A 3-D "printer" AR lower

Creeper · July 27, 2012, 12:39 AM

Interesting... a 3-D plastic AR lower.

Goodnight... enjoy!

Cheers,
C

BarryLee · July 27, 2012, 12:44 AM

If you have never seen a 3-D printer they are really amazing. I noticed in the article they mention the potential for someone to make illegal guns using these devices. I guess now you will need a FFL to buy a 3-D printer.

house · July 27, 2012, 07:30 AM

Wow that's very cool!

BPowderkeg · July 27, 2012, 08:18 AM

read this:

Quote:

Read: What is 3D printing?

and i still don't quite understand the process, sounds a bit looney to me.

FrankenMauser · July 27, 2012, 12:02 PM

Quote:

I guess now you will need a FFL to buy a 3-D printer.

...just as much as you currently need an FFL to buy a lathe, milling machine, drill press, bench vise, or any other metal working tool.

Brodady · July 27, 2012, 12:58 PM

If I read the article right, what I thought was interesting was that people were printing drugs? I wonder if these are pharmaceuticals or narcotics... most likely the later.
And I wonder how printing the buffer tube threads works, or if that was one of the compatability problems

spacecoast · July 27, 2012, 01:52 PM

Quote:

just as much as you currently need an FFL to buy a lathe, milling machine, drill press, bench vise, or any other metal working tool

Hey, don't give those hard-working, common-sense lawmakers any more ideas...

Creeper · July 27, 2012, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BPowderkeg

and i still don't quite understand the process, sounds a bit looney to me.

I'm a complete neophyte with this technology, so bear with me.

Think in terms of a regular printer. It uses ink to print in two dimensions... the X and Y dimension, or to put it another way, horizontally and vertically on the paper. Although thin, and generally not thought of in these terms, the paper itself provides the Z or dimension of depth.

With a 3-D printer, you don't have paper, you have an actual capability of creating a Z or depth dimension... from nothing. Layers of plastic are deposited, one up on the other, in all 3 dimensions, to create the completed piece. In this case, an AR lower. A processor, using programed data, deposits the plastic at the exact locations as needed.
You can create a very complex shape... even a shape that cannot be made conventionally with metal, say, with moving parts... in one process.

Here's a good example of what I'm talking about. What you see below, made by Objet Geometries, is fully functional... and comes out of the printer as you see it.

Same thing with the more recognizable chain. It functions just like a chain does... yet the complete chain was made in one process, just as you see it.

Cheers,
C

BPowderkeg · July 27, 2012, 11:59 PM

i was with the understanding that you can not create something from nothing, so where did the material come from to produce the gears and chain, how can it be used in a practical manner ? and why plastic, why not metal ? can i produce a gold coin that is real ? i guess i am more a neophyte than you, maybe just a dunce !

i sure hope my metal and wood lathe, milling machine, drill press, bench vise, grinder, sander, saws both radial arm, table and band saws will not be listed under FFL laws and rules.

Creeper · July 28, 2012, 12:14 AM

By nothing, I mean there is no substrate on which the item is printed... like a piece of paper is the substrate for ink printing.

Metal is on the way... plastic, to start, is easier, cooler and cheaper.

Here's a good place to start your education on 3-D modeling and firearms... the company that made the printer for Tiberius Arms.

Cheers,
C

Auto426 · July 28, 2012, 12:18 AM

From what I understand the material in the printer is similar to a powderized plastic. The "ink" in the printer head is basically a glue that binds the powder together and creates a hard plastic. The printer contains a box full of the powder stuff, and the printer head makes repeated swipes over the materials building the parts in layers.

Right now the main use of the technology is prototyping. It allows designers To easily create actual 3d physical models of the objects they are designing. In the future it could be used to make all sorts of complex parts provided they can create a durable printing substance.

Creeper · July 28, 2012, 12:30 AM

You have it in a nutshell Auto426.

Due to the time required to make a part(s) in a 3-D printer, it's certainly not cost effective for a production item, but for prototyping and proof of concept, FAR more cost effective than making the same part(s) in metal.

Cheers,
C

**JohnKSa** · July 28, 2012, 12:35 AM

The toner in a laser printer is actually colored plastic. It is deposited onto the paper in the proper position and then heated which melts it into place.

The layer of plastic is very thin, but if the process is repeated, it can be built up to be thicker and thicker.

A 3-D printer is set up to build up plastic layers into 3D objects. It takes time, but you can "print" just about anything if you have patience.

There are metal 3-D printers already available. They print using a metal toner/binder mix which is then fired/cured, much like an MIM part. After the firing/curing, it is infused with a bronze alloy. At SHOT 2012, there was a company exhibiting which uses 3-D metal printing technology to make low-volume parts.

Here's an artist who uses the process to create her sculptures. She describes it in some detail.

http://www.bathsheba.com/sculpt/process/

Here's the company that prints her designs.

http://www.exone.com/materialization...lization/metal

There's a video on their website that shows the process and explains it.

Creeper · July 28, 2012, 12:39 AM

Quote:

At SHOT 2012, there was a company exhibiting which uses 3-D metal printing technology to make low-volume parts.

I've missed the last 2 years... would have loved to have seen that exhibit.

**JohnKSa** · July 28, 2012, 01:09 AM

It was just a small booth, but they did have some interesting displays.

They had one printed part that was the front sight and gas block of an AR-15. I suspect they aren't quite ready to print parts that really require a lot of strength like barrels and bolts, but I think they could make just about anything else.

