DIY Urban Rifle Training

smince · April 30, 2005, 07:26 AM

I haven't been able to attend any Urban Rifle courses. My last traing in this was in the USAF, many years ago. So, this is what I have hit upon. It may work for you, and I'd appreciate any comments/criticisms on my tactics.

What I've done is run my Defensive Pistol drills, only with a rifle/shotgun.

Example:

If you practice the speed rock at 3 yards, try bringing the long gun up from low-ready to a kind of point-shooting position.

Most of my pistol drills are run at 3, 5, 7, 10, and 15 yards, with occasional 25 and 50 practice. When I run the drills with a long gun, I do the same exercises, i.e.: weak hand, one-handed, multiple-target, etc. I also practice at longer ranges with the rifle.

I've run these exercises with AR15, lever guns, SKS, and pistol caliber carbines.

My theory is if used at handgun ranges (like most urban gunfights will be), then why not use the same basic drills?

STEVE M · May 1, 2005, 07:18 AM

I think you are off to a good start. (haven't been able to take any civilian

courses yet either). You may want to double the distances or decrease the

times for the rifle drills. Remember, the rifles main advantage is reach. Also

try the drills from field shooting positions. You may also want to include

transition drills to the handgun. I've been looking for training drills on the web

for carbines but not much luck so far.

smince · May 1, 2005, 02:01 PM

I'm not sure about "doubling" the distance. The definition of "urban rifle" is using a rifle at what is normally handgun distance.

Shooting at distance and from field positions isn't a problem. That's about all I've ever been taught with a rifle.

I do need to work on the transition drills. Check out the Thunder Ranch Urban Rifle and Gunsite Tactical Carbine videos. They have good ideas for training.

LAK · May 3, 2005, 05:14 AM

I think being able use any rifle up close has merit. Even in the hunting field one ocassionally get's a snapshot at something right up close. However I think the close-up emphasis that seems to be ubiquitous with the term "urban rifle" is error.

Certainly one ought to be able to employ a rifle at contact and short distances, but in addition to being cluttered the urban environment can have some very long open spaces depending on exactly where you live. I have one street nearby that opens things up to about a quarter mile in one direction and a half mile in the other. A short distance away an intersection with another street changes this to as far as the eye can see save the obstruction of overhanging streetlights, signs, various storefronts, etc.

There is no reason to assume that the use of a rifle in the defense role will be static on ones own property. One might be compelled to move during a time of disturbance, changing from the familiar of your home surroundings to areas with taller buildings, open parking areas and long streets etc. So I would be inclined to shoot a variety of close, short to moderate range drills - and some practice representing the practical maximum range of your rifle or carbine.

My first recommendation, if you haven't already, is get hold of a copy of Col. Cooper's The Art of the Rifle. Read, study and practice it. It is not a long read, is quite concise, and there is probably not a single other written work IMO that is a better foundation to build on; from his treatment of gun handling in the context of the rifle on up.

jonathon · May 3, 2005, 03:22 PM

Interesting skill to know.. not sure if I would ever need it though, 'cause even if the SHTF, I'll be campin in the middle of no where for a while.

smince · May 3, 2005, 06:14 PM

Yes, I am familiar with all the Colonel's writings.

Now, I'm not necessarily talking about an SHTF scenario. I tend to pick up a long gun anytime a situation is questionable, unless I'm away from home/vehicle and a handgun is all I'm carrying. Therefore, yes, I realize I may have to use one from "contact to way out there". I'm just developing a training routine for (hopefully) any situation that arises. As I have stated, I already know how to shoot at distance. It's like the cops found out long ago: Just because you were a great bullseye shooter didn't mean you could hit under pressure.

LAK · May 4, 2005, 03:17 AM

Col. Cooper's El Presidente can be well adapted to the rifle - and can be varied starting with the ten yard distance on out.

STEVE M · May 4, 2005, 04:47 AM

Let me try to clarify what I meant by doubling the distance. If you are doing say an El Presidente (normally shot at 10 meters with a handgun). Then try shooting it in the same amount of time with your rifle, but shoot it at 20 meters. You can also try to shoot it at 10 meters in 1/2 the time. If you practice speed rocks at 2 ft, try them with a rifle at 4ft.
What I'm trying to get at is that a rifle is easier to hit with so you need to make your training standards harder than for a handgun.

LAK · May 5, 2005, 05:42 AM

I think drills like El Presidente could be extended to 50 even 100 yards or more for rifle. Or introduce other variations; headshots at 50 for the second string for example.

Some may argue that engaging three targets offhand (standing) with a rifle at 100 yards in the open is the wrong way to go. But El Presidente is an exercize in gun handling etc - not a tactical drill. But one can introduce tactic; instead of pivoting then engaging - drop to prone and engage. Or move to nearby cover and shoot over the barricade, barricade-right, barricade-left. Different forms of cover and firing positions varied accordingly.

Shoot don't-shoots could be mixed in by a third party helper, either in picture-target form, number or color code - with a blind start. Picture types with various weapons make it interesting in that the greatest or most imminent threat should be neutralized first.

If you are fortunate enough to have your own property on which to build and play, you could construct a small course with pop-ups which can also have shoot don't-shoots and various threat priority targets mixed in.

