.410?

bk688 · January 26, 2012, 02:36 PM

My local state park only allows squirrel hunting with a shot gun, hence relegating my 22lr to the range.

Then I thought, "Ya know, thats a good excuse to buy a new gun!" I like multi-purpose tools, so I looked into a .410 (the Circuit Judge to be exact). I figured I could use slugs on deer too. Then I found out that you cant use .410 on deer in Illinois. That doesn't necessarily exclude the Circuit Judge because I've heard SEVERAL times that there planning on changing the law to allow for pistol caliber cartridges (which they're defining as a rimmed, strait walled cartridge) used in rifles for deer hunting.

With this, I thought I had a few good questions:

1. How has everyone's experience with .410 on squirrels been?

2. (the more important one) Whats the logic (just speculate a bit) behind not allowing a .410 on deer? A 1/4 oz (109 grain) slug traveling 1900 fps cant be too far behind a 123 grain 7.62x39 traveling 2300 fps and from what I've read, using 7.62x39 and even .223 is fairly common in states that allow rifle hunting.

derekb · January 26, 2012, 03:16 PM

Quote:

2. (the more important one) Whats the logic (just speculate a bit) behind not allowing a .410 on deer?

I don't know that it's fair to assume any logic at all went into that choice. Hunting regulations don't always make much sense.

PawPaw · January 26, 2012, 06:01 PM

My wife has a pump .410 shotgun that her Daddy bought for her when she was a pre-teen. She hunts squirrels with it and shoots hand-thrown skeet with it during our annual family skeet shoot. She's also got a 4" Model 28, but that's another topic altogether.

My lady has shot bushels of squirrels with that .410 shotgun, over the course of several decades. Use #6 lead shot and don't try to shoot them out of the tops of tall pine trees. The pattern gets a little sparse outside of 30 yards or so. Otherwise, it works just fine

jrothWA · January 26, 2012, 08:46 PM

3/4 of a ounce. You be somewhat limited in range for squirrels unless you get
close.

BUT the .410 will also, chamber hte .45 LC round, is that a option??

.410 doesn't meet minimum energy levels to humaely take a deer. that why some states invoke these minimums.

20 ga., is better as you can get slug barrels to handle deer.

Good luck deciding.

Cowboy_mo · January 26, 2012, 09:32 PM

I have quit using my .410 for squirrels for several reasons. First, it is very difficult to find any ammo around here except #4 shot which provides very few pellets for a pattern and the darn things are expensive.

MO used to prohibit the use of .410 slugs for deer hunting but that changed 2-3 years ago. Fortunately, MO has allowed the use of centerfire rifles (.243 and up) forever so I never really cared about slug hunting.

If I have to shotgun hunt for the squirrels (certain conservation areas and when the trees are full of green leaves) I use the 20 guage.

hogdogs · January 26, 2012, 09:54 PM

Quote:

BUT the .410 will also, chamber hte .45 LC round, is that a option??

NEGATIVE A .45 Colt may May fit in the chamber but to fire it in a gun not designated for their use is a KABOOM waitin' to happen...

Some .45 Colt chambers handle a .410 of either length...

Brent

SRE · January 26, 2012, 09:55 PM

My old Iver Johnson .410 and myself have taken plenty of squirrels. You do have to get closer to them obviously. For me it makes for a more interesting hunt. #6 shot to #4 is what I use.

A trick that is proficient in squirrel hunting: When a squirrel is on the base of a tree (from the ground up to where the tree starts to branch out) and sees you it will usually run slightly up the tree but more so go to the back, it go 180 degrees around to the other side. If you have a stick or rock near, throw is past the tree around to the back where the squirrel is. Almost all the time, it will come back around to your side so you can take a shot. This tip has helped me, especially when hunting with a .410 bore as you can get closer in between the time from when the squirrel goes to the back of the tree to when you throw your object and it comes back to your side.

Good luck, safe hunting.

KenL · January 26, 2012, 10:07 PM

I used a .410 for squirrels a lot when I was a kid. Got lots of them,, bunnies and a couple of ruffed grouse and pheasants too. H&R single shot. It was fun. I used 3" shells, 7 1/2 shot, and got relatively close.

Maybe that's something for me to try again. I haven't fired that gun in years.

Keg · January 26, 2012, 10:46 PM

My cousin told me..when he was younger..he shot 2 different deer with a 410 slug....Both ran off and were not recovered....

bk688 · January 26, 2012, 11:02 PM

jrothWA

DON'T PUT A .45 LC IN A .410 CHAMBER!!!!!!! Check out the Rossi/Taurus Circuit Judge which is specifically chambered for both. Check it out on Cheaperthandirt.com under the shotgun tap. Its a revolving shotgun.

