Looking to get into shooting IDPA, SSP class...

[steveNChunter]

As the title says I want to start shooting some IDPA matches at my local gun club. However I don't currently own a pistol that I would consider ideal for IDPA. I think I want to get into the SSP class for the simplicity more than anything. So far the pistol at the top of my list is a M&P 9 Pro 5".

Does anybody know of a good reason NOT to get that pistol? Before the fanboys start, yes I know Glock is great and I am also considering the 34 and 17, but for the price, the M&P Pro 5" rivals the 34 for less money. Also like the Walther PPQ M2 5". Opinions on these or any other eligible pistol are welcome.

Also wondering whether or not the Springfield XD/XDm line is allowed in SSP. I have read of alleged rule changes a couple of years ago to allow them in SSP but I have also read that they still are not legal for SSP due to being classified by Springfield as "Single Action". Anyone care to clear that up for me?

[labhound]

My wife and I both shoot IDPA. She uses a M&P 9MM Fullsize. Most of the time I shoot my FNS 9 but sometimes I shoot my Glock 19. All three are good guns to use. The FNS 9 has the best sights of the three and has ambi controls which is great when you have a stage requiring you shoot with your non-dominate hand and you have to do a mag change. While some stages require shooting at 15 & 20 yards, most are 10 yards and less so a 5" gun isn't necessarily an advantage. I considered buying a Glock 34 or a M&P Pro 5 " but decided to shoot what I already had. I don' t know if any gun is ideal. Most people shoot what they carry and use the IDPA matches as training.

[Jim Watson]

I just happen to have gotten my printed rule book yesterday.
The definition of SSP is now
8.2.1.1.3 Be double action, double action only, or striker fired.

The XD is acceptable for SSP.

HOWEVER: "I don't currently own a pistol that I would consider ideal for IDPA." is not what I consider the best approach. I would not buy a dedicated gun until I was certain I was interested enough to stay with it.
Do you have any gun that is permissible under the rules? This can now include even a .380 as BUG has been made a main match division.
It can include almost ANYTHING because IDPA now has a NFC (Not For Competition) category. You can shoot about anything you can holster, you just can't win. (No AR "pistols" or such junk; regular sidearms or match guns.)

[steveNChunter]

Do you have any gun that is permissible under the rules?

I do. I have a Shield in .40 that I guess would be allowed for the BUG division, but would be handicapped against .380's and 9's. I also have an unfired XD 45 4" service model that I aquired recently in a multi-gun trade but I would also be shooting it against 9's in SSP. I was thinking of selling the XD to fund a 9mm purchase. I could run the XD in CDP but I'll be up against 1911 race guns. So while I do have eligible pistols I don't have anything I consider ideal.

"I don't currently own a pistol that I would consider ideal for IDPA." is not what I consider the best approach. I would not buy a dedicated gun until I was certain I was interested enough to stay with it.

I'm already shooting .22 steel challenge, .22 benchrest, and monthly club matches, so IDPA is about the only thing I haven't got around to participating in yet. I'm pretty sure I'll stick with it, but I understand the point you are making.

[g.willikers]

Until you gain experience with the particulars of IDPA, just about any gun will do.
You might want to wait until you've done a few matches and the classifier before deciding.

[WC145]

I've always shot my carry guns and use my EDC gear, I don't have any dedicated competition stuff.

[Jim Watson]

Line count at the nationals shows the top five guns as Glock 34, Plastic M&P Pro, Glock 17, PM&P, CZ75 SP01 Shadow.

XD will probably gain some now that it is SSP and I am sure there are others; Bruce Gray is trying to make the Sig P320 competitive for one. But they have a long way to go to catch up with Glock and S&W.

[ritepath]

A couple of friends bought the 5" pros (ones a CORE) just for plinking plates and HD.

I've watched thousands of trouble free rounds fired from those while I stand one lane over with my CZs and my boss stands one lane over with his 35 and 41. I've watched them shoot the M&Ps at the 100yd gong and hit almost every shot off hand. While the 200 yard gong hits are a lot fewer off handed they still ring several once we move to that range to finish off an evening. At the plate racks 15-25 yards are solid 90% ranges with them. We apex'd the CORE and the "plain" pro has been left 100% stock.

Both light and accurate I can't say enough good things about the M&P line. I loved my 9c, and still love my Shield. I just couldn't buy the same gun as my friends so I hunted up a couple of CZs instead.