DaleA · July 31, 2012, 11:28 PM

A 1960's science fiction book "Space, Space, Space"

http://www.amazon.com/Space-William-.../dp/B000K7IMRQ

had a fun (and rather right-wing politically) story about a space ship repair shop that boasted they could repair any ship in space. One of the processes they had to obtain by hook or crook was the 'molecular spray'.

Shrug. I see the 3-d printer stuff and wonder if I can even wonder what will come next.

(Of course for mass production you really need the Star Trek replicators!)

July 27, 2012, 12:39 AM	#1
Creeper Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2008 Location: Woooooshington Posts: 1,797	A 3-D "printer" AR lower Interesting... a 3-D plastic AR lower. Goodnight... enjoy! Cheers, C __________________ Shoulder Drive Nicholson Club

July 27, 2012, 12:44 AM	#2
BarryLee Senior Member Join Date: July 29, 2010 Location: The ATL (OTP) Posts: 3,946	If you have never seen a 3-D printer they are really amazing. I noticed in the article they mention the potential for someone to make illegal guns using these devices. I guess now you will need a FFL to buy a 3-D printer. __________________ A major source of objection to a free economy is precisely that it ... gives people what they want instead of what a particular group thinks they ought to want. Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

July 27, 2012, 12:58 PM	#6
Brodady Member Join Date: July 12, 2012 Location: TX. Posts: 16	If I read the article right, what I thought was interesting was that people were printing drugs? I wonder if these are pharmaceuticals or narcotics... most likely the later. And I wonder how printing the buffer tube threads works, or if that was one of the compatability problems __________________ My collection: Sig Sauer M400 Enhanced, Mossberg maverick 88 12ga, Chinese SKS, Ruger mkIII 22lr. ------------------------ NRA youth member

July 28, 2012, 12:14 AM	#10
Creeper Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2008 Location: Woooooshington Posts: 1,797	By nothing, I mean there is no substrate on which the item is printed... like a piece of paper is the substrate for ink printing. Metal is on the way... plastic, to start, is easier, cooler and cheaper. Here's a good place to start your education on 3-D modeling and firearms... the company that made the printer for Tiberius Arms. Cheers, C __________________ Shoulder Drive Nicholson Club

July 28, 2012, 12:18 AM	#11
Auto426 Senior Member Join Date: November 24, 2007 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 1,323	From what I understand the material in the printer is similar to a powderized plastic. The "ink" in the printer head is basically a glue that binds the powder together and creates a hard plastic. The printer contains a box full of the powder stuff, and the printer head makes repeated swipes over the materials building the parts in layers. Right now the main use of the technology is prototyping. It allows designers To easily create actual 3d physical models of the objects they are designing. In the future it could be used to make all sorts of complex parts provided they can create a durable printing substance. __________________ *"Si vis pacem, para bellum"* - If you want peace, prepare for war.

July 27, 2012, 07:30 AM	#3
house Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 1999 Location: AZ/CA Posts: 369	Wow that's very cool!

July 27, 2012, 11:59 PM	#9
BPowderkeg Junior member Join Date: September 27, 2011 Posts: 382	i was with the understanding that you can not create something from nothing, so where did the material come from to produce the gears and chain, how can it be used in a practical manner ? and why plastic, why not metal ? can i produce a gold coin that is real ? i guess i am more a neophyte than you, maybe just a dunce ! i sure hope my metal and wood lathe, milling machine, drill press, bench vise, grinder, sander, saws both radial arm, table and band saws will not be listed under FFL laws and rules.

July 28, 2012, 12:30 AM	#12
Creeper Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2008 Location: Woooooshington Posts: 1,797	You have it in a nutshell Auto426. Due to the time required to make a part(s) in a 3-D printer, it's certainly not cost effective for a production item, but for prototyping and proof of concept, FAR more cost effective than making the same part(s) in metal. Cheers, C __________________ Shoulder Drive Nicholson Club

July 28, 2012, 12:35 AM	#13
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 24,990	The toner in a laser printer is actually colored plastic. It is deposited onto the paper in the proper position and then heated which melts it into place. The layer of plastic is very thin, but if the process is repeated, it can be built up to be thicker and thicker. A 3-D printer is set up to build up plastic layers into 3D objects. It takes time, but you can "print" just about anything if you have patience. There are metal 3-D printers already available. They print using a metal toner/binder mix which is then fired/cured, much like an MIM part. After the firing/curing, it is infused with a bronze alloy. At SHOT 2012, there was a company exhibiting which uses 3-D metal printing technology to make low-volume parts. Here's an artist who uses the process to create her sculptures. She describes it in some detail. http://www.bathsheba.com/sculpt/process/ Here's the company that prints her designs. http://www.exone.com/materialization...lization/metal There's a video on their website that shows the process and explains it. __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?

July 28, 2012, 01:09 AM	#15
JohnKSa Staff Join Date: February 12, 2001 Location: DFW Area Posts: 24,990	It was just a small booth, but they did have some interesting displays. They had one printed part that was the front sight and gas block of an AR-15. I suspect they aren't quite ready to print parts that really require a lot of strength like barrels and bolts, but I think they could make just about anything else. __________________ Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?

July 31, 2012, 11:28 PM	#16
DaleA Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2002 Location: Twin Cities, MN Posts: 5,313	A 1960's science fiction book "Space, Space, Space" http://www.amazon.com/Space-William-.../dp/B000K7IMRQ had a fun (and rather right-wing politically) story about a space ship repair shop that boasted they could repair any ship in space. One of the processes they had to obtain by hook or crook was the 'molecular spray'. Shrug. I see the 3-d printer stuff and wonder if I can even wonder what will come next. (Of course for mass production you really need the Star Trek replicators!)