12 Guage for Home Defense?

[TheKlawMan]

Nnobby45, If you are awakened at 3 in the morning by the sound of your front door being kicked in and you have time to grab one weapon before the intruder, armedd with a .38, reaches your bedroom door, would you rather that weapon was a Taurus Judge loaded with .410 or a 12 gauge pump loaded with 00 buck?

[trg42wraglefragle]

After patterning my shotgun at 15yrds with birdshot, Yes it may not drop the person dead but I highly doubt that they are going to be functioning properly after getting hit, and are going to be the same treat they were before being shot. Unless they're high on something, but that just brings in a whole lot more variables.

Where I live I would much rather use birdshot than buckshot, but our laws are a lot different to US ones.

[Nnobby45]

Nnobby45, If you are awakened at 3 in the morning by the sound of your front door being kicked in and you have time to grab one weapon before the intruder, armedd with a .38, reaches your bedroom door, would you rather that weapon was a Taurus Judge loaded with .410 or a 12 gauge pump loaded with 00 buck?

That's a hypothetical.

What's actually handy (available now gun) is a pistol. Mine doesn't happen to be a Judge, it's the pistol I carried that day depending on what struck my fancy.

For some, that pistol would be The Judge loaded with buckshot.

Two steps away is an 870 w/LE 00 buck, and a P226 with 15 rds. in a holster afixed to the back of a dresser. I may not be able to get to those, or even get out of bed, and the gun at arms length will have to do

I don't like the Judge. I don't want to buy one. If I won one in a raffle, that and a few hundred dollars would get me another SIG. Or maybe I could trade it for a PX4 Storm---I'd trade it for something.

I do not think The Judge is anything close to the equlvilent of a buckshot loaded 12. Never claimed it was. Any multiple projectiles fired by me will be coming out of a 12 ga. and there will be 8 or 9 or 'em.


AND , some people have the dang things, and I would not underestimate the lethality of 3 to 5 000 buck at an advertised vel. of 1300 fps. ( less in the pistol, but still lethal). At very close range, effectivness may equal or surpass that of the .45 Colt---don't know. I'll bet the 3in.'s 5 pellets would.

I'm trying my best to abide by the board rules and not attack people or opinions.---so I won't. Never the less, it's difficult to refrain from attacking some opinions that barely reach the level of prepubescent immaturity by claiming that the .410 is completely worthless--so I won't do that either.



Hope that explains it.

[TheKlawMan]

That's a hypothetical.

Hypotheticals are often used to illustrate the shallowness of certain arguments and beliefs. No one said anything about the .410 being completely useless; no one but yourself. As for thge .410 in a Judge, I have heard it is good for snakes.

[Nnobby45]

Hypotheticals are often used to illustrate the shallowness of certain arguments and beliefs. No one said anything about the .410 being completely useless; no one but yourself. As for thge .410 in a Judge, I have heard it is good for snakes.

What's shallow is asking someone if they'd choose The Judge or a 12ga. The Judge is a pistol, which, like any pistol, would never be the first choice if a 12 ga. is available.

Like any pistol, it's likely to be available when the shotgun isn't.

Before you make statements like " No one said anything about the .410 being completely useless; no one but yourself.., " read post #43. Somebody did say that.



Any reference I made to the effectivness of the .410 pistol is with BUCKSHOT, where the range is limited. Others can argue about the .410 with birdshot.

[bamaranger]

We kick this around so much, and I am guilty myself of loading a coach gun w/ bird shot a time or two for SD in very tight quarters, like a motel room. Very narrow niche and I have rethought the matter since.

The std OO buck load has been the yardstick for a long time and serves much better as a GP/SD load for shotguns, and both my HD shotguns are so loaded at present as well as the duty gun in the gov. vehicle. I live and work in the boonies.

What might be a better idea in the "niche" of extreme urban dwellings and protecting oneself at room distance is something like BB or T-shot (T-buck) ........and that is just a notion w/ no proof.

A gelatin study with 00, BB, T and #4B, and say #6 shot, at reasonable ranges, to include barriers like common clothing and jackets would be very interesting.

[TheKlawMan]

Read that in context. Hogdogs was talking about a Taurus Judge loaded with Bird Shot being not worth squat.

[youngunz4life]

3" 15 pellet 00 buck(winchester or federal)

If I am sending someone to the other side, I am going to make sure I do my best to make sure he gets there(again, personal opinion - shooting is a last resort but one I am fully commited to if and when it occurs).

[Nnobby45]

Read that in context. Hogdogs was talking about a Taurus Judge loaded with Bird Shot being not worth squat.

Maybe that's where the disagreement comes from.

I didn't place the statement in any context other than what was said.

I believe the reference was a pharmacist whose shot disabled a robber and left him lying completely incapacitated until he came back and unnecessarily shot him again.

IF he was using birdshot, then maybe The Judge so loaded is more potent than we thought--- up real close, anyway.