As far as a .410 having enough energy to drop a deer, thats more about shot placement than anything isn't it? I have a co-worker who's father gets varmint tags for deer (Lucky SOB can shoot them with whatever he wants because its technically not hunting) and has dropped a few deer with a .410. He said the were about 25 yards away, but it dropped them just like a 12 gauge. The experience is limited though because he usually uses a .30-06. Again, because it's not hunting, he's not bound by the whole "no rifle/caliber restriction" hunting laws.
========And yes, he did run that by the conservation officer.===========

bqglock · January 26, 2012, 11:25 PM

Quote:

A .45 Colt may May fit in the chamber but to fire it in a gun not designated for their use is a KABOOM waitin' to happen...

go to the rossi website http://www.rossiusa.com/product-list.cfm?category=15

the circut judge is a viable option for the 45 colt

also check out

http://www.gunsandammo.com/video/colt-circuit-judge/

natman · January 27, 2012, 05:14 AM

A 45 Colt in a 410 chamber is not safe, as has been mentioned. Also, the OP said:

Quote:

My local state park only allows squirrel hunting with a shot gun

I don't think the game warden would be amused to find you shooting a bullet into the air, even if technically it was fired from a shotgun.

There is a big difference between a 410 slug and a 7.62x39 bullet. A 123 grain 30 caliber bullet is somewhat light for its caliber. A 109 grain 410 slug is ridiculously light for its caliber. It has a very low sectional density, a function of weight for diameter, and won't penetrate very well. Couple that with the poor accuracy of a projectile fired from a smoothbore with no sights and you have a recipe for wounding.

hogdogs · January 27, 2012, 09:10 AM

The taurus is a .45 colt revolver able to fire a .410 shotshell...
It is not a .410 pistol firing the .45 colt...

Brent

hogdogs · January 27, 2012, 09:13 AM

The taurus is not a smoothbore... it doughnuts shot patterns. As for slugs, most said they were dismal...

THe taurus is a gun that does a few more things than a standard design but it does nothing as well as a single ammo firing weapon...

Brent

Art Eatman · January 27, 2012, 10:01 AM

I've looked at a Circuit Judge. A look was enough. I don't even want to hold one of those silly things, much less own one. One of those deals, "I'd sure hate to be seen in public with that."

A .410 shotgun is probably the most practical squirrel gun a person can use. Light weight, low noise, negligible recoil...

rickyrick · January 27, 2012, 11:48 AM

If it shot 45 colt decently, I would be interested, if not, it would be useless.

Irish B · January 27, 2012, 02:45 PM

http://thefiringline.com/forums/show...light=410+deer

msnden · January 27, 2012, 05:32 PM

The 410 is great for squirrels, But the 410 is NOT a shotgun, 410 is the bore if the 410 were a shotgun its gauge would be a 65 gauge (or therebouts)

Art Eatman · January 27, 2012, 06:09 PM

I figure a smoothbore tube meant for shooting shot is a shotgun.

I also note that picking fly poop out of pepper is not a remunerative career.

SHNOMIDO · January 27, 2012, 06:17 PM

I dunno... I got a couple .410's and theyre all shotguns.

Also, im not a hunter, but I'm under the impression they make, and you can use, buckshot in .410 for deer.

There's like 4 00 buckshot in the shell, and you just get 4 hits instead of 14ish.

But like i said, i dont know much of anything about hunting. Anyone confirm/deny/comment? Whats the viability of .410 buckshot on deer?

derekb · January 27, 2012, 08:25 PM

Quote:

The 410 is great for squirrels, But the 410 is NOT a shotgun, 410 is the bore if the 410 were a shotgun its gauge would be a 65 gauge (or therebouts)

Rather, the .410 is not a gauge, it's a bore. Shotguns can be chambered in .410 bore.

msnden · January 27, 2012, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Rather, the .410 is not a gauge, it's a bore. Shotguns can be chambered in .410 bore

They certainly can, & a .410 bore would make about a 67 gauge

Sport45 · January 27, 2012, 09:30 PM

I have a .410 and it would be great for squirrel and other little critters like that. But I wouln't suggest buying one. The cost of ammo is way too much for what you get.

Buy a 12ga or 20ga instead. They are cheaper to shoot and a heckuva lot more versatile.

bamaranger · January 28, 2012, 02:35 AM

Don't know abut squirrels, but my Dad and I killed a ton of rabbits with the .410. Load was 3" shell and 7-1/2 shot. Always.

