Ruger Old Army

the rifleer · May 22, 2009, 09:10 PM

I bought a used Ruger Old Army revolver knowing that there is something wrong with it.

The problem is that the cylinder doesn't lock up when it is fully cocked. It can rotate clockwise and click like when its on half cock. What part do i need and how do i install it?

One of the screws on the frame to the right of the hammer is stuck and close to useless and is stripped a little, making it hard to remove and i am scared that i am going to strip it completely and not be able to get it out, so I can do much other than remover the cylinder.

thanks in advance.

mykeal · May 22, 2009, 10:57 PM

The broken part is either the bolt or a spring that controls the bolt motion. If you can't remove the grip frame you can't correct the problem. Time to visit a gunsmith.

**4V50 Gary** · May 22, 2009, 11:06 PM

You did pay $190 for it, didn't you? If so, congratulations. Now, send it to Ruger. They've got fresh parts and will check out the entire gun while they're at it (function test).

smee78 · May 22, 2009, 11:13 PM

Send it back to Ruger and they will fix all the broken and worn out parts. Most of the time they do it for free. There service is top notch and I would recommend them with out hesitation.

the rifleer · May 23, 2009, 01:59 AM

I got the screw off. I think someone just didnt put it back together correctly. I moved the spring so that the cylinder catch is constantly up, but this is not correct because the cylinder cannot rotate.

Can someone please post a picture of how it is supposed to be set up. I would send it back to ruger, but its going to cost at least $60 and i dont think anything is broken, it just isnt assembled correctly.

CaptainCrossman · May 23, 2009, 06:06 AM

there are not that many parts in a single action revolver such as Ruger, Colt, Remington- you can easily repair or reassemble the gun yourself. Don't think too much into it.

There is the trigger, bolt, hammer, hand, trigger/bolt spring- and that's it ! A few screws come in from the side to hold these parts in place. Simply put it back together again.

Somebody disassembled that gun, then reassembled it incorrectly, and jammed up the gun.

mykeal · May 23, 2009, 07:17 AM

...the Ruger action is not the same design as the Colt single actions...it's significantly more complicated. If you don't have a local gunsmith, send it back to Ruger. Seriously. They're very reasonable.

Dingoboyx · May 23, 2009, 08:12 AM

Glad you got the screw out. Is your ROA stainless or blue?

The most important thing, & the thing I think sounds like it is in wrong is the little spring under the cylinder lock bar. The little spring faces the muzzle end of the gun, the little tail on the spring goesinto a tiny hole in the side of the well the latch bar lays in. You can't actually see the hole, but if you put the spring around the screw and under the latch bar, the hole is where the tail is when you push it down in the well. The first time I tried to put the spring in, it took me a few minutes to work out its orientation, and discovered the tiny hole.

Other than that, the indexing rod (that turns the cylinder) from the hammer has to go up a passageway to come into the cylinder area (next to where the hammer comes thru to strike the cap) so when you cock the hammer this rod locates in a hole in the rear of the cylinder and turns it. If you find that the rod falls away from the cylinder and doesnt turn it, you have probably forgotten the tiny spring & pawl which goes in a little hole between the main frame & the grip frame to push the indexing rod against the cylinder. If you have forgotten to put this spring & pawl in, you will have to separate the main frame & grip frame again and insert the spring & pawl, then mate up the main & grip frames again, being sure the spring is completely in the hole.

Also of course, there is a nearly identical (but larger coil spring & pawl that is in behind the trigger (trigger return spring)

Other than that, I really cant think of anything else that can go wrong? The mechanism on the ROA is really very simple... once you have done it once or twice, it will be a breeze, so percevere

If you need any more help, let me know

the rifleer · May 23, 2009, 09:40 AM

dingoboyx- I thing your first guess is correct. The tiny hole is one the right when the muzzle is pointed away and is upside down correct? the coils go through the same bolt/screw that holds the cylinder latch in place? the spring should force the cylinder catch though the hole?

Originally the latch was down and never came up, now the latch is up and wont go down. everything else seems to function correctly. it will go down if i take the cylinder out and push it down with my finger, then it pops up again.

Is the latch supposed be exposed or unexposed when the gun is full assembled and the hammer is down, uncocked?

this is a 7.5'' blued version.

