11-87 modifications

Kingcreek · February 13, 2001, 11:45 PM

I won a raffle and got a new Rem 11-87 20g Upland Special.
It should be a nice handling shotgun. 23" barrel and walnut straight stock. Its real pretty too except the lawyer trigger (locking safety) looks like cheap crap.
I would like to get this setup for my wife for hunting. She is very small and requires a LOP of about 13.25" (she currently shoots a Browning Micro Lightning) and she doesn't care for the straight "english" stock since she is used to a pistol grip stock.
I would like to keep the original stock for my occaisional use and get a cut-down pistol grip walnut stock for my wife to use. I would also like to get an older style trigger group without the cheap guard and locking safety.
Does anybody have any suggestions or thoughts? I'll call Remington sometime in the next couple days and see what they say. I'm also gonna tell them I have ~30 shotguns and never needed a cheapass locking safety!

Dave McC · February 14, 2001, 06:44 AM

You probably know this, but....

Shortening the stock is only part of fit. Pitch and a touch of toe out, drop at comb,etc are also important.

And that should be a terrific shotgun for anyone.

BTW, when you talk to Remington, mention that you won it and would never buy a new Remington product, due to the PC and costcutting changes they've made recently.

old hawk · February 14, 2001, 07:52 AM

yes i do, on the pc style safety what you can do is get an older safety un pc and just take the group out and change it,you will have to get the ball and spring also or you can chuck the new pc plunger in a drill and round the oval face on the tip and install the older safety no problems.its the same as on an 870.see my page on the 870 with pics to help.
http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/2997/870.html

Dave McC · February 14, 2001, 08:23 AM

Old Hawk, this might be the place to say this...

Your site is a great resource for 870 owner/operators. Thanks from all of us...

Kingcreek · February 14, 2001, 09:10 AM

Thanks for the advice!
I bookmarked old hawk's web page- great info. If Rem won't sell me an old style trigger group w/safety I'm not sure how to locate one.
I should be able to get a stock from Rem (11-87 premier?) and cut it down myself, fitting it close to her micro lightning dimensions.
For myself, I like the way the gun is stocked now with the straight english style stock. I haven't shot it yet but I'll get back to y'all with a report.

Intel6 · February 14, 2001, 10:09 AM

Kingcreek,

I also like the short barreled upland specials but, like your wife, I can't stand the straight english stocks.
I would look at Brownell's for the stock. They carry the complete line of Remington parts including stocks and you should be able to find what you are looking for.

Good Luck

Dave McC · February 14, 2001, 11:38 AM

You're very welcome, Kingcreek. If she shoots that Micro well, duplicating the dimensions should get you pretty close.I suggest patterning it,just to be sure....

Intel, I like a straight hand stock, but not enough to alter my shotguns. It requires little adjustment, but like any change in a stock, a new one should be shot exclusively for a while to get the "Chops" grooved in.

Been looking for a straight hand stock for the 20 ga 870 I got for the kids, at my proper length, for a quail gun. I'd probably hollow out the stock a bit to move the balance point forward.

Romulus · February 14, 2001, 12:46 PM

Dave McC, would a thumbhole qualify as a straight hand stock? Or is a straight pistolgrip the only thing... Thinking about the Boyd stocks, now...

old hawk · February 14, 2001, 03:39 PM

thanx guys im gettin all mushy n stuff now lol , now down to biz, to get the safety i know of a shop in norway maine that has them i at 6 bucks a shot, go to the remington site and then look up parts dealers to find him, i cant remember the name at the moment tho for you, BUT when i called last month or 2 ago he had plenty in stock.thanx again for the comments guys, the rem line of shotguns are a great piece of machinery. ill be putting some $$ down the first of the month for a 20 gauge 870 for mamasan,price is right at 115$ too in mint shape but i have ta pick up a ruger pistol off layaway first,ill be chopping the stock short too and adding in a cushy recoil pad and also another one that will be shaved up and sammiched in between,mama had some surgery on the shoulder in 4 spots so im making extra sure the recoil will be well done over for her so it wont reinjure her shoulder.after that i can matchstick and shave a side of the join at the reciever to make it just right.kinda hard for a 5'4" woman to get a good fit nowadays off the shelf.

Dave McC · February 15, 2001, 08:02 AM

Nope, Romulus,think of a Brit Game gun. That's a straight hand or English style stock.