[1-DAB]

concur with g.willikers. run what ya brung.

whatever you feel comfy shooting, shoot that. gun, holster, mags, mag carrier, ammo, eyes and ears - you are good to go. have fun, learn.

i started with a 1911. then tried a PX4. now i'm into striker fired. they are simple and easy to use. just what i want when i'm attacked by a vicious dog while i'm out on my property.

[Walt Sherrill]

concur with g.willikers. run what ya brung.

If you haven't shot competitively in this sort of gun game, worrying about the best gun to use suggests you've got a lot of confidence.

If you can't shoot your .40 Shield, look at CZ P07, A Glock 17/34, an M&P or M&P Pro, or even a Ruger SR9 or SR9c. (I have no experience with the XD line, but some folks think highly of them.) The Glock and M&P models might need a trigger upgrade. You'll probably find 9mm easier to shoot well...

If you've got a gun you can use, go to the matches, watch what others are doing, develop some proficiency, and then worry about upgrading your weapon. Chances are you, like most of us, will need to be more concerned with improving your skills (independent of the gun) before a gun change is called for.

[MrBorland]

Get the M&P.

My philosophy on competition gear is that if you know you want to shoot a sport, but don't have the gear, do some research into what good basic (not necessarily best) gear shooters are using, then go get it. The M&P is a good basic gun for IDPA and USPSA.

Once you get your gear, though, check that box off your list and move on - focus on shooting the beejeebers out of it. If you did your research, your choice of gear can take you well into master class, so wait until then to start looking for the perfect gear if needed.

[zincwarrior]

Is the Shield what you CC? If so then
1. Shoot that at a match or two. If you like it then M&P is a good upside.
2. If the Shield is not your CC, shoot your CC for two matches then think about getting the full size version of that. I'm a big believer in having the same platform.

[steveNChunter]

Is the Shield what you CC?

Yes the Shield is my CCW. Which is another plus for me to go with the M&P.

If you haven't shot competitively in this sort of gun game, worrying about the best gun to use suggests you've got a lot of confidence.

I'm definitely not over confident, if anything, my lack of confidence makes me want to start out with a 9mm instead of a .45 so I don't handicap myself beyond the handicap of my lack of experience. Also 9mm is cheaper to reload or if I need to buy ammo in a pinch it's a lot cheaper than .45.

I'm just looking to purchase a pistol relatively ideal for the SSP division that I can grow into as I get more experience shooting these matches. I haven't shot centerfire pistols in organized competition (other than a couple "bullseye style" club matches) , but I have shot two years worth of .22 steel challenge matches and even won the open sight division a couple times. I realize that doesn't translate into guaranteed success in IDPA matches but it's not like I'm a complete handgun novice.

My philosophy on competition gear is that if you know you want to shoot a sport, but don't have the gear, do some research into what good basic (not necessarily best) gear shooters are using, then go get it. The M&P is a good basic gun for IDPA and USPSA.

Once you get your gear, though, check that box off your list and move on - focus on shooting the beejeebers out of it. If you did your research, your choice of gear can take you well into master class, so wait until then to start looking for the perfect gear if needed.

Thank you Mr. Borland. That is exactly what I'm trying to do. I like the idea of staying with the same platform as my CCW so M&P is definitely in the lead.

I have another rule related question. If I were to get the standard M&P 9 fullsize (not the Pro), could I later on, upgrade the trigger with an Apex kit and put better sights on it and still be within SSP class rules? The way I read them I could, as long as the slide isn't modified to accept a different dovetail size or sight type, and there are no external modifications to the trigger. Is that correct?

[MrBorland]

After an action job and sights, it'll still be SSP-legal.

[tacticalmedic]

This is all great information for me too. I am going to my first IDPA match tomorrow with my M&P. Wish me luck. I will post back here and let everyone know how bad I suck

[labhound]

An Apex trigger would put your M&P into the ESP class. That's what I did with my M&P fullsize.

[Jim Watson]

But you can get a very nice trigger with only internal mods that leave you in SSP.
My Plastic M&P has a Dan Burwell action job which I prefer to the DIY Apex parts swaps I have seen.