Dingoboyx · May 23, 2009, 11:04 AM

I cant get into my gynsafe right now to get my gun to look right now (it is 1:45am here in Oz, and SWMBO is in bed, the safe is in the bedroom)

so I will try to remember.

Yes, I think you are correct. If my memory serves me right, with the hammer down, the latch is up, locking the cylinder. When you go half cock, the latch goes down so the cylinder can advance, at full cock, the cylinder latch is up (locking the wheel in place) Yes with the cylinder out, you can push the latch down and it will pop back up.

When you hold the main frame upside down muzzle away from you & you are looking in the well at the latch & spring, the spring is around the screw (the looped part) the little hook is under the latch lever & the little tail part of the spring gets pushed forward and locks the little tail into the side of the well, into the little hole (that you cant see, but the tail will find) When all in place, the latch should be in the locking position. (when you turn the frame/barrel section right way up, the latch should be up thru its slot, so as to lock the wheel)

When the latch was down and wouldnt come up, the spring was in wrong, you are correct.

Correct again, the latch should be exposed thru it's slot (as if locking the cylinder) when the hammer is down, uncocked (& when fully cocked.... ) at half cock, the latch should be gone (down) freeing the cylinder to advance.

Have you got a manual for your gun? I have one downloaded from the net, but it is too big to post on here, if you want to get it, PM me & I will let you know where to get it

Here is a pic of my 'babies'

arcticap · May 23, 2009, 11:07 AM

Quote:

I would send it back to ruger, but its going to cost at least $60 and i dont think anything is broken, it just isnt assembled correctly.

C&B revolvers can be sent through the U.S. Mail and they offer flat rate shipping. The ROA is not the same as a centerfire revolver, it's considered to be an antique firearm reproduction.

CraigC · May 23, 2009, 11:10 AM

There's really not much difference between the old Colt design and the Old Army. The Old Army and Old Model single actions are simple and easy to work on. It's the New Model Rugers that are a pain but most the frustration comes at reassembly. Still, it won't cost much to send it back to Ruger because it is not a firearm and thus can be sent UPS Ground or even USPS Parcel Post. Probably won't cost more than $15 to send it and they will fix it cheaply, if not free.

Dingoboyx · May 23, 2009, 11:21 AM

I think getting the spring in the right way will have his problem solved

Fingers crossed, hey

Will save him the time & cost of shipping it off to Ruger

the rifleer · May 23, 2009, 11:33 AM

Ok, i thing i have it assembled correctly, but maybe i am missing part because the latch does not go down when it it at half cock. What part could be either missing or incorrectly installed.

Dingoboyx- thanks, according to your explanation, i have it assembled correctly, but something else is wrong.

what part pushes the latch down when it is on halfcock?

**4V50 Gary** · May 23, 2009, 11:48 AM

Ripped off? We all told you to buy it since it was only $190. To give Ruger $60 to fix the gun brings it up to $250. Add $10 for postage and you still have a bargain.

In its present state, provided nothing is broken, the parts are still installed incorrectly. I'll let Dingoboyx walk you through it. If it still isn't working, then I'll move this thread to the Smith forum.

CaptainCrossman · May 23, 2009, 11:55 AM

Rifleer- sending a Ruger OA back to Ruger, just to put that spring in right, would be like sending a Chevy truck back to GM, to fill the windshield washer fluid reservoir- keep at it I'm sure you can figure it out

every so often these single action c/b guns must be completely disassembled and cleaned anyway- they are a very simple circa 1840's lock design, slightly changed over time, but basically all the same- I'm pretty sure even a 10 year old can assemble one, once shown how- you'll get it right

worst case you buy a new bolt, trigger, and spring, hand, and put them in- presto fixed

I'd buy that gun right now apart with its "problem" no questions asked for $250 shipped, without even seeing it. Getting an ROA for $190 is a smokin' deal. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.

**4V50 Gary** · May 23, 2009, 12:10 PM

It's not quite like sending a Chevy back to the factory for windshield wiper fluid. The mechanical aptitude varies in each individual and I have one friend who is challenged by the Soviet SKS. We're talking military guns that simple peasants can operate and care for. Yet my friend can't take it apart and put it together right.

