22lr as a HD tool? - Page 2

GunXpatriot · February 15, 2013, 01:57 PM

Agree with others, .22 is not the best, but in a rifle, it really CAN be effective with good shot placement. At least, it's a hell of a lot better out of a rifle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psf4WIqupr4

Also, I hope you live in gun country, because if you're in far-left NY like I used to be (moved upstate), I'd bet when they heard you put 10-15 rounds into the guy before he went down, you'd be convicted of murder in the first degree, simply because no one would know the limitations of the .22 or how it would compare to better options, especially against a possibly drugged up bad guy...

Romeo 33 Delta · February 15, 2013, 02:50 PM

I'm in complete agreement with Art on this. With "no" recoil, it might be far easier for someone of small stature or with certain physical disabilities to put a large number of bullets into a concentrated area in a short period of time to very deadly effect. Missing the target with 7 rounds of .45ACP is less lethal than hitting it 10 times with .22LR.

2ndsojourn · February 15, 2013, 05:01 PM

From Microgunner's post:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na4r7wkA9Vo

Can someone explain to me how this is a legal firearm?

Microgunner · February 15, 2013, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2ndsojourn

Can someone explain to me how this is a legal firearm?

It's a 100% legal BATFE approved bump fire device/stock that makes the shooter's finger full auto while the firearm remains semi-auto.
In other words, the device allows the shooter to pull the trigger 600-900 times per minute. Legal.

It's built by Slidefire Systems. Their website gives all the details.

http://www.slidefire.com/

SHR970 · February 15, 2013, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Art Eatman wrote: I have read, but don't know first-hand, that multiple rapid hits have a cumulative effect brought about by the rapidity. The example was the Skorpion .32. Pipsqueak cartridge, but deadly because of the rate of fire of 1,200 rounds per minute.

Think Buckshot. 9 33 caliber pellets coming at you from 1050 fps (reduced recoil) to 1330 fps. (standard load). In a reduced recoil round each pellet has 130 ft. lbs energy at the muzzle. The load creates 9 wound tracks inside the body. An awful lot of people on this forum recommend REDUCED RECOIL 00 Buck as a self defense load. A high velocity round from a 22 rifle develops around 140 ft. lbs. of energy at the muzzle.

A 10 round magazine unloaded into someone is similar to a single hit from a 12 gauge 00 buck load from an energy and number of internal wound tracks perspective. It is different in the profile of the wound track size / shape and also in the CNS overload from multiple near instantaneous hits perspective.

Is a 22 rifle my first choice? No. Is it a viable choice? Yes. The presence alone may very well be enough to stop an attack. If not, it sure beats telling the perp. "I'm calling 911"

GunXpatriot · February 15, 2013, 05:43 PM

SHR970, agreed, but I'd rather have #1-#3 buck for less chance of over-penetration. But yeah, it's no wonder a shotgun is the ultimate home defense medicine, but I personally think the "legendary" 00 buck is a little over-rated. Not for stopping power, etc, but for the risk of overpenetration, even if that risk is small.

mtrvl · February 15, 2013, 06:23 PM

When the police come to your house to clean up after your{God Forgive and hope it never happens} Home Invasion, things may "go south" on you when they see your two magazines taped together. Pre-meditated Overkill?

Tennessee Jed · February 15, 2013, 08:25 PM

Looking back, I can remember a number of head shots on running rabbits and squirrels I made with my trusty 22 Winchester semi-auto rifle.

If that was all I had, or if for whatever reason that was all that I could shoot well, I would be completely ok with that.

I used to know a tough old cop who said the 2 scariest things in the world to him were a frightened 13 year old with a coach gun, and an angry old lady with a 22 rifle.

Onward Allusion · February 15, 2013, 10:55 PM

It wouldn't be my 1st choice but a 10/22 for HD, sure why not. Just make sure it's completely clean, oiled, with a BX-25 mag, and some reliable high/hyper-velocity solid point 40gr ammo.

Onward Allusion · February 15, 2013, 10:57 PM

Quote:

mtrvl
When the police come to your house to clean up after your{God Forgive and hope it never happens} Home Invasion, things may "go south" on you when they see your two magazines taped together. Pre-meditated Overkill?

The mitigating factor would be that it is a 22LR rifle. Sure, you put 20 rounds into the BG's chest but it's just one level higher than a BB gun.

Art Eatman · February 16, 2013, 08:31 AM

The subject is the efficacy of a .22, not the woulda/coulda/shoulda stuff about aftermaths of use.

Jack O'Conner · February 16, 2013, 04:48 PM

My sister-in-law was a child during the Detroit riots. Her mother shot two of several bandits who had broken down the door to get in. Her rifle: a Marlin 22LR semi-auto. First bullet took a man in the mouth. The little bullet knocked out teeth and came out his cheek which severed vital facial nerves. Second man was shot in the center of his chest. The bandits ran out of the house.

First man made his way to a hospital and was arrested for parole violation. He died in prison about a year later, stabbed to death. Second man died on the front lawn. Police arrived as a large angry crowd gathered. My sister-in-law, her mother, and brothers were taken away under police escort. The crowd burned their house to the ground. But insurance paid up and this little family left Michigan for good. No charges were filed by DA Office.

A 22 rifle is better than none at all when defending oneself against bandits.

