Taking the Plunge into BP, Looking for Advice on Equipment

[MoGas1341]

So I have finally decided to try my hand in the black powder realm of the shooting world, and have very little knowledge or experience (meaning I've fired a friend's 1861 Springfield repro 3 times) pertaining to the equipment and products on this side of the hobby.

I have decided to buy a NIB Colt Signature Series Walker from my friend for $650 and figured I was getting a square deal. My first question is;

Does anyone here personally own/ or have shot one, and what are your honest opinions as to the quality, fit, finish, value and accuracy?

My second question is; What are some good recommendations for propellant (pyrodex etc), and what accoutrements would be recommended (of reputable quality and ease of use) to acquire before ever shooting it? This includes percussion caps, measures, flasks, round balls etc...

Thirdly; Are there any do's/don'ts or quirks to this particular model or things I should be aware of for safety, operation etc?

Please note that I am buying this for a novelty shooting piece and am not interested in collector value etc... All input is greatly appreciated and I hope this thread doesnt turn into a debate... I'm just looking for someone with experienced advice on the subject. Thanks.

[Kappe]

Gatofeo's "So you want a cap and ball revolver?" thread can probably answer most of what your second question is asking. It's a sticky thread here in the same subforum.

[rodwhaincamo]

I do not own a Walker, though one is on my looooong list. I love the history, and how it allowed Colt to resurrect his company. A lot of flash and thunder is cool too!

The powder is dependent on what you want from it. As is it holds ~60 grns which was considered a light rifle load. Even with weaker powders it's not weak, though with the few more energetic powders (Swiss, Goex Olde Eynsford, or Triple 7) it's potential is stretched much further.

Is this a range toy or something you plan to hunt with? It sounds like targets.

The loading lever may need some modifications unless you want to be historical and tie a leather band around the lever and barrel.

It may jam up with cap fragments, though there are modifications for that too.

I'm not privy to any differences between a repro and a signature Colt.

[Doc Hoy]

I don't own a Colt Walker but I do have a Walker from ASM.

They are fun to shoot but quite heavy. Rod is right about the loading lever catch. It didn't work on the originals and it doesn't work on the clones. My personal opinion is that you should get the Walker because the price is quite good.

There is nothing to worry about in shooting the Walker except for its weight and the loading lever catch. It will take a lot of powder. You can get good accuracy, understanding that most Colt clones shoot high.

You would definitely enjoy it.

I own three Colt 2nd or 3rd Gens and I find they are all quite tight, due I think to the close tolerances. This detracts from the shooting experience (for me) because of what seems to be a lot of field stripping to keep them going.

I understand that nearly all of the other posters on the forum have not seen this problem (Or at least haven't mentioned it). They shoot their Colt Colts and love them because they are not only good pistols, they are good shooters. I would not even mention it except that all of the ones I own are like this.

But if you can swing it, get a second (for now) revolver to shoot on a regular basis.

I would start with a steel frame Remington from Cabelas. Very straight forward shooter. Quality. Accurate. User friendly to start with. You'll have about 250.00 in it. The stuff you get for the Walker (That would be the Walker I recommend you buy, because it is cool at a good price. The one you are not going to shoot because an unfired NIB Colt Walker deserves to be toasted at parties.) will work for your Remington.

Rod gave you a good rundown on powder.

For most of us it boils down to what is available. I can buy Pyrodex all day long at the LGS. Triple 7 is available most of the time. I can get Goex some of the time. Nobody has Schutzen or anything else for that matter. I don't buy powder online because I don't shoot enough to buy in bulk reducing the impact of the Hazmat fee. I should really reconsider my strategy there, because powder doesn't spoil.

So I haven't really added anything to the thread.

Read Gatofeo
Buy the Walker
Also buy a Remington Steel Frame in .44
Shoot a range of powders and decide which you like
If you shoot the Walker, don't be surprised if the loading lever drops and jams
the pistol on every shot.
Understand you will probly wind up with at least a dozen different revolvers
and you won't be able to explain that to your better half if you have one.
Shooting BP is dirtier than shooting smokeless
Cleaning up is different from cleaning after shooting smokeless
Don't forget eye protection and ear protection (Which, with your background ... thanks a lot...you should already know about)
Try to wipe the smile off your face before you get home, because your better half will not believe you had that much fun shooting.

