Do you crimp for your semi-autos?

Jamie Young · October 5, 2002, 12:05 AM

Yes or No?

I'm shooting up a bunch of my previously reloaded ammo tomorrow (Saturday) with the help of several TFL members. I'm shooting up all my .223 reloads and gotta decide on my next approach at reloading....RELIABILITY!

I got the whole accuracy thing down for all of my firearms. All of my handgun rounds are flawless. All of my 30/06 rounds are flawless. All of my .223 rounds are not 100% reliable. Stuck cases occur every once in awhile.

I know what Steve Smith says

but I wanna see what the rest of you do?

I'll try sizing my cases better without crimping. All of my stuff is all ready reloaded 3000rds.

caz223 · October 5, 2002, 03:00 AM

A few questions...
Do you neck size or full length resize?
Have you cleaned your chamber lately?
Not diggin' on ya or anything, a lot of people clean their gun from the muzzle, and the chamber never gets clean. Flitz it with a patch and see if it still does it.
Also, what weight bullets are you using, at what speed, and what twist is your rifle?

Cee-Zed · October 5, 2002, 03:12 AM

Yes. Crimping is good for something other than reliability too. It seems to improve accuracy in .308 for me. I have the dies and some components for 7.62x39, but I haven't loaded one round yet (after over two years). It would probably help it also.

I don't have a .223. Not ragging them, just not my thing.

Steve Smith · October 5, 2002, 09:37 AM

I guess I shouldn't have voted. Just keep in mind that I did so your results are slightly tainted.

Full length size (if using RCBS dies, use the Small Base, otherwise just Full Length)

Clean Chamber (does not have to be spotless, by any means though)

Most sizing lube kinda wiped off if you have the time

No weak loads.

No need for crimp.

Gun should go BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM

As much as you want.

BTW, a few statistics, and some educated guessing:

In NRA Highpower, as of June 2002, Across the Course there were:

MK 6,000
SS 2,500
EX 3,400
MA 3,100
HM 740

Its probably save to say that 80% of those folks are using the AR-15. (probably 12% are using an M1 Garand or M1A, and the remainder are using various match rifles)

Of those, ignore the MK and SS class when considering loading methods and accuracy. Besides that, the EX, MA, and HM classes shoot the most...almost weekly.

Of the EX, MA, and HM classes using the AR, I'd say that only 5% are crimping, with the majority of crimpers in the EX class. None of these guys can stand to have malfunctions.

Fatelvis · October 5, 2002, 10:51 AM

Ive reloaded for the M1A (308), with FL sizing, match bullets, and no crimp. In the past 4000 rnds (+/- 300), I havent had one malfunction. Just make sure you have adequit (sp?) neck tension, and there is no outward "flare" of the neck, that could snag something, and cause a malfuntion.

Southla1 · October 5, 2002, 01:03 PM

I voted no but let me say this. If I am loading 147 Gr FMJ with a crimping groove in 30-06 for my Garand I do crimp. When loading the 173 Gr match or Sierra 168 Grain Match kings (used to be called International) there is not even a cannulere (or however the hell you spell it) on the bullet to crimp it.

I FL size with a RCBS regular die set and seat to the proper lenght and shoot. IF the neck tension is not tight enough to hold them in place there is something seriously wrong with the rifle.

Southla1 · October 5, 2002, 07:13 PM

Don I am in the same boat as you...............I have loaded tons of ought six for an M-1 and for a Remington 742 (predecessor of the 7400) with just the regular RCBS 06 dies..............never had a problem............if it ain't broke don't fix it.

Cee-Zed · October 5, 2002, 08:52 PM

I started crimping for semi-auto rifles because the manual said to. Later, I found out it wasn't really necssary for feed. The problem is that if you take your pet load, which you worked up with a crimp, and stop crimping it, it ain't the same load any more!

Jamie Young · October 5, 2002, 09:34 PM

Yes I do clean all of my chambers EVERY time I clean my guns. I think some of my reloads should have been in the tumbler a little longer too. They were a little dirty.

I just got back from the range today. I shot up 75rds I just reloaded 2 days ago and had ZERO failures in my AR. I also ran a few of my reloads threw the sizing die with the decapping pin out just to see if they fed ok. I fired about 300rds of my M193 clone loads and NONE of them malfunctioned.

I think I'll retire my .223 crimping die. I'll hold onto the 45acp crimping die though.

blades67 · October 5, 2002, 11:06 PM

I crimp my semi-auto loads, but just ever so slightly.

sricciardelli · October 6, 2002, 04:29 AM

Taper crimp semi-auto handguns only...

CHAINSAW · October 6, 2002, 07:42 PM

All my 9mm are not crimped. Use the same load in 3 s/a pistols and one s/a carbine with no failures.

All my higher power rifles are single shots with no need to crimp.