Thumbholes leave me kinda unenthused on both sporting and serious shotguns. At one point long ago, I shot a custom Mauser rifle in 240 Gibbs with one extensively. On slow fire, long range rifles they have no downside I see, but shotgun shooting is oft a fast situation,and they take a bit longer to get into and out of.

In effect, a thumbhole is a full stock w/ PG. If it works for you, fine, but I've doubts about it working as well as the standard style. I'm not in the minority,either, on this.

Romulus · February 15, 2001, 12:49 PM

Brain flatulence...I meant to ask about pistol grip socks vs. thumbhole stocks. The intended question was: "if the pistol grip is indeed superior to a straight stock, would a thumbhole be as good as a PG?"

I am used to straight stocks. I can see PG stocks having a purpose, but for HD, why wouldn't a straight stock do as well? And they're purtier...

Dave McC · February 16, 2001, 06:34 AM

No reason, just custom. We tend to use that which has worked for us in the past,and few bird shooters live in high crime areas.

Romulus · February 16, 2001, 12:38 PM

More flatus from my head...a straight stock, of course! England, and Gents out for a bird shoot!

Sorry, Dave. I thought "pistol grip" always referred to the "AR style military looking thing." I hope I got it now, even a "standard" American stock has a "pistol grip," that part, normally integral to the stock, which however were it to be separate would look like a Pachmayr Vindicator...

So finally I can pose the right question: For HD, does the AR style pistol grip stock (like the kind popularized by Benelli on SGs) truly offer greater advantages over a Remington factory stock? If yes, would a thumbhole be as good as the AR style stock?

By now I must have exhausted your patience...

Dave McC · February 16, 2001, 05:23 PM

Romulus, I drive the DC beltway at rush hour frequently. Patience is something I practice(G).

While I've some experience with military style stocks on rifles,I've relatively little on shotguns(except for those $%^& folders). I see no great advantage or drawback to them.

IMO, the standard stock is probably the best approach in this case...

Romulus · February 16, 2001, 11:56 PM

I was dearly hoping for that answer, Dave. Being an aesthete at heart, I really prefer the old fashioned "standard" grip. Thank you.

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February 13, 2001, 11:45 PM	#1
Kingcreek Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: rural Illinois Posts: 590	I won a raffle and got a new Rem 11-87 20g Upland Special. It should be a nice handling shotgun. 23" barrel and walnut straight stock. Its real pretty too except the lawyer trigger (locking safety) looks like cheap crap. I would like to get this setup for my wife for hunting. She is very small and requires a LOP of about 13.25" (she currently shoots a Browning Micro Lightning) and she doesn't care for the straight "english" stock since she is used to a pistol grip stock. I would like to keep the original stock for my occaisional use and get a cut-down pistol grip walnut stock for my wife to use. I would also like to get an older style trigger group without the cheap guard and locking safety. Does anybody have any suggestions or thoughts? I'll call Remington sometime in the next couple days and see what they say. I'm also gonna tell them I have ~30 shotguns and never needed a cheapass locking safety!

February 14, 2001, 06:44 AM	#2
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	You probably know this, but.... Shortening the stock is only part of fit. Pitch and a touch of toe out, drop at comb,etc are also important. And that should be a terrific shotgun for anyone. BTW, when you talk to Remington, mention that you won it and would never buy a new Remington product, due to the PC and costcutting changes they've made recently.

February 14, 2001, 07:52 AM	#3
old hawk Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2000 Location: somewhere,maine. Posts: 175	yes i do, on the pc style safety what you can do is get an older safety un pc and just take the group out and change it,you will have to get the ball and spring also or you can chuck the new pc plunger in a drill and round the oval face on the tip and install the older safety no problems.its the same as on an 870.see my page on the 870 with pics to help. http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/2997/870.html

February 14, 2001, 08:23 AM	#4
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Old Hawk, this might be the place to say this... Your site is a great resource for 870 owner/operators. Thanks from all of us...

February 14, 2001, 09:10 AM	#5
Kingcreek Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 1999 Location: rural Illinois Posts: 590	Thanks for the advice! I bookmarked old hawk's web page- great info. If Rem won't sell me an old style trigger group w/safety I'm not sure how to locate one. I should be able to get a stock from Rem (11-87 premier?) and cut it down myself, fitting it close to her micro lightning dimensions. For myself, I like the way the gun is stocked now with the straight english style stock. I haven't shot it yet but I'll get back to y'all with a report.

