How Not To Get Shot By A Good Guy

[eltorrente]

Eltorrente, You lived in a haunted house and by your own admission are paranoid with a gun.

I'm just paranoid of an AD. That house I lived in WAS haunted btw - you would have been creeped out, too.

[threegun]

Just lightening things up dude. Safer is better.

I don't believe in ghosts though...................

[eltorrente]

I don't believe in ghosts though...................

Yeah, well you're wrong!

[Tim Burke]

Originally Posted by threegun

I don't believe in ghosts though.

That's OK, threegun; ghosts don't believe in CCW badges either.

[MacGille]

Just because you have a CCW doesn't give you any police powers. Period.

If you have a perp at gunpoint my question would be why? If he posed a deadly threat to you or another with you, then why is he still alive? If he didn't pose a deadly threat then why did you draw?

A CCW is a license to exercise your 2nd amendment rights, nothing else. It gives you no more powers that any other citizen has. Pointing a weapon at another is a crime called assault with a deadly weapon. It is a felony and can get you serious time in the nearest slammer.

Bottom line is, don't draw unless necessary to save your life. If you do draw, shoot, to kill. Any other scenario is stupid. A ccw will land you in prison if you think it grants any powers.

[threegun]

Macgille, So you see no scenario that you might be compelled to hold someone at gunpoint? A civilian involved shooting is rare. We still carry though. Even more rare is the scenario that may have us covering a bad guy. I choose to be prepared for both unlikely events. I carry a spare mag which I'll likely never need. Heck statistically speaking I'll almost never need more than 3 shots but I still carry my magazines to full 15 shot capacity. The point is many things armed civilians ready for are rare still we prepare for them.

I will try to hold someone if they have tried to molest or kidnap my kids as I don't want them to escape. Someone who has attempted an armed robbery (on me or mine) perhaps at my workplace for sure. Someone who I have had to shoot as I don't want them to change the evidence or manipulate police. Only if safely possible and the criminal complies (except for the child molester he's staying period).

And no I don't go looking for crime so that I can hold the person like LE. It is only to keep me safer in that rare shooting that I decide to stay and hold.

Been carrying since 1992 the only time I held someone at gunpoint (in public)came well before that. Me and my cousin held two car burglars at gunpoint only because they wouldn't run. My cousin was holding a shotgun on them and had convinced them that if they moved they would get it. I was armed with a handgun which I was able to put away when the first TPD car rounded the corner (my cousin still had them covered until police car stopped).

[threegun]

Macgille,

Bottom line is, don't draw unless necessary to save your life. If you do draw, shoot, to kill. Any other scenario is stupid.

So if the guy stops at the sight of your gun shoot anyway? Should I have shot the man that pulled and pointed a gun at my coworker after I realized that it was a bb gun? Which happened to be milliseconds before the first shot.

I think you meant don't draw unless you are justified in shooting and prepared to shoot. I certainly hope you would stop when the threat is gone even if that happens before your shot but after your draw.

Still even if you shoot to kill handguns are pitiful instant killers. You gonna leave a wounded bad guy possibly armed to recover his weapon? There are many scenarios you seem to not have thought about starting with what to do if you draw and bad guy complies instantly. If you shoot him you will likely go to jail.

[WIN71]

I'll give you one thing. You are persistent. Must make for lively entertainment around the dinner table on Thanksgiving at your place........

[Glenn E. Meyer]

I have a big Ghostbusters pin that I got when the movie first came out. I will wave that when Bill Murray, Dan Ackroyd, Ernie and Egan arrive.

[jrkarp]

JrKarp,
Every officer that I have shown it to disagree. Two family members (HCSO) who love me and would never want me to get in trouble told me that as long as I wasn't playing cop, saying I was a cop, or using official cop badges I was fine.

Flashing a badge while holding someone at gunpoint is playing cop. Period. I really don't care what your family members told you. Looking at the law in my state, which is similar to pretty much every state, you could be charged with impersonating a police officer.

Just because you may know a few cops who wouldn't arrest you under those circumstances doesn't mean that other cops wouldn't. And if you are arrested, and the DA wants to prosecute, the charge will stick. I'm in a better position to tell you that little detail than your cop friends/relatives.

Since I will only shoot your client if he is trying to commit a forcable felony on me and would never actively play hero (unless my family was in danger) I could never be convicted of playing cop.

If you are holding someone at gun point and you flash a badge, that is playing cop. If you shoot someone and flash a badge to the first responders as they pull up, that is playing cop.

There is no reason to flash a badge other than to give the impression that you are a cop. If you want to give the impression that you are a good guy and not a bad guy, the best move is to drop your weapon, take 1 step back, and place your hands on top of your head.

What would a man holding a badge and gun on another man make you think? Please don't make assumptions just imagine turning the corner and seeing a man holding a gun and badge on another man. What does it say to you?

If I turn a corner and see a guy holding a gun and a badge on another man, what do I think? "He must be a cop."

I also noticed that you skipped my comment on how bad this could be if you are sued after shooting someone.

[threegun]

Seud! I did answer that. I would never go out and look for crime (playing cop). If crime finds me in the form of a forcible felony and I am forced to shoot someone it will be real easy to prove that I was defending myself from the plaintiff. Just as easy as saying the badge/CCP combo is so that folks know that I am legally carrying and don't prematurely shoot the person with a gun.

See its when you guys twist it with this preconceived misguided notion that people carry fake badges because they want to play cop that it becomes wrong or illegal.

Using a badge to detain someone against their will is illegal. I'm not using the badge to detain them I'm using a gun. The badge as stated many times is to let folks know that I'm the good guy.

[threegun]

Win71, Just having fun man LOL since I can't plat cop anymore .

Glenn, That was funny.

