lookin gor a bullseye / silhouette gun

onehitwonder · March 10, 2009, 10:06 PM

looking for some ideas on a bullseye/silhouette gun for my son.

He currently shoots a ruger mark3 with the bull bbl and I plan on putting some upgraded parts on it very soon. He shoots 4h and loves it. Won the bullseye event last weekend. I got a chance to get a browning buckmark bullseye target in stainless in june and was wondering what else is out there that may cost the same but last longer or shoot better. 600 to 700 dollar range with a bbl no longer than 10" and a trigger no lighter than 2lbs. As long as it is factory produced .

Citizen Carrier · March 11, 2009, 04:41 AM

In that price range the only real jump to make from a Ruger would be a S&W Model 41 or a nice, used High Standard like the Victor, Citation, Trophy, etc.

The Ruger, S&W, and HS are all guns that will give a lifetime of service without wearing out, so I wouldn't worry about that.

If your son is going to stick with iron sights, then a longer barreled gun will give him an advantage of increased sight radius. I don't think I'd go with a 10 inch barrel though. Not when the shooting must be done with one hand. Six inches should do it.

If he is going to mount a red dot sight, then a shorter barrel of about 4 inches would be better to save weight.

Since he is still starting out in this sport, I'd stick with the Ruger for awhile longer. I'd upgrade the trigger and sear with Volquartsen parts at a minimum. These parts you should be able to install at your kitchen table, no problem.

What are his scores like with the stock Ruger Mk III?

A couple of years ago I read an article about the Rugers in the NRA's competition magazine.

Basically, you shoot the Ruger stock until the scores plateau. Then you make an upgrade. Say, the trigger and sear. Then you observe the scores for improvement. When they plateau again, you add a set of custom grips. I like the Herrett stocks with the palm shelf. The Volquartsen volthanes are pretty good too. And there are others, probably better. Look at NealJGuns.com or Champion's Choice.

Once again, scores will improve but then plateau. The next step would be to transition from iron sights to a red dot. In case you are not sure what I mean, I'm talking about a scope that projects a red or green dot onto the front lense. Not a laser sight that projects a red or green dot onto the target itself. Don't mean to offend if you already knew the difference.

Ultradots and Matchdots are considered the best for bullseye, but I like the Millet sights just fine. A 3 moa size dot should work.

Now, after his scores plateau from that, and he should've fired many, many rounds by this time, you might consider the S&W or the High Standard.

Or you could take it to the next level and get a Pardini or other somewhat pricey European .22 like the Hammerli or Finewerkbau. At this point the only thing that could possibly be holding him back would be the quality of the trigger pull. The VQ trigger and sear will vastly improve the Ruger, but it will not put it in the realm of the High Standard or the European match pistols. I offer no opinions on the Model 41's trigger pull, as I have no experience with it. I've owned various High Standards and currently shoot the Pardini.

But by then there will be other things to consider. By this time he'll likely be wanting to shoot the .45 and centerfire events of bullseye with the big boys, not just the .22 stuff.

Instead of another .22 (he'll be able to shoot that Ruger one-handed with almost scary precision by this point anyway), think about getting him an M1911A1 bullseye wadcutter gun.

onehitwonder · March 11, 2009, 04:41 PM

at his age group for bullseye he uses two hands and a sand bag to set the butt on. No other braces or body parts are allowed to touch the gun or anything else. For silhouette he shoots two hands without any rests.

He shot a slow fire 86 ( 10 shots) @ 25 yards with 2X's and a 20 second fast fire ( 2 five round groups 40 seconds total) 84 with 1x and thats with a 20 mph crosswind and gusts to 35 or so.

Has a red dot on it already that I put on a few months ago. and the trigger stuff will be done by the end of this month.

He can shoot in this age group for another 2 years I think , he is 9 now.

Citizen Carrier · March 11, 2009, 09:06 PM

Sounds like he's getting a good start on things.

Still, I'd start having him do some practice with one-handed shooting before too much longer. That way it won't come as a cold shock when he transitions out of this age group. And he'll be miles ahead of everyone else who waited until the last minute to switch.

I know I didn't like shooting one-handed at first. Now I shoot better that way than with two hands.

melchloboo · March 14, 2009, 10:30 PM

Get him a nice 10m air pistol, I think that is the best way to transition to 1 handed shooting.

arcticap · March 15, 2009, 01:19 AM

The Ruger does have an advantagous grip angle for some folks, while other grips like the S&W Model 41 require locking the wrist in a more upright position that some find even less comfortable.
The Ruger internal bolt is also lighter than some of the other semi-auto bolts which means less recoil and muzzle rise results from the rearward bolt travel on firing, at least usually when compared to the length and weight of other non-specified barrels.
If accuracy is ever a problem, then there's always better ammo to try.

FM12 · April 20, 2009, 08:34 AM

About the 10th grade or so, may earlier, start looking for a college with ROTC and a scholorship!