[MrBorland]

Just to clarify on case anyone's confused: You can tune your trigger and stay in SSP so long as any non-factory parts are invisible. Thus, you can modify the factory parts, or install an Apex enhancement kit and still be SSP-legal. Installing an Apex trigger, on the other hand, puts you into ESP.

[WC145]

All of this discussion is exactly the reason that I have enjoyed IDPA more and tend to prefer it over USPSA. The rules level the playing field to a greater degree and you can be competitive, at least on a local level, with the guns and gear that you carry normally. It doesn't require anything special to get into the game. I always shot with my regular carry stuff or, on occasion, with my duty gun and rig before retiring. I shoot CDP and ESP (with 9mm or .38 Super 1911s). I suggest just taking what you've got and shooting a few matches. Get a feel for it and then decide if you really need a "game gun" to be competitive, if that's what you're after. Plenty of people are just looking for more challenging range time with their EDC.

[DMK]

I'm a big believer in shooting my carry gun in combat competition games. It's not perfect practice, but it is good frequent practice in drawing, manipulating the controls, trigger control, sight picture, reloads, etc.

In fact, it made me rethink my carry gun when I first started. I'm not a big fan of subcompact guns anymore.

Plus it keeps you from sinking a ton of money in the equipment race and what money you do invest is not only used on weekends.

All of this discussion is exactly the reason that I have enjoyed IDPA more and tend to prefer it over USPSA. The rules level the playing field to a greater degree and you can be competitive, at least on a local level, with the guns and gear that you carry normally. It doesn't require anything special to get into the game. I always shot with my regular carry stuff or, on occasion, with my duty gun and rig before retiring.

Maybe it's just my local USPSA club, but you can shoot snubby revolvers and 9mm compact guns. Just not .32, .380 or other mouse guns.

[str8tshot]

I too just started shooting IDPA. I shot my first match with my G30sf and did just fine. I carry that gun everyday, so it was a natural choice. The .45 caliber does not put me at a disadvantage over the 9mms because I cannot out shoot my gun. I use the matches as practice.

[MrBorland]

Originally Posted by DMK

I'm a big believer in shooting my carry gun in combat competition games. It's not perfect practice, but it is good frequent practice in drawing, manipulating the controls, trigger control, sight picture, reloads, etc.

It'll also show you how reliable and functional your EDC gear is when it's actually put to a test instead of being casually shot at the range. People are often surprised.

I know of at least one other guy who re-evaluated his EDC based on reliability in competition. Competition may be a game, but competition's tough on gear and it really tests it. First and foremost, your stuff has to run to play, so it's an excellent testing ground.

That said, I know of others who proclaim they shoot their EDC to get good with it, but then gripe about all the "gamers" when they get beat, and take it upon themselves to tell everyone else how IDPA ought to be run. Bottom line: It's a game. Use your EDC if you like, but understand it's your choice to do so. Don't be a soapbox purist.

[1-DAB]

i started with a 1911, convinced it was a great gun - and learned that flipping off the safety each time i drew it was not a natural act.

so i went to my PX4, and learned that the first DA trigger was also not something i liked, i liked the consistent SA trigger of the 1911.

so now i'm carrying and shooting a striker fired pistol, either a HK VP9 or a Sig P320. both excellent factory triggers, same trigger pull every time, no safety to trip me up.

it's been an excellent learning experience, both for finding out how various guns perform under stress, and learning different shooting techniques (there are no barricades in bullseye, and no reload on the clock either).

[labhound]

Shooting IDPA really opens up your eyes to the difference between slow fire target practice at the range compared to draw, move and shoot competition that requires accuracy and speed according to your ability. World of difference and as others have said makes you rethink the type of gun you carry. My wife and I use it as training on our gun handling and shooting skills. The competition and comparing our results to the other shooters is a bonus!

[steveNChunter]

I just had a thought while googling IDPA stuff... Correct me if I'm misled or missing something here...

Wouldn't my XD45 4" be a good fit for the new CCP division?

4.1" max barrel length, 1.375" max width, 37 oz. max weight, 6" tall, and ammo has to make 125 power factor from a 4.1" barrel. Here are my gun's specs: http://www.springfield-armory.com/pr...-model-45-acp/

I have a 185 gr target load that is around 150 power factor from a 5" gun, and I might could get them a little lighter and still get reliable function.

I'd still have a little more cost in reloading .45 but this seems like a viable option if I were to keep the XD.