45 Auto reloads

cervri · September 3, 2016, 03:59 PM

Getting frustrated with reloads for Smith & Wesson Shield 45 Auto...
Loading up some 200 gr swc for plinking but the bolt/slide will not close far enough to fire.. Rounds fit in sizing gauge fine. At least it looks like it to me..Pictures attached..

Martys · September 3, 2016, 04:06 PM

What's your OAL? You could be loading them to long. try for 1.225

cervri · September 3, 2016, 04:14 PM

I will have to go back and check, Just measured 30 min ago,,but being old has it disadvantages...from what memory that i do have it was a couple of thousands below max...

1.263-1.273

mikld · September 3, 2016, 04:44 PM

Take the barrel out of your gun and use that for a "gauge"; the "PlunkTest. Determine what is hitting first, case, bullet ogive, bullet shoulder? Try marking the bullet w/a marking pen, insert into barrel, remove and check where marks are rubbed off the cartridge/bullet to see where it is hitting/stopping. From there you can determine a solution...

(I load ammo for a good fit for my gun, not necessarily for what the book says the OAL should be).

Nick_C_S · September 3, 2016, 05:44 PM

Quote:

it was a couple of thousands below max...

1.263-1.273

SAAMI max OAL and max OAL for a 200 LSWC (your basic H & G 68 profile, for clarity, this very common design: http://missouribullet.com/details.ph...y=13&keywords=) are most definitely two different things. For 200gn LSWC (or plated, for that matter) I load mine to 1.240 +.000/-.005. At 1.240, my bullets are just starting to hit the grooves in my Colt 1911 - the shortest chamber of my three 1911's.

I strongly suspect your OAL is too long for that bullet. Unfortunately, your case gauge pics tell me nothing. For starters, the only "case gauge" worth using is the barrel itself from the gun that will be shooting them. What I'd really like to see is a pic of the bullet; specifically, a good pic of how much shoulder is protruding above the case mouth.

Mike38 · September 3, 2016, 05:52 PM

I have a M1911 with a Kart barrel that has a short chamber. To get reliable feed, I load 200 LSWC to 1.220 OAL. You may have a short chamber also.

Nick_C_S · September 3, 2016, 05:59 PM

Here's a pic of mine. It measures 1.245" - shame on me, as that's actually .005" over spec for me. Not sure how I did that; anyway, I've built in some wiggle room in my spec. And, I've shot from this batch without problem. I would expect however, if they were any longer, to start running into not going into battery issues.

Longshot4 · September 3, 2016, 08:48 PM

I am not Fermilure with the shield since I shoot a Colt 1991-80. Although I had a problem with the last round from the clip hanging up. I learned that was do to the way the clip released the round at a nose lower angle. The COAL was using was 1.235.

I came across a Midway 45 ACP LoadMAP loading book that gave the COAL of 1.275 for Barnes, Hornady, Nosler, Remington, Sierra, Speer and Winchester bullets. All types of bullet weights and designs were used on the book.

When I changed to COAL of 1.275 I never had another issue.

cervri · September 4, 2016, 01:48 AM

Thank you for all the replays, I will try to get out and try some of theses things today..

BillM · September 4, 2016, 07:43 AM

I've seen several .45's that are throated so short that they will tolerate
no full diameter lead beyond the case mouth. Most case lead bullets
have a full diameter forward driving band.

Take one of your rounds that won't go into battery, tap the back
of the slide a couple of times and eject. Do you see marks from
the rifling on that forward band?

cervri · September 4, 2016, 08:52 AM

These are the slugs I am using:
45 Auto 200 gr SWC, .45 ACP 200 gr SWC, 45 Caliber 200 gr SWC

Technical Information:

.452
200 grain
Hard Cast BHN 16
Bevel Base
Old School Design
They are from Stateline.

Never noticed that they ere .452 Dia, but seems that I remember reading somewhere to use .451....Let me know....

Hare are 2 pictures with the same swc with oal of 1.217 and it will not go to battery.

cervri · September 4, 2016, 08:57 AM

Going to pull the bullets on these and start over...

g.willikers · September 4, 2016, 09:30 AM

What was that thing in your first picture?
Oh, never mind, got worried there for a sec.
Your reloads look pretty good to me, but I'm not familiar with that firearm.
They would work just fine in mine.
It depends on the chamber of each and every barrel.
The shape of the nose of those swcs does offer a lot of leeway, too.

cervri · September 4, 2016, 10:06 AM

Okay I think I found the problem. I am having a slight bit of leg shaving. I will open up the Bell just a little bit more and try it again

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

cervri · September 4, 2016, 10:07 AM

Lead not leg

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

mikld · September 5, 2016, 05:51 PM

What is "old school design"? I use a lot of 200 gr SWC H&G 68 clone with no problems, I just "plunk test" them, and adjust dies if necessary...

rightside · September 7, 2016, 08:56 PM

Cervi,
I had the same problem. I bought the .452 cast bullets and they didn't chamber or fire well. Didn't slug the barrel before buying.Since I had 500, I bought the lee .451 bullet sizing die, ran all my .452 cast bullets thru it and that solved all my problems.

https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/prod...34307900618.do

September 3, 2016, 04:14 PM	#3
cervri Member Join Date: March 24, 2016 Location: Deming NM Posts: 75	I will have to go back and check, Just measured 30 min ago,,but being old has it disadvantages...from what memory that i do have it was a couple of thousands below max... 1.263-1.273 Last edited by cervri; September 3, 2016 at 04:21 PM.