Biggest problem I see w/ .410, or rather its application, is use of shot size too large. Even a load of #6 shot is pretty sparse from a .410.

I found a small supply of the short 2-3/4 shell loaded with #8, and suspect that will be a good load as well, but have not hunted it.

natman · January 28, 2012, 04:33 AM

Quote:

The 410 is great for squirrels, But the 410 is NOT a shotgun, 410 is the bore if the 410 were a shotgun its gauge would be a 65 gauge (or therebouts)

The 410 is most certainly a shotgun, even though it does not use the usual gauge designation. That's not what determines a shotgun, it's more important that it's a smoothbore.

January 26, 2012, 02:36 PM	#1
bk688 Member Join Date: May 24, 2009 Posts: 53	.410? My local state park only allows squirrel hunting with a shot gun, hence relegating my 22lr to the range. Then I thought, "Ya know, thats a good excuse to buy a new gun!" I like multi-purpose tools, so I looked into a .410 (the Circuit Judge to be exact). I figured I could use slugs on deer too. Then I found out that you cant use .410 on deer in Illinois. That doesn't necessarily exclude the Circuit Judge because I've heard SEVERAL times that there planning on changing the law to allow for pistol caliber cartridges (which they're defining as a rimmed, strait walled cartridge) used in rifles for deer hunting. With this, I thought I had a few good questions: 1. How has everyone's experience with .410 on squirrels been? 2. (the more important one) Whats the logic (just speculate a bit) behind not allowing a .410 on deer? A 1/4 oz (109 grain) slug traveling 1900 fps cant be too far behind a 123 grain 7.62x39 traveling 2300 fps and from what I've read, using 7.62x39 and even .223 is fairly common in states that allow rifle hunting.

January 26, 2012, 06:01 PM	#3
PawPaw Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2010 Location: Central Louisiana Posts: 3,137	My wife has a pump .410 shotgun that her Daddy bought for her when she was a pre-teen. She hunts squirrels with it and shoots hand-thrown skeet with it during our annual family skeet shoot. She's also got a 4" Model 28, but that's another topic altogether. My lady has shot bushels of squirrels with that .410 shotgun, over the course of several decades. Use #6 lead shot and don't try to shoot them out of the tops of tall pine trees. The pattern gets a little sparse outside of 30 yards or so. Otherwise, it works just fine __________________ Dennis Dezendorf http://pawpawshouse.blogspot.com

January 26, 2012, 09:32 PM	#5
Cowboy_mo Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2010 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,039	Don't know about the slugs but I have quit using my .410 for squirrels for several reasons. First, it is very difficult to find any ammo around here except #4 shot which provides very few pellets for a pattern and the darn things are expensive. MO used to prohibit the use of .410 slugs for deer hunting but that changed 2-3 years ago. Fortunately, MO has allowed the use of centerfire rifles (.243 and up) forever so I never really cared about slug hunting. If I have to shotgun hunt for the squirrels (certain conservation areas and when the trees are full of green leaves) I use the 20 guage.

January 26, 2012, 09:55 PM	#7
SRE Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2011 Location: Southern York County, PA Posts: 145	My old Iver Johnson .410 and myself have taken plenty of squirrels. You do have to get closer to them obviously. For me it makes for a more interesting hunt. #6 shot to #4 is what I use. A trick that is proficient in squirrel hunting: When a squirrel is on the base of a tree (from the ground up to where the tree starts to branch out) and sees you it will usually run slightly up the tree but more so go to the back, it go 180 degrees around to the other side. If you have a stick or rock near, throw is past the tree around to the back where the squirrel is. Almost all the time, it will come back around to your side so you can take a shot. This tip has helped me, especially when hunting with a .410 bore as you can get closer in between the time from when the squirrel goes to the back of the tree to when you throw your object and it comes back to your side. Good luck, safe hunting. __________________ Combat Commander

January 26, 2012, 10:46 PM	#9
Keg Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2011 Location: Freestone County, Texas Posts: 1,133	My cousin told me..when he was younger..he shot 2 different deer with a 410 slug....Both ran off and were not recovered.... __________________ Hog Hunters never die........They just reload.........

January 26, 2012, 08:46 PM	#4
jrothWA Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2006 Posts: 2,519	Max load for .410 is... 3/4 of a ounce. You be somewhat limited in range for squirrels unless you get close. BUT the .410 will also, chamber hte .45 LC round, is that a option?? .410 doesn't meet minimum energy levels to humaely take a deer. that why some states invoke these minimums. 20 ga., is better as you can get slug barrels to handle deer. Good luck deciding.