My AR Oly does have some problems with FTF with all ammo reloads included. Hoping to get enough rounds thru it to see if things iron out.

A Fine is a Tax for doing wrong-A Tax is Fine for doing well-------Chainsaw

Gewehr98 · October 6, 2002, 08:36 PM

I got lazy one time and decided not to crimp my 7.62x39 handloads. That was the last time I did that. The bullets pushed right back into the case during a string of fire, causing a jam. Neck tension just wasn't enough, and I don't have any of that asphaltum bullet sealer.

I don't crimp so hard I mess up the bullets, but I do use the Lee Factory Crimp die on my .223 Remington, 7.62x39, 7.62x45, .308 M14NM and BM-59 rounds, and .30-06 Garand and BAR loads. ALL my autoloading handgun loads, and my magnum revolver loads, get crimped.

tex_n_cal · October 11, 2002, 01:14 AM

Don't forget that cleaning all traces of lube off the inside of the neck is vital to getting a tight bullet fit. On semi-auto rifles with bottleneck cases I usually throw them back in the tumbler after sizing, to make sure the inside of the necks are dry.

Of course, if you get carbide dies no lube is required

waynzwld · October 11, 2002, 03:13 PM

I use the Lee factory crimp die on almost all of my laods. Most all loads have improved grouping after doing this. it is adjustable for how much force and it uses a collet type of crimper. I usually use just enough crimp to make the neck tension all the same. If you screw it in, it will MAKE its own cannelure in anytype bullet.

View Poll Results: Do you crimp for your semi-autos?
Yes	35	67.31%
No	17	32.69%
Voters: 52. You may not vote on this poll

October 5, 2002, 12:05 AM	#1
Jamie Young Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2000 Location: SE/PA Posts: 4,834	Do you crimp for your semi-autos? Yes or No? I'm shooting up a bunch of my previously reloaded ammo tomorrow (Saturday) with the help of several TFL members. I'm shooting up all my .223 reloads and gotta decide on my next approach at reloading....RELIABILITY! I got the whole accuracy thing down for all of my firearms. All of my handgun rounds are flawless. All of my 30/06 rounds are flawless. All of my .223 rounds are not 100% reliable. Stuck cases occur every once in awhile. I know what Steve Smith says but I wanna see what the rest of you do? I'll try sizing my cases better without crimping. All of my stuff is all ready reloaded 3000rds. __________________ Find out about Gun Shows and Training activities. www.TheRallyPoint.org Get your gun club involved!!

October 5, 2002, 03:00 AM	#2
caz223 Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,429	A few questions... Do you neck size or full length resize? Have you cleaned your chamber lately? Not diggin' on ya or anything, a lot of people clean their gun from the muzzle, and the chamber never gets clean. Flitz it with a patch and see if it still does it. Also, what weight bullets are you using, at what speed, and what twist is your rifle? __________________ I'm not just a gun. I'm YOUR gun. (Hold me.)

October 5, 2002, 09:37 AM	#4
Steve Smith Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 1999 Posts: 4,131	Oops I guess I shouldn't have voted. Just keep in mind that I did so your results are slightly tainted. Full length size (if using RCBS dies, use the Small Base, otherwise just Full Length) Clean Chamber (does not have to be spotless, by any means though) Most sizing lube kinda wiped off if you have the time No weak loads. No need for crimp. Gun should go BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM As much as you want. BTW, a few statistics, and some educated guessing: In NRA Highpower, as of June 2002, Across the Course there were: MK 6,000 SS 2,500 EX 3,400 MA 3,100 HM 740 Its probably save to say that 80% of those folks are using the AR-15. (probably 12% are using an M1 Garand or M1A, and the remainder are using various match rifles) Of those, ignore the MK and SS class when considering loading methods and accuracy. Besides that, the EX, MA, and HM classes shoot the most...almost weekly. Of the EX, MA, and HM classes using the AR, I'd say that only 5% are crimping, with the majority of crimpers in the EX class. None of these guys can stand to have malfunctions. __________________ Favor the X. Steve Smith NRA Life Member

October 5, 2002, 09:34 PM	#9
Jamie Young Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2000 Location: SE/PA Posts: 4,834	Yes I do clean all of my chambers EVERY time I clean my guns. I think some of my reloads should have been in the tumbler a little longer too. They were a little dirty. I just got back from the range today. I shot up 75rds I just reloaded 2 days ago and had ZERO failures in my AR. I also ran a few of my reloads threw the sizing die with the decapping pin out just to see if they fed ok. I fired about 300rds of my M193 clone loads and NONE of them malfunctioned. I think I'll retire my .223 crimping die. I'll hold onto the 45acp crimping die though. __________________ Find out about Gun Shows and Training activities. www.TheRallyPoint.org Get your gun club involved!!

