Reloading for others - Page 2

langenc · December 6, 2011, 10:04 PM

Some of us do it occasionally.

I didnt read all posts but maybe someone suggested we are 'manufactures' of ammo and need a special license???

Big Yac · December 6, 2011, 11:16 PM

I agree its sad our society is so sue happy anymore and you cant help a friend out without having to worry about the what ifs. This friend is like a brother but like a previous post said about lost wages, time, mortgage due, you just never know. Anyways we had a bit of a reloading party tonight with him loading his own ammo. This friend now has a Rock Chucker in his sights so I think he liked it.

Wyoredman · December 7, 2011, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Seriously, if you're very careful and pay close attention, it's a risk like anything else in life.

I'm with Chris in VA on this one. We can be sued for anything we do, quit worrying about it. The odds are, your friend isn't sueing you over a box of reloads.

I refuse to live in fear of the laywer!

I guess if the day comes that my best friend takes everything I have because I loaded him some .243 deer ammo, I will have learned my lesson. Until that time, I will continue giving him fresh deer loads every season.

Maybe I should quit giving fresh eggs and milk away? You never know when someone might get sick.

zxcvbob · December 7, 2011, 11:20 AM

It won't be your friend suing you, it'll be his insurance company.

(I've given away reloads before in spite of the risk, but I don't make a habit of it)

BerettaPx4 · December 7, 2011, 12:34 PM

I shoot with a very good friend and if one of us buys a new brand of ammo we will share it to see how we like it. But I never let him shoot my reloads, and he doesn't want to. All for the reasons you all are stating here. We both fully understand the problems associated with and accident, and don't want to put our friendship in jepordy, over a box of ammo. It's not just about being sued, I also think about having to live with the thought that a friend was injured because of an error that I made. If a person is really a good friend they will understand why its best to learn how to reload the ammo themselves. It will also open to them, another enjoyable part of the shooting hobby. JMHO
regards
Ed

briandg · December 7, 2011, 03:59 PM

Quote:

I guess if the day comes that my best friend takes everything I have because I loaded him some .243 deer ammo, I will have learned my lesson. Until that time, I will continue giving him fresh deer loads every season.

Maybe I should quit giving fresh eggs and milk away? You never know when someone might get sick.

I don't think you're taking this in the proper context.

The odds of you blowing up his rifle and seriously injuring him are slim. But, if it does happen, you are toast. Period.

He may jam mud down the barrel, he may have stored chewing gum there last season. There are lots of variables that don't include your error, and whatever it was, when the bolt of his weatherby blows right through his left frontal lobe, the end of your life begins.

Will he sue if the cylinder of his .357 fails? dunno. The problem is that all is chaos. The more serious the event, the more serious the threat of losing it all is.

Should you stop giving away eggs? maybe. what happens when someone gets sick from bad eggs? an ambulance chaser starts a class action suit. If your neighbor gets salmonella poisoning, loses both kidneys to the infection, and suffers brain damage because of fever and antibiotic allergy, is she going to let you off the hook?

She's going to crucify you.

Keep on living the way you choose to, but never forget, you're not the one in charge of your own future. all it takes is a single mistake, and your future may be completely destroyed, in any of a million ways.

BigJimP · December 7, 2011, 04:28 PM

and if you charge him / or sell them in some way ...your homeowners liability insurance will probably not provide you any liability coverage...

I'm not saying its a great idea ...but since you gave them to him / you're better off than letting him pay you something for them.

Its a way better idea to tutor him / help him like you did - and encourage him to get his own equipment.

brickeyee · December 7, 2011, 04:30 PM

The exception that lets us avoid FFLs and licensing is ammunition for personal use.

federali · December 7, 2011, 05:57 PM

If you reload ammunition for sale to others, you are an ammunition manufacturer and must be federally licensed. If your friend supplies the components or reimburses you for what you spent, then in legal jargon, you have entered a gray area. I guess it all depends on whether or not the BATFE inspector has recently enjoyed the pleasures of the flesh.

As our legal system has long since become a lottery, I do not reload for anyone.

Newton24b · December 7, 2011, 06:30 PM

theres no point to it, absolutely no point to it.

wouldnt you hate to load up 25,000 cup loads using a 320 grain lswc for your buddies "ruger" single action. only to find out in the lawsuit that it was just a ruger old army with a 45 colt conversion cylinder intended for original 45 colt saami pressure?

spacecoast · December 7, 2011, 06:38 PM

Call me reckless, but I give away .38 special and .45 ACP reloads as gifts on an infrequent basis to several friends, and they usually return the brass. I don't see it as much if any different than going to the range with them and letting them shoot my reloads. I trust my reloads more than I do commercial ammo.

briandg · December 7, 2011, 07:14 PM

It's a shame that we have gotten this far, that we should be afraid to do favors.

