Hercules Unique Powder

INGunGuy · December 12, 2008, 09:01 PM

I recently aquired a bunch of Hercules Unique powder. This powder is in the 35-40 year old range. It has never had the seal broken, and was stored in military dry ammo cans. Here is what I am loading:

.40 S/W
Started loading with this recipe:

165gr TCFM Magnus bullet
CCI Small Pistol Primer #500
5.0gr Bullseye powder

All worked great, shot great, not too hot, good groups. I ran out of the Bullseye powder and opened a can of the Hercules Unique powder.

New Recipe

165gr TCFM Magnus Bullet
CCI Small Pistol Primer #500
5.5gr Hercules Unique powder

Well as soon as I threw the first charge something did not look correct. The case was just about full of powder. I use a RCBS auto powder measure and I had the weight EXACTLY 5.5gr I threw 10 charges and weighed all 10 and they were all EXACTLY 5.5gr if I try and seat the bullet, it looks like it will be a compressed powder charge. Now maybe I am just being overly-cautious, but something doesnt look correct .

Well I guess I need to know if the OLD Hercules Unique powder and the new Allient Unique powder use the same charges?

Just to make sure my scales were functioning correctly I pulled the bullet from a round that had the Bullseye powder and the case was maybe 1/3 full and I weighed the charge and it was 5.0gr on the nose.

Can someone enlighten me as I dont want to have to give up all this wonderful powder I just came into...

INGunGuy

WESHOOT2 · December 12, 2008, 09:05 PM

send me an e-mail; remind me what this is about.
I have Hercules Unique, and maybe even some Hercules data.

[email protected]

amamnn · December 12, 2008, 10:09 PM

You most definitely want to use the old load data for powder that old.

INGunGuy · December 12, 2008, 10:38 PM

The problem is there is no published data for .40 S/W in the old Lyman manuals I have.

INGunGuy

Loader9 · December 12, 2008, 10:56 PM

Here's another problem for you, I have one of the last Hercules manuals and the 40 SW isn't in it...at all. I can tell you that Alliant turned up the heat on the current Unique powder so you should be good using current data for the old Unique. But you can't use the old data for the new Unique because it would be too hot at max loads. Got it?
Your load at 5.5 grs is not a max load and should be fine. I've loaded old Unique a lot heavier than your load from old data and it works fine.

INGunGuy · December 13, 2008, 12:51 AM

It just looks almost like it is going to be a compressed load. Since I am loading from a new Lyman manual, using old powder and since my old Lyman manual doesnt have .40 S/W I am going to use the new information with the old powder.

INGunGuy

rg1 · December 13, 2008, 02:22 AM

I chronographed some loads with 1982 Hercules Unique and 2007 Alliant Unique and got nearly identical velocity. Within 10 fps in 9mm ammo and the new Unique was faster but only 10 fps. I think that's pretty close to being the same speed.

INGunGuy · December 13, 2008, 02:47 AM

Looks like it is time for me to purchase a chronograph. Any suggestions?

INGunGuy

tom234 · December 13, 2008, 02:54 AM

The 1992 Hercules Reloader's Guide for .40 S&W lists 8.0 gr Unique for 150 JHP and 6.7 gr Unique 170 XTP. The same data is listed in the 1995 & 1996 Hercules Reloader's Guide.

WESHOOT2 · December 13, 2008, 12:19 PM

I recommend most highly a chronograph with its brains separate from its skyscreens, for when you shoot it.

I have had great success with my PACT 1 for over twelve years.

Grump · December 14, 2008, 01:31 AM

You've just learned that Unique is a bit "fluffy". Not as light-for-volume as Trail Boss, but it takes up far more space than most cut flake, and especially spherical, powders.

I've read multiple reports AND run my own reloads with both old and new Unique and they really *do* shoot the same, by charge weight.

You have also learned that Unique "not metering well" is mostly internet myth. It's also very forgiving if charges vary by +/- .2 grains (.4 spread). Accuracy does not always require weighing every charge.