It's a matter of training and patience. Folks learn three ways: audio, visual (reading) and kinesthetic (hands-on). Learning over the net by reading is very challenging for both the instructor and the student. First, the writing skill of the instructor must be at the level of comprehension of the pupil. This requires some interaction between the two and is only one aspect of the visual learning method. With things like YouTube, the instructor can incorporate both audio (voice) and visual (image) for the student. This is at least two out of three. It sometimes takes a combination of using all three techniques for a student to develop proficiency. That is, the student must actually perform the task (and this is generally under the tutorship of the instructor who is nearby for consultation).

So, if our student can't be walked through it over the internet, it may be better just to ship the gun off to the factory. The advantage of sending it to Ruger is that they'll perform a function test to ensure that everything is working (but they probably won't test fire it) prior to shipping it back.

BTW, I'd buy it too for $250 if he didn't want it.

Dingoboyx · May 23, 2009, 12:17 PM

The hammer plunger pin & spring is in wrong or missing, but it shouldn't be? it is like way up in the hammer itsself.... surely no one would pull that out?

If you cant get it going, might pay to take the guys advice and ship it to Ruger.... It's 3:15am here, I'm off to bed, PM me later if you are still having probs, I'll see if I can help, if not, I can see your gun taking a holiday to Ruger in the near future

CraigC · May 23, 2009, 01:25 PM

Quote:

The mechanical aptitude varies in each individual...

Exactly! I take my guns apart all the time, do my own action jobs and modifications and can put a traditional single action back together in the dark but I will never assume that everybody else is capable of doing the same.

long rider · May 23, 2009, 04:15 PM

Nice pair ya got there dingo.:d

the rifleer · May 23, 2009, 04:50 PM

I can take apart all of my rifles and put them back together blindfolded too, but the problem is that with them i had it properly assembled the first time and also had good instructions. This is my first revolver and i have never taken one apart before and have nothing to base it on and had no clue what it looks like when it is correctly assembled, but i knew that the cylinder should lock up.

What ever part that pulls the latch down is the part i need, as i think its missing, but again, i have no referance.

If i can figure it out by tuesday, then i will mail it to ruger, but would prefer to fix it myself if i can.

olmontanaboy · May 23, 2009, 06:15 PM

Don't know if this will help or not, you can zoom in on the exploded view and see what part go where. http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firear...Manuals/13.pdf

mykeal · May 23, 2009, 06:36 PM

Cylinder latch spring, KCB04600?

**4V50 Gary** · May 23, 2009, 07:34 PM

My thoughts exactly mykeal. I bet one or both of the cylinder latch spring legs isn't properly installed.

RRR · May 23, 2009, 08:01 PM

Had a 1976,er shot good! Had some others shot ok. Strong gun.

May 22, 2009, 09:10 PM	#1
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	Ruger Old Army I bought a used Ruger Old Army revolver knowing that there is something wrong with it. The problem is that the cylinder doesn't lock up when it is fully cocked. It can rotate clockwise and click like when its on half cock. What part do i need and how do i install it? One of the screws on the frame to the right of the hammer is stuck and close to useless and is stripped a little, making it hard to remove and i am scared that i am going to strip it completely and not be able to get it out, so I can do much other than remover the cylinder. thanks in advance.

May 22, 2009, 11:06 PM	#3
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	You did pay $190 for it, didn't you? If so, congratulations. Now, send it to Ruger. They've got fresh parts and will check out the entire gun while they're at it (function test). __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

May 22, 2009, 11:13 PM	#4
smee78 Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2008 Location: South Carolina Posts: 2,918	Send it back to Ruger and they will fix all the broken and worn out parts. Most of the time they do it for free. There service is top notch and I would recommend them with out hesitation. __________________ We know exactly where one cow with Mad-cow-disease is located, among the millions and millions of cows in America, but we haven't got a clue where thousands of illegal immigrants and terrorists are