The concerns are legitimate, and just like everything, each individual has to weigh the risks of possibly winding up in court over giving reloads to a friend.

The point about the high power ammo in the old gun is good. I said before, it doesn't have to be about whether you made a mistake, that case is going to be decided by a bunch of hostile attorneys, and a jury who doesn't give a damn about whether you were doing a favor for a friend.

It's just like concealed carry, or even walking out your door. figure out your comfort level for the risk. My only concern is that people really understand the risks involved.

You know that any commercial entity buys product liability insurance. They won't accept any risk.

brickeyee · December 8, 2011, 01:33 PM

Quote:

It's a shame that we have gotten this far, that we should be afraid to do favors.

Teach him how to reload.

er775 · December 10, 2011, 10:40 AM

why dont you just put a disclaimer on the boxes of ammo your loading for your "friends" you know, this product is dangerous use at your own risk, or something like that.

I have to wonder just how good of friends these are if your worried about them sueing you, if its that big of a deal dont do it.

AND TO THE REST OF YOU,,,,STOP WORRYING SO MUCH ABOUT LAWYERS CAUSE THEY AINT ****!!!

I`d rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 !!!!!

good grief,,,I just joined this forum the other day but now Im having second thoughts after reading some these responses

CrustyFN · December 10, 2011, 11:21 AM

Quote:

I have to wonder just how good of friends these are if your worried about them sueing you, if its that big of a deal dont do it.

Well I have never been sued by a friend but had a best friend that I don't get along with any longer. So if you think somebody's friend won't sue them for any reason then you probably have never lost a close friend. If it doesn't bother you then by all means hand your handloads out to anybody you want to. When somebody is asking for my opinion it will always be to not let anybody shoot your handloads and don't shoot others. For me it's not worth the risk, I would rather teach them to load their own.

Welcome to the forum.

IllinoisCoyoteHunter · December 10, 2011, 11:24 AM

Quote:

I`d rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 !!!!!

Me too, but this has nothing to do with loading ammo for friends.

Quote:

AND TO THE REST OF YOU,,,,STOP WORRYING SO MUCH ABOUT LAWYERS CAUSE THEY AINT ****!!!

Big words.

"Internet toughness" never ceases to amaze me.

If you are looking for a forum where everyone has the same views as you need to leave this forum.

brickeyee · December 10, 2011, 07:56 PM

Quote:

why dont you just put a disclaimer on the boxes of ammo your loading for your "friends" you know, this product is dangerous use at your own risk, or something like that.

Generally not worth the ink or paper they are printed on and with.

**44 AMP** · December 10, 2011, 08:19 PM

I have been reloading and assembling new ammo from components for nearly 45 years. I will not give, sell, or trade any of my ammo to anyone else. My ammo is tailored to my firearms.

I would create and work up loads for friends, using their firearms (which, of course, I have to keep until load developement is done

).

When I do this, I'm satisfied that the loads are safe, in those guns. Not worried about litigation, haven't even done that in years.

Teach your friends to reload. IF they "can't find the time", let them buy factory. Thats why its there.

There's no free lunch, reloading isn't always about saving money, its about getting good to best ammo, and doing it right.

I think that when you work for each shot, each one means more.

Dr. Strangelove · December 11, 2011, 05:54 AM

Eh, I loaded many a round for my dad's friend's when I was in high school. They would be going out west or shooting in a beanfield and ask for ammo accurate at a certain range. I'd take their rifle, load, test, tune, and give it back with the specified amount of ammo. They payed for all the components.

Today, I don't have a problem giving reloads to friends and family, as long as the cartridges are loaded within commercial specs. I don't give reloads to bar buddies, or friends of friends, just folks I trust.

I don't break the law, and I don't just give them out, but it's silly to be scared to give someone a few bullets. I wouldn't shoot my reloads if I was afraid to give them to someone else....

TheNatureBoy · December 11, 2011, 07:21 AM

A friend of mine asked me to load some ammo for him a few months ago. I think it was for one of them "spray and pray" semi-auto jobs. Once I told him how much dies, primers, cases, and bullets would cost him I never head from him again. For what ever reason he thought that all of the components were free : /

GlenF · December 11, 2011, 10:10 AM

I give a bunch of my reloaded ammo away. Some to fellow competitors at IDPA events, a whole bunch to kin-folks, and some to anyone who wants to try any of my firearms.

And, I shoot a whole bunch of other folks guns and ammo.

Just call me a risk taker.

er775 · December 11, 2011, 10:22 AM

the unfortunate thing about forums is the lack to actually hear and see what the other persons expressions are and what they are really trying to say and how they are trying to get it across to others.