January 26, 2012, 10:07 PM	#8
KenL Senior Member Join Date: May 11, 2011 Location: Colorado Posts: 218	I used a .410 for squirrels a lot when I was a kid. Got lots of them,, bunnies and a couple of ruffed grouse and pheasants too. H&R single shot. It was fun. I used 3" shells, 7 1/2 shot, and got relatively close. Maybe that's something for me to try again. I haven't fired that gun in years.

January 26, 2012, 11:02 PM	#10
bk688 Member Join Date: May 24, 2009 Posts: 53	jrothWA DON'T PUT A .45 LC IN A .410 CHAMBER!!!!!!! Check out the Rossi/Taurus Circuit Judge which is specifically chambered for both. Check it out on Cheaperthandirt.com under the shotgun tap. Its a revolving shotgun. As far as a .410 having enough energy to drop a deer, thats more about shot placement than anything isn't it? I have a co-worker who's father gets varmint tags for deer (Lucky SOB can shoot them with whatever he wants because its technically not hunting) and has dropped a few deer with a .410. He said the were about 25 yards away, but it dropped them just like a 12 gauge. The experience is limited though because he usually uses a .30-06. Again, because it's not hunting, he's not bound by the whole "no rifle/caliber restriction" hunting laws. ========And yes, he did run that by the conservation officer.===========

January 27, 2012, 09:10 AM	#13
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	The taurus is a .45 colt revolver able to fire a .410 shotshell... It is not a .410 pistol firing the .45 colt... Brent

January 27, 2012, 09:13 AM	#14
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	The taurus is not a smoothbore... it doughnuts shot patterns. As for slugs, most said they were dismal... THe taurus is a gun that does a few more things than a standard design but it does nothing as well as a single ammo firing weapon... Brent

January 27, 2012, 10:01 AM	#15
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	I've looked at a Circuit Judge. A look was enough. I don't even want to hold one of those silly things, much less own one. One of those deals, "I'd sure hate to be seen in public with that." A .410 shotgun is probably the most practical squirrel gun a person can use. Light weight, low noise, negligible recoil...

January 27, 2012, 11:48 AM	#16
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	If it shot 45 colt decently, I would be interested, if not, it would be useless. __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

January 27, 2012, 02:45 PM	#17
Irish B Senior Member Join Date: October 10, 2010 Location: Colorado Posts: 359	http://thefiringline.com/forums/show...light=410+deer __________________ If a man hasn't found something worth dying for, he isn't fit to live

January 27, 2012, 05:32 PM	#18
msnden Member Join Date: December 15, 2009 Posts: 57	The 410 is great for squirrels, But the 410 is NOT a shotgun, 410 is the bore if the 410 were a shotgun its gauge would be a 65 gauge (or therebouts)

January 27, 2012, 06:09 PM	#19
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	I figure a smoothbore tube meant for shooting shot is a shotgun. I also note that picking fly poop out of pepper is not a remunerative career.

January 27, 2012, 06:17 PM	#20
SHNOMIDO Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2011 Location: Illinois Posts: 423	I dunno... I got a couple .410's and theyre all shotguns. Also, im not a hunter, but I'm under the impression they make, and you can use, buckshot in .410 for deer. There's like 4 00 buckshot in the shell, and you just get 4 hits instead of 14ish. But like i said, i dont know much of anything about hunting. Anyone confirm/deny/comment? Whats the viability of .410 buckshot on deer?

January 27, 2012, 09:30 PM	#23
Sport45 Senior Member Join Date: May 25, 1999 Location: Too close to Houston Posts: 4,196	I have a .410 and it would be great for squirrel and other little critters like that. But I wouln't suggest buying one. The cost of ammo is way too much for what you get. Buy a 12ga or 20ga instead. They are cheaper to shoot and a heckuva lot more versatile. __________________ Proud member of the NRA and Texas State Rifle Association. Registered and active voter.

January 28, 2012, 02:35 AM	#24
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,300	.410 Don't know abut squirrels, but my Dad and I killed a ton of rabbits with the .410. Load was 3" shell and 7-1/2 shot. Always. Biggest problem I see w/ .410, or rather its application, is use of shot size too large. Even a load of #6 shot is pretty sparse from a .410. I found a small supply of the short 2-3/4 shell loaded with #8, and suspect that will be a good load as well, but have not hunted it.