[rodwhaincamo]

You might want to consider a repro as was suggested, though, were it mine, I'd shoot it too.

[Gaucho Gringo]

I have an ASM Walker I have been thinking of selling. Had it 4 years now and never fired it. Much prefer firing my 1858 Remingtons and 1860 Colt. When I started out in this hobby I kind of went overboard on buying guns. Only have a few I regularly use. Age and injuries are catching up with me, so I do most of shooting at indoor ranges. Fortunately I have conversion cylinders for some of the ones I shoot. I am thinking of putting the Walker, the 2 1851 Colts, the 1849 with a conversion cylinder, the Rogers & Spenser, the NAA .22 mini black powder and a 1858 Remington .44 up for sale. All are reproductions. I can then buy conversion cylinders for the all the ones I have left. I should get off my duff and start listing them.

[Fingers McGee]

MoGas, where in MO? I'm at Lake Ozark.

Previous advice is right on. Read Gatofeo's thread "so you want a C&B revolver". it will answer most of your questions. Cpt George Baylors Blackpowder Substitute for Dummies http://www.curtrich.com/bpsubsdummies.html and Frontiersman for Dummies http://www.curtrich.com/frontiersmen.html are also a good reads.

For powder I prefer fffg Blackpowder. Goex, Grafs, Scheutzen, Olde Eynsford, really doesn't matter if you're just a recreational shooter. I also use Pinnacle in my .38 cartridge conversions. George Baylor is partial to APP, others are partial to Pyrodex, or Triple 7. While I sometimes use T7, I do not like APP or Pyrodex.

I have never owned a Sig Series Walker; but have and occasionally shoot Walkers by ASM and Uberti. My 2nd Gen Walker is part of my collection and is NIB. IMNSHO, a Uberti Walker would be a better choice than the Sig Series from a cost standpoint. Quality between them would be on par with the SIg Series having a higher polished finish. You could buy the Uberti, powder, round balls, caps, wads, flask, adjustable powder measure, capper, nipple wrench, Treso nipples, and a possibles bag to carry it all in for what you'd pay for the Sig series gun.

All the items you'd need (except the caps & powder) can be gotten from The Possible Shop http://possibleshop.com/menu-cowboy-action.html , including the Uberti Walker.

You'll need #10 Remington caps & .454 roundballs. Not everyone uses lubed wads; but they're good insurance against a chain fire and will help keep the fouling down.

You will also need Balistol as a cleaner and lubricant.

Starting load should be around 45 grains of fffg BP. you can go up or down in five grain increments to find the best load for your revolver. Both my ASM and Uberti are partial to the 45 grain load. Makes a big boom, and will reliably hit a paper plate off hand at 15 yards.

PM me f you'd like more info.

FM

[maillemaker]

My replica Walker was made by Uberti.

It is capable of hole-in-hole accuracy off a bench at 25 yards:

http://i.imgur.com/aYAQNM5.jpg

The 45 grain target has 6 shots at it. 3 shots went through the same single hole, and 2 shots went through another same hole nearby.

It is the most accurate BP revolver I own.

Most people use 3F powder in revolvers, but they will shoot 2F also. If you are interested in target accuracy, you will need to work up a load to find the most accurate load. For mine, it looks like between 35 and 45 grains will do the trick. Accuracy opened up above that.

The service load for this gun was 60 grains.

You will want some kind of tube for making up pre-measured loads. I use tubes like this:

http://www.lodgewood.com/Quick-Load-...ber_p_455.html

However, you can only put about 50 grains of powder in this max and just fit the ball in on top as a "cork stopper". If you want to try the full 60 grain load you will have to come up with another method for making up "cartridges".

You'll want a powder measure. Something like this can do:

http://www.ssfirearms.com/proddetail.asp?prod=SA231

Never load directly from a flask, as there is a risk of explosion (hand grenade).