I do apologize to everyone and anybody that might have been offended by my previous post, it wasnt intended to disrespect anyone. I was merely trying to say we should all stop worrying so much about being sued for every little thing. Yes I understand there is a risk of a lawsuit waiting around every corner but we cant live our lives being scared to death of going around that corner.

with that being said ,,,Good Bye

savagelover · December 11, 2011, 02:33 PM

All I can say is Not a Good Idea...

Newton24b · December 11, 2011, 02:50 PM

unless you have the proper liscence and insurance to reload ammo and have it sold to someone, ya dont reload for someone else. just because you know the person doesnt mean they wont sue you to the wall because of an accident that happens with it.

watch tv courtrooms. 90 percent of what youll get to watch is friends and relatives suing eachother over crap like this.
"they told me to use the red gas can to top off the tank of their mercedes, how did i know that the duct tape label saying it was "deisel" fell off last week"

Lunicy · December 11, 2011, 08:27 PM

BATF Licensing bull**** only applies if he is selling them. He said he gave them to his friend.

December 6, 2011, 11:16 PM	#27
Big Yac Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 422	I agree its sad our society is so sue happy anymore and you cant help a friend out without having to worry about the what ifs. This friend is like a brother but like a previous post said about lost wages, time, mortgage due, you just never know. Anyways we had a bit of a reloading party tonight with him loading his own ammo. This friend now has a Rock Chucker in his sights so I think he liked it. __________________ "...and that's the bottom line, because Big Yac said so."

December 7, 2011, 11:20 AM	#29
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	It won't be your friend suing you, it'll be his insurance company. (I've given away reloads before in spite of the risk, but I don't make a habit of it) __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

December 7, 2011, 05:57 PM	#34
federali Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2011 Location: Nassau County NY Posts: 378	License needed If you reload ammunition for sale to others, you are an ammunition manufacturer and must be federally licensed. If your friend supplies the components or reimburses you for what you spent, then in legal jargon, you have entered a gray area. I guess it all depends on whether or not the BATFE inspector has recently enjoyed the pleasures of the flesh. As our legal system has long since become a lottery, I do not reload for anyone. __________________ Int'l Assoc. of Law Enforcement Firearms Instructors

December 10, 2011, 08:19 PM	#43
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,839	Who reloads ammo without the gun to test it? I have been reloading and assembling new ammo from components for nearly 45 years. I will not give, sell, or trade any of my ammo to anyone else. My ammo is tailored to my firearms. I would create and work up loads for friends, using their firearms (which, of course, I have to keep until load developement is done). When I do this, I'm satisfied that the loads are safe, in those guns. Not worried about litigation, haven't even done that in years. Teach your friends to reload. IF they "can't find the time", let them buy factory. Thats why its there. There's no free lunch, reloading isn't always about saving money, its about getting good to best ammo, and doing it right. I think that when you work for each shot, each one means more. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

December 11, 2011, 05:54 AM	#44
Dr. Strangelove Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2008 Location: Athens, GA Posts: 1,436	Eh, I loaded many a round for my dad's friend's when I was in high school. They would be going out west or shooting in a beanfield and ask for ammo accurate at a certain range. I'd take their rifle, load, test, tune, and give it back with the specified amount of ammo. They payed for all the components. Today, I don't have a problem giving reloads to friends and family, as long as the cartridges are loaded within commercial specs. I don't give reloads to bar buddies, or friends of friends, just folks I trust. I don't break the law, and I don't just give them out, but it's silly to be scared to give someone a few bullets. I wouldn't shoot my reloads if I was afraid to give them to someone else.... __________________ Just remember, when you pull the trigger, the bullets come out going very, very fast. So make sure to keep the weapon pointing away from you.

December 6, 2011, 10:04 PM	#26
langenc Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2007 Location: Montmorency Co, MI Posts: 1,551	Some of us do it occasionally. I didnt read all posts but maybe someone suggested we are 'manufactures' of ammo and need a special license???

December 7, 2011, 12:34 PM	#30
BerettaPx4 Junior Member Join Date: November 27, 2011 Posts: 7	I shoot with a very good friend and if one of us buys a new brand of ammo we will share it to see how we like it. But I never let him shoot my reloads, and he doesn't want to. All for the reasons you all are stating here. We both fully understand the problems associated with and accident, and don't want to put our friendship in jepordy, over a box of ammo. It's not just about being sued, I also think about having to live with the thought that a friend was injured because of an error that I made. If a person is really a good friend they will understand why its best to learn how to reload the ammo themselves. It will also open to them, another enjoyable part of the shooting hobby. JMHO regards Ed

December 7, 2011, 04:28 PM	#32
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	and if you charge him / or sell them in some way ...your homeowners liability insurance will probably not provide you any liability coverage... I'm not saying its a great idea ...but since you gave them to him / you're better off than letting him pay you something for them. Its a way better idea to tutor him / help him like you did - and encourage him to get his own equipment.