May 23, 2009, 08:12 AM	#8
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	Rifleer Glad you got the screw out. Is your ROA stainless or blue? The most important thing, & the thing I think sounds like it is in wrong is the little spring under the cylinder lock bar. The little spring faces the muzzle end of the gun, the little tail on the spring goesinto a tiny hole in the side of the well the latch bar lays in. You can't actually see the hole, but if you put the spring around the screw and under the latch bar, the hole is where the tail is when you push it down in the well. The first time I tried to put the spring in, it took me a few minutes to work out its orientation, and discovered the tiny hole. Other than that, the indexing rod (that turns the cylinder) from the hammer has to go up a passageway to come into the cylinder area (next to where the hammer comes thru to strike the cap) so when you cock the hammer this rod locates in a hole in the rear of the cylinder and turns it. If you find that the rod falls away from the cylinder and doesnt turn it, you have probably forgotten the tiny spring & pawl which goes in a little hole between the main frame & the grip frame to push the indexing rod against the cylinder. If you have forgotten to put this spring & pawl in, you will have to separate the main frame & grip frame again and insert the spring & pawl, then mate up the main & grip frames again, being sure the spring is completely in the hole. Also of course, there is a nearly identical (but larger coil spring & pawl that is in behind the trigger (trigger return spring) Other than that, I really cant think of anything else that can go wrong? The mechanism on the ROA is really very simple... once you have done it once or twice, it will be a breeze, so percevere If you need any more help, let me know __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs Last edited by Dingoboyx; May 23, 2009 at 11:21 PM. Reason: Addressing wrong poster

May 23, 2009, 11:21 AM	#13
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	Craig & Arti I think getting the spring in the right way will have his problem solved Fingers crossed, hey Will save him the time & cost of shipping it off to Ruger __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

May 22, 2009, 10:57 PM	#2
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	The broken part is either the bolt or a spring that controls the bolt motion. If you can't remove the grip frame you can't correct the problem. Time to visit a gunsmith.

May 23, 2009, 01:59 AM	#5
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	I got the screw off. I think someone just didnt put it back together correctly. I moved the spring so that the cylinder catch is constantly up, but this is not correct because the cylinder cannot rotate. Can someone please post a picture of how it is supposed to be set up. I would send it back to ruger, but its going to cost at least $60 and i dont think anything is broken, it just isnt assembled correctly.

May 23, 2009, 06:06 AM	#6
CaptainCrossman Junior member Join Date: April 2, 2009 Posts: 381	there are not that many parts in a single action revolver such as Ruger, Colt, Remington- you can easily repair or reassemble the gun yourself. Don't think too much into it. There is the trigger, bolt, hammer, hand, trigger/bolt spring- and that's it ! A few screws come in from the side to hold these parts in place. Simply put it back together again. Somebody disassembled that gun, then reassembled it incorrectly, and jammed up the gun.

May 23, 2009, 07:17 AM	#7
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	...the Ruger action is not the same design as the Colt single actions...it's significantly more complicated. If you don't have a local gunsmith, send it back to Ruger. Seriously. They're very reasonable.

May 23, 2009, 09:40 AM	#9
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	dingoboyx- I thing your first guess is correct. The tiny hole is one the right when the muzzle is pointed away and is upside down correct? the coils go through the same bolt/screw that holds the cylinder latch in place? the spring should force the cylinder catch though the hole? Originally the latch was down and never came up, now the latch is up and wont go down. everything else seems to function correctly. it will go down if i take the cylinder out and push it down with my finger, then it pops up again. Is the latch supposed be exposed or unexposed when the gun is full assembled and the hammer is down, uncocked? this is a 7.5'' blued version.

May 23, 2009, 11:10 AM	#12
CraigC Junior member Join Date: November 28, 2001 Location: West Tennessee Posts: 4,300	There's really not much difference between the old Colt design and the Old Army. The Old Army and Old Model single actions are simple and easy to work on. It's the New Model Rugers that are a pain but most the frustration comes at reassembly. Still, it won't cost much to send it back to Ruger because it is not a firearm and thus can be sent UPS Ground or even USPS Parcel Post. Probably won't cost more than $15 to send it and they will fix it cheaply, if not free.

May 23, 2009, 11:33 AM	#14
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	Ok, i thing i have it assembled correctly, but maybe i am missing part because the latch does not go down when it it at half cock. What part could be either missing or incorrectly installed. Dingoboyx- thanks, according to your explanation, i have it assembled correctly, but something else is wrong. what part pushes the latch down when it is on halfcock?

