What is this?

cwmax2000 · August 22, 2013, 02:22 AM

I found this in a coffee can that my father had. I think someone gave this to him before he died. What is it? I want to put it back together. Where can I get info on it? Serial #19621 ... (see full gun pic on next thread)

thanks Cmax

cwmax2000 · August 22, 2013, 02:25 AM

click on attachment for full pic of revolver.

Thx Cmax

BillCA · August 22, 2013, 05:57 AM

I'd say that was an Italian (Uberti or Pietta) reproduction of the 1848 Colt Dragoon revolver. The lever under the barrel is the loading arm, but you are missing the loading "ram" that connects to the lower pivot hole in the arm. This ram is pushed into the bottom chamber to push the ball down into the cylinder when reloading the gun.

Google "Colt dragoon revolver" and you should be able to find plenty of information and/or exploded parts diagrams.

lechiffre · August 22, 2013, 06:20 AM

It is a Copy of a Colt Navy not a Dragoon.

It does have a round Dragoon style barrel, rather than the octagon Navy style.
It is also .44 caliber, not .36

Bezoar · August 22, 2013, 06:35 AM

its a hodge podge gun. The frame is marked HAWES that can help put an importer on it. however the barrel is of the style marked as "1851 round navy civilian" by modern makers.

its not rare, and its brass.

eightclicknine · August 22, 2013, 06:49 AM

Sweet, is it for sale?

bedbugbilly · August 22, 2013, 07:31 AM

It looks to me like one of the pistols that used to be sold in the 60s - can't remember who had 'em - might have been Hawes - one was a "Yank" and the other was a "Reb". They weren't really copies of anything - they resembled the '51 Navy but with a round barrel. Dixie had 'em in those days as well as a lot of mail order companies that sold through gun magazines. But .. . . that's just a guess on my part.

Just because it's not a copy of any particular model - doesn't mean there's anything wrong with it though. I'd clean it up, put it all together and see how it does burning powder. If nothing more, put it on the wall to remind you of your Dad.

**Mike Irwin** · August 22, 2013, 11:10 AM

Hawes was a big importer of European made firearms from the 1950s through to I believe the early 1970s. IIRC GCA 1968 really crippled them and they went out of business.

Along with single-action Colt style revolvers made in Germany by Sauer, Hawes also imported black powder revolvers made in Italy.

Yours is obviously one of those guns.

swathdiver · August 22, 2013, 04:36 PM

That's a COM manufactured Griswold and Gunnison in .44 caliber. It was imported by Hawes out of Los Angeles and the date code indicates 1976 as the year of manufacture.

An accurate G&G reproduction would be in .36 caliber.

Fix it up and go shoot it!

MattShlock · August 23, 2013, 08:53 PM

Winner winner chicken dinner!

http://www.civilwarpreservations.com/newmus85.html

n5lyc · August 23, 2013, 11:04 PM

You could probably use the wedge, screws and loading ram from any of the pietta .44 1851 reproductions.
Parts are available from Dixie gun works.

Replacement nipples (if you need them) could either be the 6mm or the 5.5 sizes.

Oh, and don't et them get you down about it being brass framed, It was your dads, fix it up, load it with light loads, and enjoy it and his memory..

Keep us posted with the progress..

45 Bravo

brazosdave · August 24, 2013, 01:00 PM

Swathdiver beat me to it, lol! It's a G & G replica, I have an old Navy Arms Pietta, and my wife has a brand new Cabelas Pietta. Cool guns, the rebounded in popularity with the series "Hell on Wheels", because the protagonist carried a mocked up 60 that was spose to be a Griswold, which is weird because they are readily available, lol!

cwmax2000 · August 24, 2013, 08:38 PM

Thanks for all the Info... I will reassemble and fire it....

Cmax

cwmax2000 · August 25, 2013, 04:08 AM

OK, I need to know what to do to get the correct equipment and proper procedure for loading and firing this pistol. I have no experience with black powder at all...
any advice will be appreciated.

thanks Cmax

mykeal · August 25, 2013, 06:21 AM

There's a sticky thread at the top of this forum titled "So you want a cap and ball revolver?" Lots of good info in there.

August 22, 2013, 05:57 AM	#3
BillCA Senior Member Join Date: November 28, 2004 Location: Silicon Valley, Ca Posts: 7,117	I'd say that was an Italian (Uberti or Pietta) reproduction of the 1848 Colt Dragoon revolver. The lever under the barrel is the loading arm, but you are missing the loading "ram" that connects to the lower pivot hole in the arm. This ram is pushed into the bottom chamber to push the ball down into the cylinder when reloading the gun. Google "Colt dragoon revolver" and you should be able to find plenty of information and/or exploded parts diagrams. __________________ BillCA in CA (Unfortunately)

August 22, 2013, 06:20 AM	#4
lechiffre Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 2008 Location: phoenix,az Posts: 513	It is a Copy of a Colt Navy not a Dragoon. It does have a round Dragoon style barrel, rather than the octagon Navy style. It is also .44 caliber, not .36 __________________ if God hadn't meant us to shoot he wouldn't have given us trigger fingers do the interns get glocks ? Last edited by lechiffre; August 22, 2013 at 06:27 AM.