December 12, 2008, 09:01 PM	#1
INGunGuy Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2008 Location: Jeffersonville, Indiana Posts: 142	Hercules Unique Powder I recently aquired a bunch of Hercules Unique powder. This powder is in the 35-40 year old range. It has never had the seal broken, and was stored in military dry ammo cans. Here is what I am loading: .40 S/W Started loading with this recipe: 165gr TCFM Magnus bullet CCI Small Pistol Primer #500 5.0gr Bullseye powder All worked great, shot great, not too hot, good groups. I ran out of the Bullseye powder and opened a can of the Hercules Unique powder. New Recipe 165gr TCFM Magnus Bullet CCI Small Pistol Primer #500 5.5gr Hercules Unique powder Well as soon as I threw the first charge something did not look correct. The case was just about full of powder. I use a RCBS auto powder measure and I had the weight EXACTLY 5.5gr I threw 10 charges and weighed all 10 and they were all EXACTLY 5.5gr if I try and seat the bullet, it looks like it will be a compressed powder charge. Now maybe I am just being overly-cautious, but something doesnt look correct . Well I guess I need to know if the OLD Hercules Unique powder and the new Allient Unique powder use the same charges? Just to make sure my scales were functioning correctly I pulled the bullet from a round that had the Bullseye powder and the case was maybe 1/3 full and I weighed the charge and it was 5.0gr on the nose. Can someone enlighten me as I dont want to have to give up all this wonderful powder I just came into... INGunGuy __________________ Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government.

December 12, 2008, 09:05 PM	#2
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	I'm away from my data at this moment send me an e-mail; remind me what this is about. I have Hercules Unique, and maybe even some Hercules data. [email protected] __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

December 12, 2008, 10:09 PM	#3
amamnn Senior Member Join Date: May 13, 2006 Location: WA, the left armpit of the USA Posts: 1,323	You most definitely want to use the old load data for powder that old. __________________ "If the enemy is in range, so are you." - Infantry Journal

December 12, 2008, 10:38 PM	#4
INGunGuy Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2008 Location: Jeffersonville, Indiana Posts: 142	The problem is there is no published data for .40 S/W in the old Lyman manuals I have. INGunGuy __________________ Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government.

December 13, 2008, 12:51 AM	#6
INGunGuy Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2008 Location: Jeffersonville, Indiana Posts: 142	It just looks almost like it is going to be a compressed load. Since I am loading from a new Lyman manual, using old powder and since my old Lyman manual doesnt have .40 S/W I am going to use the new information with the old powder. INGunGuy __________________ Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government.

December 12, 2008, 10:56 PM	#5
Loader9 Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 2008 Posts: 949	Here's another problem for you, I have one of the last Hercules manuals and the 40 SW isn't in it...at all. I can tell you that Alliant turned up the heat on the current Unique powder so you should be good using current data for the old Unique. But you can't use the old data for the new Unique because it would be too hot at max loads. Got it? Your load at 5.5 grs is not a max load and should be fine. I've loaded old Unique a lot heavier than your load from old data and it works fine.

December 13, 2008, 02:22 AM	#7
rg1 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2001 Posts: 1,125	I chronographed some loads with 1982 Hercules Unique and 2007 Alliant Unique and got nearly identical velocity. Within 10 fps in 9mm ammo and the new Unique was faster but only 10 fps. I think that's pretty close to being the same speed.

December 13, 2008, 02:47 AM	#8
INGunGuy Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2008 Location: Jeffersonville, Indiana Posts: 142	Looks like it is time for me to purchase a chronograph. Any suggestions? INGunGuy __________________ Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government.

December 13, 2008, 02:54 AM	#9
tom234 Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2008 Location: Kansas Posts: 753	The 1992 Hercules Reloader's Guide for .40 S&W lists 8.0 gr Unique for 150 JHP and 6.7 gr Unique 170 XTP. The same data is listed in the 1995 & 1996 Hercules Reloader's Guide.

December 13, 2008, 12:19 PM	#10
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	chrono-brain I recommend most highly a chronograph with its brains separate from its skyscreens, for when you shoot it. I have had great success with my PACT 1 for over twelve years. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

December 14, 2008, 01:31 AM	#11
Grump Member Join Date: October 22, 2008 Posts: 73	You've just learned that Unique is a bit "fluffy". Not as light-for-volume as Trail Boss, but it takes up far more space than most cut flake, and especially spherical, powders. I've read multiple reports AND run my own reloads with both old and new Unique and they really do shoot the same, by charge weight. You have also learned that Unique "not metering well" is mostly internet myth. It's also very forgiving if charges vary by +/- .2 grains (.4 spread). Accuracy does not always require weighing every charge.

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