When you seat balls, it is important that a ring of lead is shaved when it is driven into the chamber. This indicates a gas-tight fit. Never use under-sized balls as this is an invitation to a chain fire where adjacent chambers to off other than the one intended to be fired. My Walker will shave a ring barely with a .454 ball - I think I am going to try .457 balls.

Never put your hand beside or in front of the cylinder when firing. The gases during normal firing can injure, a chain fire will remove fingers.

If you don't shoot a full load such that the loading lever will seat the ball on the powder, use a filler to make sure there is no air gap between the powder and ball. Many people use cream of wheat. If you use a powder filler like CoW, make sure the ball compresses it or it will mix with the powder and dilute your charge.

Especially with a "name brand" gun like yours, be sure to clean it immediately after shooting it. Soapy water works fine, and I like to use compressed air from my air compressor to blast it dry after cleaning, followed by Rem Oil.

As was noted, it is likely the loading lever will drop in between shots. This is a known problem inherent with the early Walker design and was later remedied with the Dragoons and subsequent designs. You can either live with it and flip the latch up when it falls or put a rubber band around it and the barrel to keep it up during loading. Some people file a more aggressive step on the existing spring catch but I am hesitant to do this with my own revolver and would hesitate more on a real Colt.

Steve

[PetahW]

.

The Walker was the first real "magnum" revolver - why they're so heavy.

I wouldn't worry about shooting the 3rd gen Signature Walker, because it's not a genuine/original Colt, anyway - it, too, was made for Colt (aka: a repro) by Lou Imperato of Henry Repeating Ams (then in Brooklyn, NY), but with a much higher level of finish that any other imports.

I would suggest buying a small can of Crisco (lard) to fill the front of the cylinder's chambers after the powder & bullet are seated/loaded.



Besides acting both as a lubricant & sealing the fronts of the chambers, the Crisco will keep the powder fouling very soft - enabling longer shooting sessions between cleanings.



.

[Hawg]

it, too, was made for Colt (aka: a repro) by Lou Imperato

Not made for Colt. Was made under license from Colt. They paid Colt for the license so they could use Colt's name and logo. They being the Colt Black Powder Arms Co. owned by Lou Imperato.

[MoGas1341]

I have been reading everyone's links they posted on here, and its like taking a drink from a fire hose! Alot of good information here, and thanks for shoving me in the right direction. To Doc Hoy and Fingers McGee, thank you for the info and sound advice.

That gatofeo post was indeed a long winded one, and everyone was right, a good read. I printed it out just like it suggested.

As for the Walker's loading lever dropping during firing, I can deal with that. (kinda like occasionally having to pry a 45-70 casing outta my trapdoor, its one of those those things) However that chain fire business sounds like a gift basket from Satan himself!

My friend that is selling me the Walker, as I just found out, has almost 40 of these NIB 2nd and Sig Series Colts that he is selling, for very reasonable prices ranging from Dragoons, 51 Navies, 60 Army, etc. (No wonder he is selling it to me) I might just grab one or two more from him.

If anyone is interested, please PM me, and I can get you his GB link. He, like I, is not well versed in Black Powder but picked all these pistols up for a steal at an estate sale...

[Hawg]

I'd be trying to get the 2nd gens. Uberti supplied the parts but Colt did the final finishing, fit and assembly. Colt and collectors both recognize the 2nd gens as genuine Colt's, not so with the 3rd gens.

[Doc Hoy]

"However that chain fire business sounds like a gift basket from Satan himself"

Actually it is quite exciting.

Everyone should have the experience.

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.

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..... NOT.

[Hawg]

I prefer lubed wads under the balls instead of lube over them. Most people use too much and it gets blown all over the gun.

[Fingers McGee]

Originally Posted by Hawg

I prefer lubed wads under the balls instead of lube over them. Most people use too much and it gets blown all over the gun.

+1

MoGas, if it's the seller from Lebanon, his asking prices are a little high IMNSHO. .

[MoGas1341]

Hawg and Fingers McGee, from today's research I think that I'm gonna take that route and use the lubed wadding. Seems like much less of a hassle than blowing cooking lard all over my gun!

Fingers, PM en route