M1 Garand Questions

[SC4006]

So just recently I made the decision to join the Army National Guard, didn't take too long to make that decision since its something I've wanted to do for awhile. Well just now I came to the realization that being in the military alone would qualify me to buy an M1 Garand from the CMP. So now I've decided that once I've officially joined and gone through basic training and all that, I would send in an order for a Garand as kind of a little reward to myself for joining .

NOW, that I've gotten all that out of the way, here is my question. I know the Garand is "sensitive" about the 30-06 ammo you put through it, and I know you can buy ammo made specifically made for it... But what if I want to shoot regular factory ammo through it? I've heard that you can buy adjustable gas plugs for it, is that all you need in order to shoot factory ammo? I've also heard that its best to only use 150 grain bullets, is this true?

Also, when you actually receive it, is it going to have cosmoline all over it like a mosin nagant?

I'll probably have more questions down the road when I actually receive the thing, but that is all for now.

[hodaka]

Buying a Garand is a great idea! You can buy military surplus ammo that the CMP sells and use it. You can also buy an adjustable gas plug and have the capability to use any commercial reload. I reload for mine and use 150, 155, 165, and 175 bullets. It shoots them all well. Mine came from the CMP very clean. The CMP has a forum which can be very helpful.

[kraigwy]

I never got a rifle from the CMP that was all gummed up with cosmoline but you should take it a part and clean and lube it anyway. No big deal and it will show you the workings of the Garand.

To much is made of the ammo for the Garand. Just use med burning powder or get the surplus ammo from the CMP.

Congrats on joining the Guard. You'll enjoy it, I have 19 years with the Alaska National Guard, my only regrets is getting out when I did. Though I did retire (had 25 years between the Guard, RA and Reserve) I still wish I stayed.

[mehavey]

But what if I want to shoot regular factory ammo through it? I've heard that you can buy adjustable gas plugs...

Yes. See HERE

I've also heard that its best to only use 150 grain bullets, is this true?

No. I shoot up to 175gr MatchKings, loaded to 2,550-2,600fps all the time (using mid-burn speed powders). The military's MATCH AMMO was even hotter. Today's commercial Garand-Qual'd Match ammo uses 168 grain Match Kings from HORNADY and others.

Also, when you actually receive it, is it going to have cosmoline all over it like a mosin nagant?

Not if from CMP. Still it's a good ideas to diassemble/wipe everything down.

[P5 Guy]

The CG/SA I bought some years ago was a little sticky but cleaned up quick. The stock still bleeds a little on hot days at the range.
The other DCM/CMP rifles were pretty clean. M1903A3 SG/RA and M1 Rifle SG/SA. As advised above take the rifle down to get familiar with it and give a proper greasing. When the CMP had their volunteer program in Anniston rifles got cleaned, inspected, and tested. I do not think they have done that for quite awhile.

[stu925]

Just got mine yesterday and I've got to say that it was the cleanest surplus rifle I've ever dealt with. No cosmoline anywhere. I tore it down last night and was very impressed. As for ammo, I ordered mine with 200rds of Greek M2 ball ammo. I plan to reload that brass once it's all been shot up. I only plan to load target ammo for the rifle since I have no plans to use it for hunting. If I were going to shoot other ammo through it I'd probably buy an adjustable gas plug for it.

Stu

[Bart B.]

Mehavey, that velocity printed on that M72 match ammo box is what's spec'd at 26 yards; 78 feet. And with peak pressure averaging 50,000 CUP. Not hot at all.

That ammo from Hornady probably has a non-canistered powder. A 168 gr A-MAX™ bullet at 2,710 fps from a Garand barrel, even a new one, will be traveling about 2640 fps 26 yards downrange.

[SC4006]

Alright thanks guys, you answered my questions perfectly.

Congrats on joining the Guard. You'll enjoy it, I have 19 years with the Alaska National Guard, my only regrets is getting out when I did. Though I did retire (had 25 years between the Guard, RA and Reserve) I still wish I stayed.

Thank you for your service kraigwy. I'll be committing to 6 years active and 2 inactive, but I think I'll be staying in longer than that. I can't wait to join, I'll be shipping out to basic in about a month.