March 10, 2009, 10:06 PM	#1
onehitwonder Member Join Date: July 8, 2008 Posts: 97	lookin gor a bullseye / silhouette gun looking for some ideas on a bullseye/silhouette gun for my son. He currently shoots a ruger mark3 with the bull bbl and I plan on putting some upgraded parts on it very soon. He shoots 4h and loves it. Won the bullseye event last weekend. I got a chance to get a browning buckmark bullseye target in stainless in june and was wondering what else is out there that may cost the same but last longer or shoot better. 600 to 700 dollar range with a bbl no longer than 10" and a trigger no lighter than 2lbs. As long as it is factory produced . __________________ " Take your children hunting when they are young and they will hunt for less when they are older "

March 11, 2009, 04:41 AM	#2
Citizen Carrier Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2008 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 671	In that price range the only real jump to make from a Ruger would be a S&W Model 41 or a nice, used High Standard like the Victor, Citation, Trophy, etc. The Ruger, S&W, and HS are all guns that will give a lifetime of service without wearing out, so I wouldn't worry about that. If your son is going to stick with iron sights, then a longer barreled gun will give him an advantage of increased sight radius. I don't think I'd go with a 10 inch barrel though. Not when the shooting must be done with one hand. Six inches should do it. If he is going to mount a red dot sight, then a shorter barrel of about 4 inches would be better to save weight. Since he is still starting out in this sport, I'd stick with the Ruger for awhile longer. I'd upgrade the trigger and sear with Volquartsen parts at a minimum. These parts you should be able to install at your kitchen table, no problem. What are his scores like with the stock Ruger Mk III? A couple of years ago I read an article about the Rugers in the NRA's competition magazine. Basically, you shoot the Ruger stock until the scores plateau. Then you make an upgrade. Say, the trigger and sear. Then you observe the scores for improvement. When they plateau again, you add a set of custom grips. I like the Herrett stocks with the palm shelf. The Volquartsen volthanes are pretty good too. And there are others, probably better. Look at NealJGuns.com or Champion's Choice. Once again, scores will improve but then plateau. The next step would be to transition from iron sights to a red dot. In case you are not sure what I mean, I'm talking about a scope that projects a red or green dot onto the front lense. Not a laser sight that projects a red or green dot onto the target itself. Don't mean to offend if you already knew the difference. Ultradots and Matchdots are considered the best for bullseye, but I like the Millet sights just fine. A 3 moa size dot should work. Now, after his scores plateau from that, and he should've fired many, many rounds by this time, you might consider the S&W or the High Standard. Or you could take it to the next level and get a Pardini or other somewhat pricey European .22 like the Hammerli or Finewerkbau. At this point the only thing that could possibly be holding him back would be the quality of the trigger pull. The VQ trigger and sear will vastly improve the Ruger, but it will not put it in the realm of the High Standard or the European match pistols. I offer no opinions on the Model 41's trigger pull, as I have no experience with it. I've owned various High Standards and currently shoot the Pardini. But by then there will be other things to consider. By this time he'll likely be wanting to shoot the .45 and centerfire events of bullseye with the big boys, not just the .22 stuff. Instead of another .22 (he'll be able to shoot that Ruger one-handed with almost scary precision by this point anyway), think about getting him an M1911A1 bullseye wadcutter gun. __________________ Once you've got your sights adjusted to the ammunition you have, step away from the bench. In competition or the field...there are no benches. Last edited by Citizen Carrier; March 11, 2009 at 09:45 AM.

March 11, 2009, 04:41 PM	#3
onehitwonder Member Join Date: July 8, 2008 Posts: 97	at his age group for bullseye he uses two hands and a sand bag to set the butt on. No other braces or body parts are allowed to touch the gun or anything else. For silhouette he shoots two hands without any rests. He shot a slow fire 86 ( 10 shots) @ 25 yards with 2X's and a 20 second fast fire ( 2 five round groups 40 seconds total) 84 with 1x and thats with a 20 mph crosswind and gusts to 35 or so. Has a red dot on it already that I put on a few months ago. and the trigger stuff will be done by the end of this month. He can shoot in this age group for another 2 years I think , he is 9 now. __________________ " Take your children hunting when they are young and they will hunt for less when they are older "

March 11, 2009, 09:06 PM	#4
Citizen Carrier Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 2008 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 671	Sounds like he's getting a good start on things. Still, I'd start having him do some practice with one-handed shooting before too much longer. That way it won't come as a cold shock when he transitions out of this age group. And he'll be miles ahead of everyone else who waited until the last minute to switch. I know I didn't like shooting one-handed at first. Now I shoot better that way than with two hands. __________________ Once you've got your sights adjusted to the ammunition you have, step away from the bench. In competition or the field...there are no benches.

March 15, 2009, 01:19 AM	#6
arcticap Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2005 Location: Central Connecticut Posts: 3,166	The Ruger does have an advantagous grip angle for some folks, while other grips like the S&W Model 41 require locking the wrist in a more upright position that some find even less comfortable. The Ruger internal bolt is also lighter than some of the other semi-auto bolts which means less recoil and muzzle rise results from the rearward bolt travel on firing, at least usually when compared to the length and weight of other non-specified barrels. If accuracy is ever a problem, then there's always better ammo to try. Last edited by arcticap; March 15, 2009 at 02:06 PM.

March 14, 2009, 10:30 PM	#5
melchloboo Senior Member Join Date: October 2, 2008 Posts: 279	Get him a nice 10m air pistol, I think that is the best way to transition to 1 handed shooting.

April 20, 2009, 08:34 AM	#7
FM12 Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2007 Location: Monroeville, Alabama Posts: 1,683	About the 10th grade or so, may earlier, start looking for a college with ROTC and a scholorship!