Surprise....

[FrankenMauser]

Originally Posted by therealdeal

I would take him out if you see him despite the fine.

Even in its original context, the above statement reads the same: shoot on sight. (In context, the way I read it, it goes further to say, 'and use the warden's words as protective shell'.)

Originally Posted by therealdeal

franken to judge me saying I advocating poaching is way off and common sense points this out in my mind so I am now wondering if the other posters were sort of right about your judgements and posts?! elkman said he had the pawprints and/or evidence in the opposite of what you said. the authorities of the area were aware of it too&said he could defend camp. I was siding with safety, and I understood from reading the posts he was on the other side of the country before I replied. Dealing w/curious bears and letting them go undisturbed can become dangerous.

He can defend himself, yes.
Shooting a bear, just because it is around.... that's a different subject.

If the bear isn't posing a threat, there is no safety issue. I've seen plenty of bears, that would have scared the hell out of 99% of people in this country, but never posed a real threat to anyone. To date, I haven't been touched by one, or had my property damaged by one (other than a trash can in Florida, but that bear got a face and mouth full of "Jamaican Hell-Fire Sauce", and never came back). I've even been mock charged. The bear lived. I lived. The bear's cub lived (not all "threats" are what they seem).

To the point:
When making a point of trying to keep a bear away, people often become paranoid about an encounter. If that encounter occurs, the bear usually doesn't have a chance. People are so afraid of these creatures, that their first thought is to get their finger on the bang switch. Then, for an irrational reason, these threatened species have one less living member.

Now, if you didn't intend for your post to sound like you were advocating blasting the thing on sight, the post should have been worded a little more carefully.

[langenc]

capsasin=red pepper

[Big Bill]

The bear lived. I lived. The bear's cub lived (not all "threats" are what they seem).

But, some threats are exactly what they seem. Maybe you were just lucky that time. Perhaps next time you won't be as lucky.

BTW, Franken, your posts seem more argumentative than constructive. Why not be a little less critical?

[therealdeal]

Now, if you didn't intend for your post to sound like you were advocating blasting the thing on sight, the post should have been worded a little more carefully.

if this last line was left out of your last post, I wouldn't have responded. I stand by what I said, he should take that bear out next time he sees it in his camp. this one act doesn't make elkman a poacher or mean that I advocate poaching. Also, just because I used the phrase "take him out" (referring to this one bear) doesn't mean that I meant in a reckless fashion or in a vigilante sense

If elkman's commonsense tells him something else at the time, thats fine too.

[FrankenMauser]

I stand by what I said, he should take that bear out next time he sees it in his camp. this one act doesn't make elkman a poacher or mean that I advocate poaching. Also, just because I used the phrase "take him out" (referring to this one bear) doesn't mean that I meant in a reckless fashion or in a vigilante sense

If elkman's commonsense tells him something else at the time, thats fine too.

"I stand by what I said, he should take that bear out next time he sees it in his camp."
"This one act doesn't make elkman a poacher"...?

So, poaching doesn't make a poacher?

You're advocating poaching. You're telling him to shoot the thing on sight, regardless of the situation. That's poaching. Even if the warden 'gives him a little slack', it's still blatant irresponsibility.

I hunt the same area Elkman hunts (on the other side of an imaginary line). These bears are not the man-eaters everyone on the east coast seems to think they are.

I really trust Elkman to do the right thing, and believe he would, should the situation arise. Odds are, he won't even see the bear, anyway. Your responses to his situation, though, are unethical, irresponsible, and part of the reason bears out west are doing so poorly now. Irrational fears drive people to do stupid things.

Can you please stop with this drive to get him to shoot it for no reason? You're making it look like I'm trying to get his thread closed. That is not my intention.

[therealdeal]

franken, with all due respect, you seem to be set on stereotyping me and/or the eastcoast as two examples. Just because I reside on the eastcoast does not mean I donot have knowledge of bears, bear country, and so-on. secondly, poaching is when you kill an animal for profit such as elepahants for tusks or undersized gators for their skins. I am not going to change my mind to please you or for you to justify your argument. If it helps you feel better, I wouldn't want someone to just shoot an innocent bear either, but not all people on the eastcoast are paranoid of bears or responsiblefor the wildlife issues you face out there. You have the right to your opinion, and I can relate to someone that doesn't want the great wildlife to become endangered. my wife would tell you to shove it just because you hunt in general, but I still love her despite the fact I can't watch "Swamp People" on the history channel(Bayou, Louisiana gator hunters) without listening to her put the hunters and their families down for killing innocent gators.

[therealdeal]

ps- why does it say "Resident Thread Killer" under all of your posts?

[cornbush]

I agree w/andrew&I believe you stated elkman they verbally gave you permission to defend yourself/camp, I would take him out if you see him despite the fine. the bear #'s are up most everywhere this yr though I think hunger madness might have been last yr. you seem fine, but some people dont realize how quick these things can escalate sometimes(you could be saving someone else)

ps- bear deterrant question- its in your sights

I have been watching this thread from the begining, this post sure reads like "shoot the damn thing no matter what the law says", it may not have been your intention, but it comes accross that way.

Poaching is not only for monetary gain..... any animal, bird, fish etc. taken outside the rule of law or by "bending" the law is poaching.

[elkman06]

MODS: Please lock this.
elkman06

[cornbush]

I believe ELKMAN was asking for ways to keep a bear from tearing up his camper, not asking if he should shoot it.

[therealdeal]

cornbrush, you are frankens brother just so the rest of the thread understands

[Art Eatman]

This thread has got to be a new low in off-topic weirdness and personal insult...

E-bleeping-nuff.