April 30, 2005, 07:26 AM	#1
smince Junior member Join Date: October 9, 2004 Location: Northeast Alabama Posts: 2,580	DIY Urban Rifle Training I haven't been able to attend any Urban Rifle courses. My last traing in this was in the USAF, many years ago. So, this is what I have hit upon. It may work for you, and I'd appreciate any comments/criticisms on my tactics. What I've done is run my Defensive Pistol drills, only with a rifle/shotgun. Example: If you practice the speed rock at 3 yards, try bringing the long gun up from low-ready to a kind of point-shooting position. Most of my pistol drills are run at 3, 5, 7, 10, and 15 yards, with occasional 25 and 50 practice. When I run the drills with a long gun, I do the same exercises, i.e.: weak hand, one-handed, multiple-target, etc. I also practice at longer ranges with the rifle. I've run these exercises with AR15, lever guns, SKS, and pistol caliber carbines. My theory is if used at handgun ranges (like most urban gunfights will be), then why not use the same basic drills?

May 1, 2005, 07:18 AM	#2
STEVE M Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 1999 Location: TN. USA Posts: 607	I think you are off to a good start. (haven't been able to take any civilian courses yet either). You may want to double the distances or decrease the times for the rifle drills. Remember, the rifles main advantage is reach. Also try the drills from field shooting positions. You may also want to include transition drills to the handgun. I've been looking for training drills on the web for carbines but not much luck so far. __________________ MOLON LABE! I've joined the 300.

May 3, 2005, 03:22 PM	#5
jonathon Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2005 Location: Washougal, Washington. YEHAW! Posts: 1,872	Interesting skill to know.. not sure if I would ever need it though, 'cause even if the SHTF, I'll be campin in the middle of no where for a while. __________________ Romans 12:21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good More CZ M52 info than you can shake a stick at!

May 4, 2005, 04:47 AM	#8
STEVE M Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 1999 Location: TN. USA Posts: 607	Let me try to clarify what I meant by doubling the distance. If you are doing say an El Presidente (normally shot at 10 meters with a handgun). Then try shooting it in the same amount of time with your rifle, but shoot it at 20 meters. You can also try to shoot it at 10 meters in 1/2 the time. If you practice speed rocks at 2 ft, try them with a rifle at 4ft. What I'm trying to get at is that a rifle is easier to hit with so you need to make your training standards harder than for a handgun. __________________ MOLON LABE! I've joined the 300.

May 1, 2005, 02:01 PM	#3
smince Junior member Join Date: October 9, 2004 Location: Northeast Alabama Posts: 2,580	I'm not sure about "doubling" the distance. The definition of "urban rifle" is using a rifle at what is normally handgun distance. Shooting at distance and from field positions isn't a problem. That's about all I've ever been taught with a rifle. I do need to work on the transition drills. Check out the Thunder Ranch Urban Rifle and Gunsite Tactical Carbine videos. They have good ideas for training.

May 3, 2005, 05:14 AM	#4
LAK Junior member Join Date: May 14, 2002 Posts: 2,251	I think being able use any rifle up close has merit. Even in the hunting field one ocassionally get's a snapshot at something right up close. However I think the close-up emphasis that seems to be ubiquitous with the term "urban rifle" is error. Certainly one ought to be able to employ a rifle at contact and short distances, but in addition to being cluttered the urban environment can have some very long open spaces depending on exactly where you live. I have one street nearby that opens things up to about a quarter mile in one direction and a half mile in the other. A short distance away an intersection with another street changes this to as far as the eye can see save the obstruction of overhanging streetlights, signs, various storefronts, etc. There is no reason to assume that the use of a rifle in the defense role will be static on ones own property. One might be compelled to move during a time of disturbance, changing from the familiar of your home surroundings to areas with taller buildings, open parking areas and long streets etc. So I would be inclined to shoot a variety of close, short to moderate range drills - and some practice representing the practical maximum range of your rifle or carbine. My first recommendation, if you haven't already, is get hold of a copy of Col. Cooper's The Art of the Rifle. Read, study and practice it. It is not a long read, is quite concise, and there is probably not a single other written work IMO that is a better foundation to build on; from his treatment of gun handling in the context of the rifle on up.

May 3, 2005, 06:14 PM	#6
smince Junior member Join Date: October 9, 2004 Location: Northeast Alabama Posts: 2,580	Yes, I am familiar with all the Colonel's writings. Now, I'm not necessarily talking about an SHTF scenario. I tend to pick up a long gun anytime a situation is questionable, unless I'm away from home/vehicle and a handgun is all I'm carrying. Therefore, yes, I realize I may have to use one from "contact to way out there". I'm just developing a training routine for (hopefully) any situation that arises. As I have stated, I already know how to shoot at distance. It's like the cops found out long ago: Just because you were a great bullseye shooter didn't mean you could hit under pressure.

May 4, 2005, 03:17 AM	#7
LAK Junior member Join Date: May 14, 2002 Posts: 2,251	Col. Cooper's El Presidente can be well adapted to the rifle - and can be varied starting with the ten yard distance on out.

May 5, 2005, 05:42 AM	#9
LAK Junior member Join Date: May 14, 2002 Posts: 2,251	I think drills like El Presidente could be extended to 50 even 100 yards or more for rifle. Or introduce other variations; headshots at 50 for the second string for example. Some may argue that engaging three targets offhand (standing) with a rifle at 100 yards in the open is the wrong way to go. But El Presidente is an exercize in gun handling etc - not a tactical drill. But one can introduce tactic; instead of pivoting then engaging - drop to prone and engage. Or move to nearby cover and shoot over the barricade, barricade-right, barricade-left. Different forms of cover and firing positions varied accordingly. Shoot don't-shoots could be mixed in by a third party helper, either in picture-target form, number or color code - with a blind start. Picture types with various weapons make it interesting in that the greatest or most imminent threat should be neutralized first. If you are fortunate enough to have your own property on which to build and play, you could construct a small course with pop-ups which can also have shoot don't-shoots and various threat priority targets mixed in.