August 22, 2013, 07:31 AM	#7
bedbugbilly Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Posts: 3,287	It looks to me like one of the pistols that used to be sold in the 60s - can't remember who had 'em - might have been Hawes - one was a "Yank" and the other was a "Reb". They weren't really copies of anything - they resembled the '51 Navy but with a round barrel. Dixie had 'em in those days as well as a lot of mail order companies that sold through gun magazines. But .. . . that's just a guess on my part. Just because it's not a copy of any particular model - doesn't mean there's anything wrong with it though. I'd clean it up, put it all together and see how it does burning powder. If nothing more, put it on the wall to remind you of your Dad. __________________ If a pair of '51 Navies were good enough for Billy Hickok, then a single Navy on my right hip is good enough for me . . . besides . . . I'm probably only half as good as he was anyways. Hiram's Rangers Badge #63

August 22, 2013, 11:10 AM	#8
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,382	Hawes was a big importer of European made firearms from the 1950s through to I believe the early 1970s. IIRC GCA 1968 really crippled them and they went out of business. Along with single-action Colt style revolvers made in Germany by Sauer, Hawes also imported black powder revolvers made in Italy. Yours is obviously one of those guns. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

August 23, 2013, 11:04 PM	#11
n5lyc Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2009 Posts: 180	You could probably use the wedge, screws and loading ram from any of the pietta .44 1851 reproductions. Parts are available from Dixie gun works. Replacement nipples (if you need them) could either be the 6mm or the 5.5 sizes. Oh, and don't et them get you down about it being brass framed, It was your dads, fix it up, load it with light loads, and enjoy it and his memory.. Keep us posted with the progress.. 45 Bravo __________________ I make 2 predictions: ON THE DATE WHEN US TROOPS ARE ISSUED AN Energy Pulse Weapon, 1. The US Soldier will have on his person a version of the Colt 1911. 2. He will be aiming the NEW Weapon at someone carrying an AK.

August 22, 2013, 06:35 AM	#5
Bezoar Junior member Join Date: October 19, 2004 Location: michigan Posts: 578	its a hodge podge gun. The frame is marked HAWES that can help put an importer on it. however the barrel is of the style marked as "1851 round navy civilian" by modern makers. its not rare, and its brass.

August 22, 2013, 06:49 AM	#6
eightclicknine Member Join Date: July 11, 2013 Posts: 17	Sweet, is it for sale?

August 22, 2013, 04:36 PM	#9
swathdiver Senior Member Join Date: December 19, 2012 Location: Treasure Coast, Florida Posts: 335	That's a COM manufactured Griswold and Gunnison in .44 caliber. It was imported by Hawes out of Los Angeles and the date code indicates 1976 as the year of manufacture. An accurate G&G reproduction would be in .36 caliber. Fix it up and go shoot it!

August 23, 2013, 08:53 PM	#10
MattShlock Senior Member Join Date: April 8, 2013 Posts: 251	Winner winner chicken dinner! http://www.civilwarpreservations.com/newmus85.html

August 24, 2013, 01:00 PM	#12
brazosdave Senior Member Join Date: September 7, 2012 Location: Crockett, Texas Posts: 363	Swathdiver beat me to it, lol! It's a G & G replica, I have an old Navy Arms Pietta, and my wife has a brand new Cabelas Pietta. Cool guns, the rebounded in popularity with the series "Hell on Wheels", because the protagonist carried a mocked up 60 that was spose to be a Griswold, which is weird because they are readily available, lol! __________________ "I'm your huckleberry, it's just my game"

August 24, 2013, 08:38 PM	#13
cwmax2000 Member Join Date: August 14, 2002 Posts: 20	Thanks Thanks for all the Info... I will reassemble and fire it.... Cmax

August 25, 2013, 04:08 AM	#14
cwmax2000 Member Join Date: August 14, 2002 Posts: 20	What Now? OK, I need to know what to do to get the correct equipment and proper procedure for loading and firing this pistol. I have no experience with black powder at all... any advice will be appreciated. thanks Cmax

August 25, 2013, 06:21 AM	#15
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	There's a sticky thread at the top of this forum titled "So you want a cap and ball revolver?" Lots of good info in there.