December 7, 2011, 04:30 PM	#33
brickeyee Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2004 Posts: 3,351	The exception that lets us avoid FFLs and licensing is ammunition for personal use.

December 7, 2011, 06:30 PM	#35
Newton24b Junior member Join Date: February 10, 2009 Posts: 974	theres no point to it, absolutely no point to it. wouldnt you hate to load up 25,000 cup loads using a 320 grain lswc for your buddies "ruger" single action. only to find out in the lawsuit that it was just a ruger old army with a 45 colt conversion cylinder intended for original 45 colt saami pressure?

December 7, 2011, 06:38 PM	#36
spacecoast Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2009 Location: Sunshine and Keystone States Posts: 4,461	Call me reckless, but I give away .38 special and .45 ACP reloads as gifts on an infrequent basis to several friends, and they usually return the brass. I don't see it as much if any different than going to the range with them and letting them shoot my reloads. I trust my reloads more than I do commercial ammo.

December 7, 2011, 07:14 PM	#37
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	It's a shame that we have gotten this far, that we should be afraid to do favors. The concerns are legitimate, and just like everything, each individual has to weigh the risks of possibly winding up in court over giving reloads to a friend. The point about the high power ammo in the old gun is good. I said before, it doesn't have to be about whether you made a mistake, that case is going to be decided by a bunch of hostile attorneys, and a jury who doesn't give a damn about whether you were doing a favor for a friend. It's just like concealed carry, or even walking out your door. figure out your comfort level for the risk. My only concern is that people really understand the risks involved. You know that any commercial entity buys product liability insurance. They won't accept any risk.

December 10, 2011, 10:40 AM	#39
er775 Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 2011 Posts: 129	why dont you just put a disclaimer on the boxes of ammo your loading for your "friends" you know, this product is dangerous use at your own risk, or something like that. I have to wonder just how good of friends these are if your worried about them sueing you, if its that big of a deal dont do it. AND TO THE REST OF YOU,,,,STOP WORRYING SO MUCH ABOUT LAWYERS CAUSE THEY AINT ****!!! I`d rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 !!!!! good grief,,,I just joined this forum the other day but now Im having second thoughts after reading some these responses

December 11, 2011, 07:21 AM	#45
TheNatureBoy Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2007 Posts: 1,204	A friend of mine asked me to load some ammo for him a few months ago. I think it was for one of them "spray and pray" semi-auto jobs. Once I told him how much dies, primers, cases, and bullets would cost him I never head from him again. For what ever reason he thought that all of the components were free : /

December 11, 2011, 10:10 AM	#46
GlenF Member Join Date: April 4, 2011 Location: Monett, Missouri Posts: 98	afraid to give ammo away I give a bunch of my reloaded ammo away. Some to fellow competitors at IDPA events, a whole bunch to kin-folks, and some to anyone who wants to try any of my firearms. And, I shoot a whole bunch of other folks guns and ammo. Just call me a risk taker.

December 11, 2011, 10:22 AM	#47
er775 Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 2011 Posts: 129	the unfortunate thing about forums is the lack to actually hear and see what the other persons expressions are and what they are really trying to say and how they are trying to get it across to others. I do apologize to everyone and anybody that might have been offended by my previous post, it wasnt intended to disrespect anyone. I was merely trying to say we should all stop worrying so much about being sued for every little thing. Yes I understand there is a risk of a lawsuit waiting around every corner but we cant live our lives being scared to death of going around that corner. with that being said ,,,Good Bye

December 11, 2011, 02:33 PM	#48
savagelover Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2011 Location: Alpine,,NY Posts: 254	All I can say is Not a Good Idea...

December 11, 2011, 02:50 PM	#49
Newton24b Junior member Join Date: February 10, 2009 Posts: 974	unless you have the proper liscence and insurance to reload ammo and have it sold to someone, ya dont reload for someone else. just because you know the person doesnt mean they wont sue you to the wall because of an accident that happens with it. watch tv courtrooms. 90 percent of what youll get to watch is friends and relatives suing eachother over crap like this. "they told me to use the red gas can to top off the tank of their mercedes, how did i know that the duct tape label saying it was "deisel" fell off last week"

December 11, 2011, 08:27 PM	#50
Lunicy Senior Member Join Date: August 1, 2008 Location: Behind enemy lines, jersey shore Posts: 118	BATF Licensing bull**** only applies if he is selling them. He said he gave them to his friend.