[1Hobie]

You'll enjoy the gun. I bought one from the CMP and was (am) very pleased with it.
All the previous provide solid advice. I use the gas plug in the linked previous and like ability to safely use commercial ammo. I use it in the single shot mode and brass doesn't go into the next lane.
A word of caution for you about M1 thumb. It can happen but if you pay attention, the bolt will come forward when you load it but it should stop it's forward motion when it begins to strip the top round. You then bump the bolt forward to complete the cycle and off you go.
However, a friend of a friend of my 2'nd cousingot his thumb caught in the action when he had it on the bench rest to service it. The bolt was back and the DA accidently bumped the follower the bolt slams home with authority believe me....er....DA and it basically captured his thumb on his right hand. So there I...er.. DA was facing backward trying to pull back the bolt with his left hand. Awkward to say the least. Lost the thumbnail.
Enjoy your upcoming purchase!

Hobie also known as DA

[tahunua001]

So just recently I made the decision to join the Army National Guard, didn't take too long to make that decision since its something I've wanted to do for awhile. Well just now I came to the realization that being in the military alone would qualify me to buy an M1 Garand from the CMP. So now I've decided that once I've officially joined and gone through basic training and all that, I would send in an order for a Garand as kind of a little reward to myself for joining .

congratulations and good luck. thanks for serving. however being in the military alone still does not qualify you to buy a M1 from CMP. it makes the process a lot easier as they waive a certain portion of the prerequisites. normally you have to shoot a qualification type battery with a CMP certified person witnessing and signing off on it in order to buy from CMP. proof of military service waives that portion as all branches give some degree of firearms training and expect you to be proficient in those weapons. however you still must be a member of a CMP affiliated firearms club and must show proof of membership to CMP before buying along with proof of US citizenship. CMP is a lot more complicated than most people let on.

NOW, that I've gotten all that out of the way, here is my question. I know the Garand is "sensitive" about the 30-06 ammo you put through it, and I know you can buy ammo made specifically made for it... But what if I want to shoot regular factory ammo through it? I've heard that you can buy adjustable gas plugs for it, is that all you need in order to shoot factory ammo? I've also heard that its best to only use 150 grain bullets, is this true?

ok first of all, the adjustable gas block does fix everything, I've never used one but from what I've heard it's a pretty easy install. however all the bullocks about bullet weight is just that, bullocks. the thing that damages the op rod is the burn rate of the powder. not all gun powder burns at the same rate. a slower burning powder hits it's pressure apex further down the barrel and closer to the gas port which is what damages your op rod. I can shoot 220 grain bullets out of an M1 if I want but as long as I am using the proper powder then I will never see ill effects but 150grs will still damage it if I am using the wrong powder type.

Also, when you actually receive it, is it going to have cosmoline all over it like a mosin nagant?

they can have some cosmoline but it's a different kind and not nearly as much. it's more of a thin sheet of dried aresolized oil. comes off easily enough with CLP.

[Bacteriophage]

I saw a machining or gunsmithing company a while back that converted a Garand to shoot .458 Win Mag. If it can do that, it can handle any .30-06 load within reason with the right adjustments.

Maybe it's my nature because I like to solve problems, but what I'd probably do is find the best load in terms of price/accuracy/whatever for what I wanted to do (hunting, target shooting, whatever), and if it didn't function reliably enough, then I'd look into making it work. I get that not everyone would want to do it this way, though.

[SHE3PDOG]

CMP's website says that being in the military waives both the club membership requirement and the marksmanship activity requirement.

[tahunua001]

CMP's website says that being in the military waives both the club membership requirement and the marksmanship activity requirement.

this is a damned if you do damned if you don't type deal. Active service counts as club membership however there is only one form of proof that you are active duty that I can think of and that's your military ID which is now against the law to make a photo copy of. so really, unless you break the law by scanning your ID, you still have to get membership somewhere else.

[gdvan01]

Garand Gear has a ported gas screw:

http://www.garandgear.com/index.php?...arand&catid=39

[SC4006]

Thanks for that link gdvan01, interesting stuff.

As far as the copying of a Military I.D., maybe since the CMP is a government run organization it is legal to use a copy of it only to send to them?