February 14, 2001, 10:09 AM	#6
Intel6 Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 2000 Posts: 425	Kingcreek, I also like the short barreled upland specials but, like your wife, I can't stand the straight english stocks. I would look at Brownell's for the stock. They carry the complete line of Remington parts including stocks and you should be able to find what you are looking for. Good Luck

February 14, 2001, 11:38 AM	#7
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	You're very welcome, Kingcreek. If she shoots that Micro well, duplicating the dimensions should get you pretty close.I suggest patterning it,just to be sure.... Intel, I like a straight hand stock, but not enough to alter my shotguns. It requires little adjustment, but like any change in a stock, a new one should be shot exclusively for a while to get the "Chops" grooved in. Been looking for a straight hand stock for the 20 ga 870 I got for the kids, at my proper length, for a quail gun. I'd probably hollow out the stock a bit to move the balance point forward.

February 14, 2001, 12:46 PM	#8
Romulus Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2001 Location: Kettle Moraine country Posts: 897	Dave McC, would a thumbhole qualify as a straight hand stock? Or is a straight pistolgrip the only thing... Thinking about the Boyd stocks, now...

February 14, 2001, 03:39 PM	#9
old hawk Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2000 Location: somewhere,maine. Posts: 175	thanx guys im gettin all mushy n stuff now lol , now down to biz, to get the safety i know of a shop in norway maine that has them i at 6 bucks a shot, go to the remington site and then look up parts dealers to find him, i cant remember the name at the moment tho for you, BUT when i called last month or 2 ago he had plenty in stock.thanx again for the comments guys, the rem line of shotguns are a great piece of machinery. ill be putting some $$ down the first of the month for a 20 gauge 870 for mamasan,price is right at 115$ too in mint shape but i have ta pick up a ruger pistol off layaway first,ill be chopping the stock short too and adding in a cushy recoil pad and also another one that will be shaved up and sammiched in between,mama had some surgery on the shoulder in 4 spots so im making extra sure the recoil will be well done over for her so it wont reinjure her shoulder.after that i can matchstick and shave a side of the join at the reciever to make it just right.kinda hard for a 5'4" woman to get a good fit nowadays off the shelf.

February 15, 2001, 08:02 AM	#10
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Nope, Romulus,think of a Brit Game gun. That's a straight hand or English style stock. Thumbholes leave me kinda unenthused on both sporting and serious shotguns. At one point long ago, I shot a custom Mauser rifle in 240 Gibbs with one extensively. On slow fire, long range rifles they have no downside I see, but shotgun shooting is oft a fast situation,and they take a bit longer to get into and out of. In effect, a thumbhole is a full stock w/ PG. If it works for you, fine, but I've doubts about it working as well as the standard style. I'm not in the minority,either, on this.

February 15, 2001, 12:49 PM	#11
Romulus Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2001 Location: Kettle Moraine country Posts: 897	Brain flatulence...I meant to ask about pistol grip socks vs. thumbhole stocks. The intended question was: "if the pistol grip is indeed superior to a straight stock, would a thumbhole be as good as a PG?" I am used to straight stocks. I can see PG stocks having a purpose, but for HD, why wouldn't a straight stock do as well? And they're purtier...

February 16, 2001, 06:34 AM	#12
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	No reason, just custom. We tend to use that which has worked for us in the past,and few bird shooters live in high crime areas.

February 16, 2001, 12:38 PM	#13
Romulus Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2001 Location: Kettle Moraine country Posts: 897	More flatus from my head...a straight stock, of course! England, and Gents out for a bird shoot! Sorry, Dave. I thought "pistol grip" always referred to the "AR style military looking thing." I hope I got it now, even a "standard" American stock has a "pistol grip," that part, normally integral to the stock, which however were it to be separate would look like a Pachmayr Vindicator... So finally I can pose the right question: For HD, does the AR style pistol grip stock (like the kind popularized by Benelli on SGs) truly offer greater advantages over a Remington factory stock? If yes, would a thumbhole be as good as the AR style stock? By now I must have exhausted your patience...

February 16, 2001, 05:23 PM	#14
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Romulus, I drive the DC beltway at rush hour frequently. Patience is something I practice(G). While I've some experience with military style stocks on rifles,I've relatively little on shotguns(except for those $%^& folders). I see no great advantage or drawback to them. IMO, the standard stock is probably the best approach in this case...

February 16, 2001, 11:56 PM	#15
Romulus Senior Member Join Date: January 18, 2001 Location: Kettle Moraine country Posts: 897	I was dearly hoping for that answer, Dave. Being an aesthete at heart, I really prefer the old fashioned "standard" grip. Thank you.