October 5, 2002, 03:12 AM	#3
Cee-Zed Junior member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Posts: 481	Yes. Crimping is good for something other than reliability too. It seems to improve accuracy in .308 for me. I have the dies and some components for 7.62x39, but I haven't loaded one round yet (after over two years). It would probably help it also. I don't have a .223. Not ragging them, just not my thing.

October 5, 2002, 10:51 AM	#5
Fatelvis Senior Member Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Lockport, IL Posts: 490	Ive reloaded for the M1A (308), with FL sizing, match bullets, and no crimp. In the past 4000 rnds (+/- 300), I havent had one malfunction. Just make sure you have adequit (sp?) neck tension, and there is no outward "flare" of the neck, that could snag something, and cause a malfuntion.

October 5, 2002, 01:03 PM	#6
Southla1 Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 19, 2000 Location: Jeanerette, La. Near the Posts: 1,999	I voted no but let me say this. If I am loading 147 Gr FMJ with a crimping groove in 30-06 for my Garand I do crimp. When loading the 173 Gr match or Sierra 168 Grain Match kings (used to be called International) there is not even a cannulere (or however the hell you spell it) on the bullet to crimp it. I FL size with a RCBS regular die set and seat to the proper lenght and shoot. IF the neck tension is not tight enough to hold them in place there is something seriously wrong with the rifle.

October 5, 2002, 07:13 PM	#7
Southla1 Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 19, 2000 Location: Jeanerette, La. Near the Posts: 1,999	Don I am in the same boat as you...............I have loaded tons of ought six for an M-1 and for a Remington 742 (predecessor of the 7400) with just the regular RCBS 06 dies..............never had a problem............if it ain't broke don't fix it.

October 5, 2002, 08:52 PM	#8
Cee-Zed Junior member Join Date: March 2, 2002 Posts: 481	I started crimping for semi-auto rifles because the manual said to. Later, I found out it wasn't really necssary for feed. The problem is that if you take your pet load, which you worked up with a crimp, and stop crimping it, it ain't the same load any more!

October 5, 2002, 11:06 PM	#10
blades67 Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 1999 Location: Chandler, Arizona, USA Posts: 6,014	I crimp my semi-auto loads, but just ever so slightly. __________________ Guns cause crime like spoons cause Rosie O'Donnell to be fat! I hunt, therefore I am.

October 6, 2002, 04:29 AM	#11
sricciardelli Senior Member Join Date: August 13, 2001 Location: Montana Posts: 489	Taper crimp semi-auto handguns only... __________________ http://stevespages.com/page8.htm

October 6, 2002, 07:42 PM	#12
CHAINSAW Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 1999 Posts: 201	No and NO All my 9mm are not crimped. Use the same load in 3 s/a pistols and one s/a carbine with no failures. All my higher power rifles are single shots with no need to crimp. My AR Oly does have some problems with FTF with all ammo reloads included. Hoping to get enough rounds thru it to see if things iron out. A Fine is a Tax for doing wrong-A Tax is Fine for doing well-------Chainsaw

October 6, 2002, 08:36 PM	#13
Gewehr98 Senior Member Join Date: June 30, 2000 Location: Token Creek, WI Posts: 4,067	*I crimp autoloader rounds like a Moth&$@(~er!** I got lazy one time and decided not to crimp my 7.62x39 handloads. That was the last time I did that. The bullets pushed right back into the case during a string of fire, causing a jam. Neck tension just wasn't enough, and I don't have any of that asphaltum bullet sealer. I don't crimp so hard I mess up the bullets, but I do use the Lee Factory Crimp die on my .223 Remington, 7.62x39, 7.62x45, .308 M14NM and BM-59 rounds, and .30-06 Garand and BAR loads. ALL my autoloading handgun loads, and my magnum revolver loads, get crimped. __________________ "Bother", said Pooh, as he chambered another round... Neural Misfires

October 11, 2002, 01:14 AM	#14
tex_n_cal Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2002 Location: North Carolina! Posts: 308	Don't forget that cleaning all traces of lube off the inside of the neck is vital to getting a tight bullet fit. On semi-auto rifles with bottleneck cases I usually throw them back in the tumbler after sizing, to make sure the inside of the necks are dry. Of course, if you get carbide dies no lube is required __________________ With top loads & hard cast bullets, a .357 mag, .41 mag, .44 special, .44 mag, .45 Colt, .454 Casull, .475 Linebaugh, .480 Ruger, .500 Linebaugh Maximum, and .500 S&W will all shoot through Bison. To select the gun, determine how big a hole you want to put in the Bison, and how much recoil you can stand

October 11, 2002, 03:13 PM	#15
waynzwld Junior Member Join Date: October 3, 2002 Location: in the middle of nowhere Posts: 12	I use the Lee factory crimp die on almost all of my laods. Most all loads have improved grouping after doing this. it is adjustable for how much force and it uses a collet type of crimper. I usually use just enough crimp to make the neck tension all the same. If you screw it in, it will MAKE its own cannelure in anytype bullet.