September 3, 2016, 04:44 PM	#4
mikld Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2009 Location: Southern Oregon! Posts: 2,891	Take the barrel out of your gun and use that for a "gauge"; the "PlunkTest. Determine what is hitting first, case, bullet ogive, bullet shoulder? Try marking the bullet w/a marking pen, insert into barrel, remove and check where marks are rubbed off the cartridge/bullet to see where it is hitting/stopping. From there you can determine a solution... (I load ammo for a good fit for my gun, not necessarily for what the book says the OAL should be). __________________ My Anchor is holding fast! I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...

September 3, 2016, 05:59 PM	#7
Nick_C_S Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2013 Location: Idaho Posts: 5,530	200 LSWC Pic Here's a pic of mine. It measures 1.245" - shame on me, as that's actually .005" over spec for me. Not sure how I did that; anyway, I've built in some wiggle room in my spec. And, I've shot from this batch without problem. I would expect however, if they were any longer, to start running into not going into battery issues. __________________ Gun control laws benefit only criminals and politicians - but then, I repeat myself. Life Member, National Rifle Association

September 4, 2016, 09:30 AM	#13
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	What was that thing in your first picture? Oh, never mind, got worried there for a sec. Your reloads look pretty good to me, but I'm not familiar with that firearm. They would work just fine in mine. It depends on the chamber of each and every barrel. The shape of the nose of those swcs does offer a lot of leeway, too. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

September 5, 2016, 05:51 PM	#16
mikld Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2009 Location: Southern Oregon! Posts: 2,891	What is "old school design"? I use a lot of 200 gr SWC H&G 68 clone with no problems, I just "plunk test" them, and adjust dies if necessary... __________________ My Anchor is holding fast! I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...

September 3, 2016, 04:06 PM	#2
Martys Member Join Date: January 19, 2013 Posts: 62	What's your OAL? You could be loading them to long. try for 1.225

September 3, 2016, 05:52 PM	#6
Mike38 Senior Member Join Date: December 28, 2009 Location: North Central Illinois Posts: 2,713	I have a M1911 with a Kart barrel that has a short chamber. To get reliable feed, I load 200 LSWC to 1.220 OAL. You may have a short chamber also.

September 3, 2016, 08:48 PM	#8
Longshot4 Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2014 Posts: 868	I am not Fermilure with the shield since I shoot a Colt 1991-80. Although I had a problem with the last round from the clip hanging up. I learned that was do to the way the clip released the round at a nose lower angle. The COAL was using was 1.235. I came across a Midway 45 ACP LoadMAP loading book that gave the COAL of 1.275 for Barnes, Hornady, Nosler, Remington, Sierra, Speer and Winchester bullets. All types of bullet weights and designs were used on the book. When I changed to COAL of 1.275 I never had another issue.

September 4, 2016, 01:48 AM	#9
cervri Member Join Date: March 24, 2016 Location: Deming NM Posts: 75	Thank you for all the replays, I will try to get out and try some of theses things today..

September 4, 2016, 07:43 AM	#10
BillM Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2009 Location: Amity Oregon Posts: 793	I've seen several .45's that are throated so short that they will tolerate no full diameter lead beyond the case mouth. Most case lead bullets have a full diameter forward driving band. Take one of your rounds that won't go into battery, tap the back of the slide a couple of times and eject. Do you see marks from the rifling on that forward band?

September 4, 2016, 08:57 AM	#12
cervri Member Join Date: March 24, 2016 Location: Deming NM Posts: 75	Going to pull the bullets on these and start over...

September 4, 2016, 10:06 AM	#14
cervri Member Join Date: March 24, 2016 Location: Deming NM Posts: 75	Okay I think I found the problem. I am having a slight bit of leg shaving. I will open up the Bell just a little bit more and try it again Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

September 4, 2016, 10:07 AM	#15
cervri Member Join Date: March 24, 2016 Location: Deming NM Posts: 75	Lead not leg Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

September 7, 2016, 08:56 PM	#17
rightside Senior Member Join Date: February 4, 2012 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 419	Cervi, I had the same problem. I bought the .452 cast bullets and they didn't chamber or fire well. Didn't slug the barrel before buying.Since I had 500, I bought the lee .451 bullet sizing die, ran all my .452 cast bullets thru it and that solved all my problems. https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/prod...34307900618.do