still my friends I just don't waste a lot of time giving them advice when they seek it.

[buck460XVR]

Your buddy is an idiot

The LGS didn't do anything wrong

AFS

Kinda where I'm at with this. I'm not familiar with what the [California] law dictates as a gun safety check, but I assume it takes a little time and paperwork. Similar to a background check and transfer. Your buddy already agreed to the price of the gun but backed down because of the $30 test fee. He found the gun he really wanted and from my little bit of research, at a very good price. Even with the $30 fee the OTD price for your friend is much less than buying the same gun online and paying for a transfer at a local LGS.

I've found that while I will suggest and recommend certain firearms and calibers to friends and relatives, when it comes down to the purchase, unless I am buying it as a gift from me to them, I walk away, let them decide if it's the gun for them. While I will advise them if the price they are quoted is fair or not, I do not set the boundaries of what they are willing to pay. I would have told your firend that even at $789, it was a good rifle at a good price. Odds are he won't see it any better anywhere else in [California].

[HiBC]

Control is best excersized on the self.

You can control your disappointments by controlling your expectations.

And,yes,let it go.

Keep you buddy,keep the gunstore,and what have you lost?

If you push your advice,and your buddy buys the gun,forever he will blame you for any buyers remorse.

If you let go,let him make his own choices,and then he is happy,shrug,and enjoy.If he is unhappy with his choice,you gain credibility.

You can't go wrong letting him make his own choice.....and respecting it.

[Skans]

It's your friend's call - no skin off the OP's back. I don't get worked up about what other folks do, unless it somehow impacts what I want to buy. He could have walked away over spending another $5, although if he did that, I wouldn't invest much time trying to help the guy again.

[Double Naught Spy]

The funny thing is the gun cost $759 and my buddy asked what kinda a deal can you give me ? The store owner with out blinking says I can do $759 . Hmm grumble ok I'll take it lets do some paper work . The the store owner then states there is a new law in CA that requires my buddy passes a gun safety test before buying . It will be an extra cost of $30 . My buddy says I'm not going to spend another 30 bucks as well . What does the store owner do ? shrugs and says OK and puts the rifle back on the shelf . WOW he gave up a $800 sale for $30.

It is an $800 sale. It isn't $800 of profit. He gave your buddy the best deal and your buddy agreed to it. The deal was for the rifle. Why should he lose and additional $30 of profit after your buddy agreed to the price?

[JERRYS.]

shouldn't be upset with anyone. not your store, not your rifle, not your money.

your friend made his own decision, let him be.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by HiBC

Control is best excersized on the self.

You can control your disappointments by controlling your expectations.

Correct, Grasshopper.

Or, as a Zen teacher explained it to a class I attended, "What is, is. It is your resistance to what is that is the source of your unhappiness."

[eastbank]

where can i buy a cz 527 in .223 for around 450.00? i will take two. eastbank.