May 23, 2009, 11:48 AM	#15
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	Ripped off? We all told you to buy it since it was only $190. To give Ruger $60 to fix the gun brings it up to $250. Add $10 for postage and you still have a bargain. In its present state, provided nothing is broken, the parts are still installed incorrectly. I'll let Dingoboyx walk you through it. If it still isn't working, then I'll move this thread to the Smith forum. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

May 23, 2009, 11:55 AM	#16
CaptainCrossman Junior member Join Date: April 2, 2009 Posts: 381	Rifleer- sending a Ruger OA back to Ruger, just to put that spring in right, would be like sending a Chevy truck back to GM, to fill the windshield washer fluid reservoir- keep at it I'm sure you can figure it out every so often these single action c/b guns must be completely disassembled and cleaned anyway- they are a very simple circa 1840's lock design, slightly changed over time, but basically all the same- I'm pretty sure even a 10 year old can assemble one, once shown how- you'll get it right worst case you buy a new bolt, trigger, and spring, hand, and put them in- presto fixed I'd buy that gun right now apart with its "problem" no questions asked for $250 shipped, without even seeing it. Getting an ROA for $190 is a smokin' deal. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Last edited by CaptainCrossman; May 23, 2009 at 12:03 PM.

May 23, 2009, 12:10 PM	#17
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	It's not quite like sending a Chevy back to the factory for windshield wiper fluid. The mechanical aptitude varies in each individual and I have one friend who is challenged by the Soviet SKS. We're talking military guns that simple peasants can operate and care for. Yet my friend can't take it apart and put it together right. It's a matter of training and patience. Folks learn three ways: audio, visual (reading) and kinesthetic (hands-on). Learning over the net by reading is very challenging for both the instructor and the student. First, the writing skill of the instructor must be at the level of comprehension of the pupil. This requires some interaction between the two and is only one aspect of the visual learning method. With things like YouTube, the instructor can incorporate both audio (voice) and visual (image) for the student. This is at least two out of three. It sometimes takes a combination of using all three techniques for a student to develop proficiency. That is, the student must actually perform the task (and this is generally under the tutorship of the instructor who is nearby for consultation). So, if our student can't be walked through it over the internet, it may be better just to ship the gun off to the factory. The advantage of sending it to Ruger is that they'll perform a function test to ensure that everything is working (but they probably won't test fire it) prior to shipping it back. BTW, I'd buy it too for $250 if he didn't want it. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

May 23, 2009, 12:17 PM	#18
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	Sounds like ..... The hammer plunger pin & spring is in wrong or missing, but it shouldn't be? it is like way up in the hammer itsself.... surely no one would pull that out? If you cant get it going, might pay to take the guys advice and ship it to Ruger.... It's 3:15am here, I'm off to bed, PM me later if you are still having probs, I'll see if I can help, if not, I can see your gun taking a holiday to Ruger in the near future __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

May 23, 2009, 04:15 PM	#20
long rider Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2008 Posts: 669	Nice pair ya got there dingo.:d __________________ Sod Buster Tried To Pull On Willson.

May 23, 2009, 04:50 PM	#21
the rifleer Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2008 Location: Sunny California Posts: 1,281	I can take apart all of my rifles and put them back together blindfolded too, but the problem is that with them i had it properly assembled the first time and also had good instructions. This is my first revolver and i have never taken one apart before and have nothing to base it on and had no clue what it looks like when it is correctly assembled, but i knew that the cylinder should lock up. What ever part that pulls the latch down is the part i need, as i think its missing, but again, i have no referance. If i can figure it out by tuesday, then i will mail it to ruger, but would prefer to fix it myself if i can.

May 23, 2009, 06:15 PM	#22
olmontanaboy Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2009 Location: Northeast for now Posts: 266	Don't know if this will help or not, you can zoom in on the exploded view and see what part go where. http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firear...Manuals/13.pdf __________________ Olmontanaboy No good deed goes unpunished. A loaded gun, a faithful dog,,, consider yourself lucky.

May 23, 2009, 06:36 PM	#23
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	Cylinder latch spring, KCB04600?

May 23, 2009, 07:34 PM	#24
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,838	My thoughts exactly mykeal. I bet one or both of the cylinder latch spring legs isn't properly installed. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

May 23, 2009, 08:01 PM	#25
RRR Senior Member Join Date: November 21, 2005 Posts: 100	Had a 1976,er shot good! Had some others shot ok. Strong gun.