[newarcher]

Threeguns latest post:

Seud! I did answer that. I would never go out and look for crime (playing cop). If crime finds me in the form of a forcible felony and I am forced to shoot someone it will be real easy to prove that I was defending myself from the plaintiff. Just as easy as saying the badge/CCP combo is so that folks know that I am legally carrying and don't prematurely shoot the person with a gun.

See its when you guys twist it with this preconceived misguided notion that people carry fake badges because they want to play cop that it becomes wrong or illegal.

Using a badge to detain someone against their will is illegal. I'm not using the badge to detain them I'm using a gun. The badge as stated many times is to let folks know that I'm the good guy.

Before I even get to first, how old are you? Have you ever studied the law...case law specifically? The rule of a shooting is that it is NEVER EVER easy to prove anything. Let's suppose you shoot a black man and the responding cop is a black man who hates white men (just an example folks) and feels that the days of whites shooting blacks and getting away with it are over....guess what? You are going to jail. All that he has to do is interpret your statements and the evidence one way and you go to jail. The prosecutors tend to take what the cops say with extreme weight and you lose. Get a DA that is anti-gun and your chances of skating go down exponentially.

We just had a case here in Atlanta where a builder came onto a homeowner's property and put a knife to the homeowner's son's face and threatened to kill him. The homeowner was on his way home when he got the call from his son telling him what happened. The HO told the son to go inside and lock the doors and called the police himself. The hapless damned police took their time getting there and the HO arrived first. The builder came at the homeowner from the property next door, refused to show his hands, and kept approaching even as the HO was retreating and pulling his gun. The builder kept coming even after the HO, not wanting to shoot the builder fired a warning shot. The builder was shot and killed and the homeowner is now serving 20-30 years for murder 1...that is beyond me. The HO stayed on scene and cooperated in every way and was still convicted. The prosecutor refused to grant the illegal alien who saw the whole thing a deal (to avoid punishment for being illegal) so they lost that testimony.

First, if you are still holding the gun when the police get there...you are possibly, if not probably, going to get shot regardless. I would never be holding a gun when the police arrived.

Second, no one is twisting anything. The problem with your dumba$$ badge isn't your intentions or what you perceive your intentions to be. The end result will be what everyone in the immediate area perceived your actions to be. When 10 people get up and tell the judge and jury that they thought you were a cop because of your badge, it doesn't matter what your intentions were. Remember, the law isn't always fair and there is a thing called reasonable interpretation. There is an almost unanimous consensus of people on this board, stating that it is a stupid idea and will have you arrested for impersonating....yet your press on.

Lastly, when the BG's lawyer gets done with you, you WILL HAVE USED THAT BADGE TO DETAIN THE SUSPECT. That lawyer is going to have all 10 of those witnesses that said they thought you were a cop testify and you will be screwed. Revenge from a prison cell on the man who captured him, is just something a pissed off felon would love to do. You working to pay him for violating his civil rights or some nonsense like that is just what the current legal system would do to you.

DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB idea. But like someone said, you are listening from bad advice from a family member. I imagine that person is as tired of arguing with you over it as we are and probably just said "okay, I would hesitate" so that you would stop talking to them about it.

I smell a troll on this one folks

New

[threegun]

There is an almost unanimous consensus of people on this board, stating that it is a stupid idea and will have you arrested for impersonating....yet your press on.

Likewise in person here unanimous that it won't.

DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB idea. But like someone said, you are listening from bad advice from a family member. I imagine that person is as tired of arguing with you over it as we are and probably just said "okay, I would hesitate" so that you would stop talking to them about it.

I smell a troll on this one folks

It wouldn't be proper to post a new thread and not debate on it. BTW If you smell a troll take a bath. A troll posts usually with insults and smart arsed remarks.....as you have done. They just try to stir up folks and then run. I have endured many dissenting opinions with class including yours. Instead of striking back I have continued to post why I feel the dissenters are wrong. The only man who posted anything other than his opinion was David Armstrong who asked his LE colleagues. I feel that he biased his sources but thats my opinion and cannot be proven. What I do have on my side are police and sheriffs officers/deputies who believe that it doesn't rise to impersonation (yes two are family....so what makes me more convinced having them agree with the others) and that it would help keep me safe. I also have tons of ordinary civilians many of which carry concealed agreeing that they would give extra precaution before shooting. So you and a few others disagree and I'm supposed to believe you guys? Give me a break. How about calling your states attorney and asking a non biased question? Post the results. If they say I'm wrong then I will call my SA and concede. Until then just as you defend what you believe is right I will do the same. That doesn't make us trolls. Saying what you think doesn't make you right. Calling me a troll when you should be posting something besides opinion to back your claim ain't good.

Posting a shooting that went bad for the good guy has nothing to do with this thread.

First, if you are still holding the gun when the police get there...you are possibly, if not probably, going to get shot regardless. I would never be holding a gun when the police arrived.

My only first hand experience suggests you are wrong again. My cousin didn't get shot by police officers and he had a shotgun on the bad guys. I was able to put my gun away as police arrived. In most videos I have seen most cops bend over back wards not to shoot even if it puts their lives in danger by doing so. My badge is not for these guys but for those that might.

[threegun]

Oh and Newarcher I can't worry about getting sued or prosecuted for protecting myself. If I do it will cause me to make decisions based on that fear and not on the actual event at hand. If my gun goes boom it will be because I had no safe option. If i go to jail like that homeowner for saving myself so be it. It is still better than getting knifed to death.

[Capt. Charlie]

Guys, I think we're all going 'round and 'round the mulberry bush here. 140 posts, folks are seriously polarized and the debate has become static.

Now we've descended into name calling. Time to put this one to bed, methinks.

Closed.