Jack

kozak6 · February 17, 2013, 02:25 AM

A .22 is probably a better choice than a baseball bat, but it shouldn't be a first choice unless it's all you have or unless you have a specific need for low recoil.

kilimanjaro · February 17, 2013, 03:00 AM

Not my first choice for HD, but it's a viable choice if that is what you have and can afford for now. Big holes are better than small holes, but you need something to make the holes, so go with what you got for now. Shot placement will be crucial, not number of rounds in the magazine. Shoot for the eyes, that will work fine.

Drhc116 · February 18, 2013, 03:10 PM

Shot placement is key. If its all you can put your hands on in the moment of need then aim small miss small.

February 15, 2013, 06:23 PM	#32
mtrvl Member Join Date: February 10, 2013 Posts: 22	When the police come to your house to clean up after your{God Forgive and hope it never happens} Home Invasion, things may "go south" on you when they see your two magazines taped together. Pre-meditated Overkill? Last edited by mtrvl; February 15, 2013 at 06:25 PM. Reason: spelling error

February 15, 2013, 10:55 PM	#34
Onward Allusion Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2009 Location: Back in a Non-Free State Posts: 3,133	It wouldn't be my 1st choice but a 10/22 for HD, sure why not. Just make sure it's completely clean, oiled, with a BX-25 mag, and some reliable high/hyper-velocity solid point 40gr ammo. __________________ Simple as ABC . . . Always Be Carrying

February 16, 2013, 04:48 PM	#37
Jack O'Conner Senior Member Join Date: July 11, 2005 Location: Manatee County, Florida Posts: 1,976	My sister-in-law was a child during the Detroit riots. Her mother shot two of several bandits who had broken down the door to get in. Her rifle: a Marlin 22LR semi-auto. First bullet took a man in the mouth. The little bullet knocked out teeth and came out his cheek which severed vital facial nerves. Second man was shot in the center of his chest. The bandits ran out of the house. First man made his way to a hospital and was arrested for parole violation. He died in prison about a year later, stabbed to death. Second man died on the front lawn. Police arrived as a large angry crowd gathered. My sister-in-law, her mother, and brothers were taken away under police escort. The crowd burned their house to the ground. But insurance paid up and this little family left Michigan for good. No charges were filed by DA Office. A 22 rifle is better than none at all when defending oneself against bandits. Jack __________________ Fire up the grill! Deer hunting IS NOT catch and release.

February 15, 2013, 01:57 PM	#26
GunXpatriot Senior Member Join Date: November 28, 2011 Location: New York Posts: 393	Agree with others, .22 is not the best, but in a rifle, it really CAN be effective with good shot placement. At least, it's a hell of a lot better out of a rifle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psf4WIqupr4 Also, I hope you live in gun country, because if you're in far-left NY like I used to be (moved upstate), I'd bet when they heard you put 10-15 rounds into the guy before he went down, you'd be convicted of murder in the first degree, simply because no one would know the limitations of the .22 or how it would compare to better options, especially against a possibly drugged up bad guy...

February 15, 2013, 02:50 PM	#27
Romeo 33 Delta Senior Member Join Date: March 27, 2009 Posts: 315	I'm in complete agreement with Art on this. With "no" recoil, it might be far easier for someone of small stature or with certain physical disabilities to put a large number of bullets into a concentrated area in a short period of time to very deadly effect. Missing the target with 7 rounds of .45ACP is less lethal than hitting it 10 times with .22LR.

February 15, 2013, 05:01 PM	#28
2ndsojourn Senior Member Join Date: January 15, 2013 Location: South Jersey Posts: 1,416	From Microgunner's post: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na4r7wkA9Vo Can someone explain to me how this is a legal firearm?

February 15, 2013, 05:43 PM	#31
GunXpatriot Senior Member Join Date: November 28, 2011 Location: New York Posts: 393	SHR970, agreed, but I'd rather have #1-#3 buck for less chance of over-penetration. But yeah, it's no wonder a shotgun is the ultimate home defense medicine, but I personally think the "legendary" 00 buck is a little over-rated. Not for stopping power, etc, but for the risk of overpenetration, even if that risk is small.

February 15, 2013, 08:25 PM	#33
Tennessee Jed Member Join Date: July 14, 2010 Posts: 92	Looking back, I can remember a number of head shots on running rabbits and squirrels I made with my trusty 22 Winchester semi-auto rifle. If that was all I had, or if for whatever reason that was all that I could shoot well, I would be completely ok with that. I used to know a tough old cop who said the 2 scariest things in the world to him were a frightened 13 year old with a coach gun, and an angry old lady with a 22 rifle.

February 16, 2013, 08:31 AM	#36
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	The subject is the efficacy of a .22, not the woulda/coulda/shoulda stuff about aftermaths of use.

February 17, 2013, 02:25 AM	#38
kozak6 Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 3,113	A .22 is probably a better choice than a baseball bat, but it shouldn't be a first choice unless it's all you have or unless you have a specific need for low recoil.

February 17, 2013, 03:00 AM	#39
kilimanjaro Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2009 Posts: 3,963	Not my first choice for HD, but it's a viable choice if that is what you have and can afford for now. Big holes are better than small holes, but you need something to make the holes, so go with what you got for now. Shot placement will be crucial, not number of rounds in the magazine. Shoot for the eyes, that will work fine.

February 18, 2013, 03:10 PM	#40
Drhc116 Member Join Date: April 26, 2012 Posts: 76	Shot placement is key. If its all you can put your hands on in the moment of need then aim small miss small.