Load Chart Discrepancies

Derf00 · August 26, 2004, 05:38 PM

I recently got back into reloading .44 mag for my Redhawk, and my son's rifle. For many yrs I have used a Speer reloading manual and the loads it suggested.

My concern is that in my Speer manual the suggested load for a .44 mag, 240g JHP using Blue Dot is 16.2 -17g which is considerably more than several new reloading manuals I have looked at.

Are these loads to hot?

steveno · August 26, 2004, 05:50 PM

if the loads were fired in different handguns there could be a difference due to tolerances in the handguns. if it was done in pressure guns the way they were measured is probably the difference. "copper units of pressure" (cpu) can only measure peak pressure because it is derived by measuring the "before and after" firing length of a small copper cylinder. for a long time that was the only method and not that precise. transducer readings will be labeled as "psi" and be read on an oscilloscope for the complete firing cycle(ignition of the primer to when the bullet leaves the barrel. your loads are probably safe but then a perrson should always sneak up on the max loads. that extra grain or two of powder doesn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things

Dave R · August 26, 2004, 05:55 PM

I dunno, but I have noticed that the loads is Speer's No. 13 are in many cases hotter than other manuals.

But hey, that's why they say start low and work up. And that's why they say to use more than one manual.

Couple of examples.

One of their .380acp max loads works fine in my PPK (clone) with a fully-supported chamber. But it made scary-looking case bulges in my Kel-Tec P-3AT, which doesn't fully support the case. So I downloaded a little for P-3AT.

OTOH, I run a load in my .308 Rem700 that is near their max, but seems fine in that rifle.

Bullet94 · September 8, 2004, 11:46 PM

I's hard to find loading manuels that agree. Some of the differences are do to using different components. Different bullets, primers, cases and OALs.

WESHOOT2 · September 9, 2004, 04:38 AM

I gotta 357 load that was developed in two GP100's, but when it's fired in my 7.5" 357 Redhawk (haven't tried it in my 5.5" Redhawk yet) it blows the primer.

Manuals offer data as a guide, not gospel, ay?

Your results may vary.

strambo · September 9, 2004, 01:16 PM

Speer #13 is usually quite hot compared to others. Some of the start loads are other manuals' max. I usually compare 2 or 3 and split the difference. I usually end up starting with what is a mid level load in other manuals and slightly below the Speer start load...unless it is a new gun then I use the start load of one of the more conservative manuals. [Your previous load history with a particular caliber/components and the gun of course come into play as well]

Funny thing about Speer is even though their loads can be a grain or two higher, the listed velocities are the same or sometimes even a little slower for the max loads as compared to other manuals (I have Lee and Sierra as well). This is where a chrony is great, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

My next .44mag is gonna be a Redhawk, don't worry, it can take it!

alan · September 9, 2004, 03:05 PM

While pressure testing methods have changed over time, I suspect that newer manuals reflect greater input from LEGAL DEPT., than did older editions.

August 26, 2004, 05:55 PM	#3
Dave R Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2000 Location: Idaho Posts: 6,073	I dunno, but I have noticed that the loads is Speer's No. 13 are in many cases hotter than other manuals. But hey, that's why they say start low and work up. And that's why they say to use more than one manual. Couple of examples. One of their .380acp max loads works fine in my PPK (clone) with a fully-supported chamber. But it made scary-looking case bulges in my Kel-Tec P-3AT, which doesn't fully support the case. So I downloaded a little for P-3AT. OTOH, I run a load in my .308 Rem700 that is near their max, but seems fine in that rifle. __________________ I am Pro-Rights (on gun issues).

September 8, 2004, 11:46 PM	#4
Bullet94 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2004 Location: Kansas Posts: 723	I's hard to find loading manuels that agree. Some of the differences are do to using different components. Different bullets, primers, cases and OALs. __________________ PRO-SECOND AMENDMENT - Live Free or Die

September 9, 2004, 04:38 AM	#5
WESHOOT2 Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 1999 Location: home on the range; Vermont (Caspian country) Posts: 14,324	Cautionary Tale I gotta 357 load that was developed in two GP100's, but when it's fired in my 7.5" 357 Redhawk (haven't tried it in my 5.5" Redhawk yet) it blows the primer. Manuals offer data as a guide, not gospel, ay? Your results may vary. __________________ . "all my ammo is mostly retired factory ammo"

August 26, 2004, 05:38 PM	#1
Derf00 Member Join Date: August 25, 2004 Location: Abilene, TX Posts: 33	Load Chart Discrepancies I recently got back into reloading .44 mag for my Redhawk, and my son's rifle. For many yrs I have used a Speer reloading manual and the loads it suggested. My concern is that in my Speer manual the suggested load for a .44 mag, 240g JHP using Blue Dot is 16.2 -17g which is considerably more than several new reloading manuals I have looked at. Are these loads to hot?

August 26, 2004, 05:50 PM	#2
steveno Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2004 Location: Minden , Nebraska Posts: 1,407	if the loads were fired in different handguns there could be a difference due to tolerances in the handguns. if it was done in pressure guns the way they were measured is probably the difference. "copper units of pressure" (cpu) can only measure peak pressure because it is derived by measuring the "before and after" firing length of a small copper cylinder. for a long time that was the only method and not that precise. transducer readings will be labeled as "psi" and be read on an oscilloscope for the complete firing cycle(ignition of the primer to when the bullet leaves the barrel. your loads are probably safe but then a perrson should always sneak up on the max loads. that extra grain or two of powder doesn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things

September 9, 2004, 01:16 PM	#6
strambo Junior Member Join Date: September 8, 2004 Posts: 8	Speer #13 is usually quite hot compared to others. Some of the start loads are other manuals' max. I usually compare 2 or 3 and split the difference. I usually end up starting with what is a mid level load in other manuals and slightly below the Speer start load...unless it is a new gun then I use the start load of one of the more conservative manuals. [Your previous load history with a particular caliber/components and the gun of course come into play as well] Funny thing about Speer is even though their loads can be a grain or two higher, the listed velocities are the same or sometimes even a little slower for the max loads as compared to other manuals (I have Lee and Sierra as well). This is where a chrony is great, the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. My next .44mag is gonna be a Redhawk, don't worry, it can take it!

September 9, 2004, 03:05 PM	#7
alan Senior Member Join Date: June 7, 1999 Posts: 3,847	While pressure testing methods have changed over time, I suspect that newer manuals reflect greater input from LEGAL DEPT., than did older editions.