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Old July 18, 1999, 09:47 PM   #1
Grayfox
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Yesterday I was loading some "Plinking" rounds in .38 Spl. I use odd and mixed brass for these since I don't expect top performance out of them. I have both roll and taper crimp dies in .38/357 and really got to thinking about it. Which one to use?
The advantage of taper crimp is that it's not real touchy about overall case length, but it is harder (for me anyway) to judge just how much is enough.
The good old roll crimp is easy to see and adjust as you want, but can be a problem if some of the cases are a bit long.
I was just wondering what TFL members thought on the subject. Which do you like and why?
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Old July 18, 1999, 11:19 PM   #2
Stephen A. Camp
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Greetings, sir. In revolvers, if the bullet has a cannulure, I roll crimp. If loading a bullet w/o it, I taper crimp. Even though case length does cause minor problems, I prefer a roll crimp with revolvers and also suggest doing it separately from the seating phase of reloading to avoid shaving lead or bullet jacket. Best.
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Old July 18, 1999, 11:51 PM   #3
Rod WMG
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On this subject, I don't have a lot of knowledge. I roll crimp all my sixgun loads (except one--more on that in a minute). Why do that? Because people like Keith, Taffin, et. al, always told me to when I was "growing up in the reloading aspect. I developed a heavy bias in that direction.

However, when I got my Smith 625-2 (.45 ACP), I bought RCBS dies (which I normallly do anyway) specifically because I intended to use the "built in roll crimp feature" for my sixgun. Guess what? RCBS had dropped the feature on their regular production dies in .45 ACP/AR before I bought mine.

Rather than wait for a special crimping die, I went ahead and loaded by ACP/AR rounds, both light and heavy, with the taper crimp and have never looked back. I still would prefer a roll crimp, but not enough to order the die. I actually can't tell any effect on the rounds as compared to my other calibers with roll crimps.

Gunzine writer Bob Mermelstein (spelling?) has gone on record as saying that we sixgunners should all go to taper crimping and not worrying about trimming brass. Maybe he's right, I don't know. I'm just too tradition bound to be totally comfortable with the concept.

As an aside, I use the same dies to load Specials and Magnums in both .38 and .44 calibers (employing the spacer washer RCBS includes to use with the longer cases). I don't change the crimp setting for either caliber when I load the heavy or light loads. The results have always been satisfactory to me with what I term the "magnum crimp."

I hope this helps instead of confusing the issue even more.
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Old July 19, 1999, 10:19 AM   #4
many
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I agrre with mr.camp use a taper crimp for autos and a roll crimp for revolvers.
For many years I've been reloading .38 spl and .357 Mag, and always use a roll crimp (a moderate roll crimp cause I use lead bullets).Prior to put the roll crimp I first seat the bullet to desire dept and then I use my roll crimp die with a moderate not full-snug fit,this give about 1.5 to 2 inches at 15 mts. suficient to plink or paper punching (in fact I drop steel rams about 90 yds with my load so acuracy does not sufer nothing.
I recomend you to set your roll crimp die to a point were it rolls uniformely (no matter the brand of shells) and that's all.
You state in your post that your amoo is not serius (I mean macht ammo) so use the light roll crimp.
stay safe and enjoy shooting.
many the mexican kid.
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Old July 19, 1999, 02:23 PM   #5
swifter...
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For years, on all revolver rounds, I've used Redding's Profile Crimp. It adds a step to the loading process, but has proven to be well worth it, IMHO. In any crimping, I do it as a separate step. Seating/crimping in one step is not nearly as accurate in my experience. I taper crimp auto-pistol rounds, BTW. The Dillon even has a separate die station so it doesn't seat/crimp.

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Old July 19, 1999, 04:15 PM   #6
James K
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A taper crimp is best for those cartridges that headspace on the case mouth (e.g., .45ACP, 9 mm P.) because a roll crimp does not give a solid case support while firing; this can lead to inaccuracy or misfires. This is true whether the cartridge is to be fired in an auto pistol or in a revolver.

Those cartridges that headspace on the rim (e.g., .38 Special, .357 Magnum, .38 Super) should be roll crimped for lead bullets and for jacketed bullets with a cannelure, but should be taper crimped for jacketed bullets without a cannelure. In the latter case, the taper crimp must be used because there is no place for the roll crimp to go.

Jim

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Old July 19, 1999, 04:52 PM   #7
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I had a CH Taper Crimp die for 38/357. The one thing I found out in my own experience with this die is that it was quite easy to over crimp,especially with the jacketed bullets. This would result in excessive pressures due to extremely high bullet pull. The same loading with a firm roll crimp was just fine. This taper crimp die would actually reduce the diameter of the case right into the side of the bullet over a wider area than a roll crimp. The remaining rounds were impossible to even pull the bullets and were discarded.

Shooting mostly cast lead bullets now, I usually Roll Crimp because most lead bullet crimp grooves are deep and made for it anyway.
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Old August 1, 1999, 09:41 AM   #8
slabsides
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Most of the bullets I have used have a crimping groove, and all my dies have the roll-crimp shoulder, so I roll crimp everything, even .45ACP. I thought to get a taper crimp die for the ACP when I was shooting a lot of bullseye, but testing in my 1911 and a revolver showed no difference in accuracy between factory (presumably taper crimped) and my reloads, so I just said the hell with it. Seems to me a taper crimp would tend to elongate even straight wall cases, requiring frequent trimming. In any case, I don't worry about it. slabsides
PS: A note that I read in the AR Dope Bag a couple of years ago indicated that their testing showed that most ACP cases were longer than the SAAMI standard, and that a roll crimp that provided a uniform loaded case length was headspacing on the crimp OK. If a roll crimped round will sit flush with the gun's barrel hood when chambered, as all of them should, the Rifleman concluded that a roll crimp is fine in the ACP.

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[This message has been edited by slabsides (edited August 01, 1999).]
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Old August 1, 1999, 10:45 PM   #9
Grayfox
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Pretty much the response I expected. I roll crimp all my revolver rounds. But, I do own a set of taper crimp 38/357 dies that I picked up by mistake several years ago. I've also seen several gun writers suggesting taper crimping revolver rounds, so I thought I'd throw the question out for discussion. I'll stick with the roll crimp. Thanks for the input.
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