[tahunua001]

As far as the copying of a Military I.D., maybe since the CMP is a government run organization it is legal to use a copy of it only to send to them?

CMP is not government run, it's government chartered which means it's completely civilian company that exists only as long as the government decides to keep giving them free surplus. either way, law enforcement or official military purposes are the only exception to allowing copies of your ID, getting busted down a paygrade and getting hit with 45/45 just so you can get an M1 isn't exactly what I would call a fair trade.

[SC4006]

CMP is not government run, it's government chartered which means it's completely civilian company that exists only as long as the government decides to keep giving them free surplus. either way, law enforcement or official military purposes are the only exception to allowing copies of your ID, getting busted down a paygrade and getting hit with 45/45 just so you can get an M1 isn't exactly what I would call a fair trade.

Oh I didn't know that they were government chartered. I'll certainly keep this in mind, I do plan on joining a CMP certified club sometime anyways, whether or not I want to buy an M1

[kraigwy]

it's government chartered which means it's completely civilian company that exists only as long as the government decides to keep giving them free surplus.

Almost, but not there.

The CMP was charted by congress to provide marksmanship training to American Citizens, with emphasis on Juniors.

Surplus Sales is nothing but a means to fund those programs. The Forerunner of the CMP was the DCM which was run by the Army, and did received federal funds. The CMP doesn't depend on tax dollars, but is totally funded from sales.

When I was attending the CMP GSM MI course we were told that if the Sales was to stop today (that was 2-3 years ago) they have the means to continue their marksmanship activities almost indefinitely.

But again, the mission of the CMP is not to sell surplus military arms, ammo, and equipment, but to conduct marksmanship activities.

This just didn't start in 1996 when the CMP got it's charter, but in 1904 under Teddy Roosevelt.

It definitely is more efficient then the DCM.....not to say the Army was a fault, but they had to have their budget approved each year by congress, they were understaffed and under funded and had some silly rules.

To give you an example, when I got my Distinguished Rifle badge it took about 18 months under the DCM from the time I finished up on my points and I got the Badge.

Now under the CMP if you earn the points, they'll beat you home from the match.

To add, not all the stuff sold by the CMP is surplus military, a look at their Stores (e-store) lots of ammo, and other shooting equipment and parts come from commercial sources.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Edit to add:

The CMP is about a lot more then M1 Sales, I encourage everyone to visit www.odcmp.com and go through the site and forums. It's a great program.

[gdvan01]

I believe the Garand Collectors Association (for $25 a year) is an affiliated organization.

[Orlando]

M1 Collectors Club is $14 per year

[Bart Noir]

tahunua, good job in alerting him to that legal minefield.

Perhaps a short letter from a company commander, on NG letterhead, will do the job of certifying that he is active military.

And I expect that CMP office has handled the question a few times before. He can call and ask what they accept as confirmation. Perhaps he can just copy a set of orders which have a current date....

And about the dreaded M1 Thumb (aka Garanditus Slammus Thumsi) - there are two kinds of rifle shooters: those who have suffered from M1 Thumb, and those who are going to.

Bart Noir

[Orlando]

Garand Thumb?
Two kinds of shooters those who put their thumb where it doesnt belong and get bit and shooters who know better and keep their digets out of where they shouldnt be
I have been shooting the Garand for many years and never had it and never even a close call.
Garand thumb comes form playing around with a empty rifle with the bolt pulled back.

[tahunua001]

I kindof agree, true I haven't shot my M1 all that much yet but garand thumb sounds kindof like beretta bite... a stupid newbie mistake that anyone with comoon sense should be able to avoid.

[SHE3PDOG]

this is a damned if you do damned if you don't type deal. Active service counts as club membership however there is only one form of proof that you are active duty that I can think of and that's your military ID which is now against the law to make a photo copy of. so really, unless you break the law by scanning your ID, you still have to get membership somewhere else.

Perhaps they would accept a copy of your orders or an LES statement. That is what I had to use to purchase a handgun here in Cali. I'll certainly get some clarification on this from them in the near future because I would also like to purchase one from them.

[tahunua001]

hmmm... I never thought about an LES... orders are FOUO as well so there might even be issues spreading copies of those but an LES might serve assuming you're comfortable leaving your financial info in someone else'
hands.