airborne outfitting in WWII - Page 2

SIGSHR · January 8, 2013, 05:49 PM

The M-14 was designed to be loaded by either changing magazines OR with stripper clips, that answered the complaint that the M-1 Rifle could not be "topped off".

James K · January 8, 2013, 08:03 PM

CLC:

I don't know what source you want, but I think I have one of the fired cases around someplace. I don't have a notarized statement signed by Douglas MacArthur and Hideki Tojo, complete with an original WWII uTube video.

Johnwilliamson:

M1 clips were sometimes reloaded from boxed ammo, but it was uncommon. Ammo was issued in "spam cans" already loaded in bandoliers in the appropriate clips and no one tried to keep track of ejected clips or reloaded them; they were expendable. ("Excuse, please, honorable Japanese soldier, please do not shoot while I am picking up my clips; we must keep the battlefield tidy!)

Blue Train:

Well, the soldiers certainly didn't have a variety of clips laying around. I would guess that American soldiers found out they could use the Japanese ammo simply by trying it for the heck of it, not because of some desperate need.* My own test was based simply on proving or disproving the story of the ammo; it was interesting to find that the clips would work in an M1903 as well. (They are not a perfect fit in the guide, but they work well enough for an expedient.)

*Some say it is unsafe, but I don't think safety is high on the worry list for combat troops; the job is kind of unsafe to begin with.

Jim

BlueTrain · January 9, 2013, 07:34 AM

To SIGSHR, I had totally forgotten that the M14 would take the stripper clip. It's only been 45 years since I got out, so why didn't I remember that?

To James K., my comment was for the present day owners of those old rifles, not about field use in WWII. There was some use of captured ammuntion, along with the weapons that used them but that probably didn't happen much in the Pacific. In the European theater, some captured weapons were quite prized for their utility beyond their trophy value as long as the ammunition held out. For most of the war, British armored vehicles, but not those supplied by the U.S., used 7.92mm Mauser ammunition but not because they could rely on using captured ammuntion.

I think I have at home some clips made for 7.5 French, 7.92 Mauser, 6.5 Swedish and maybe something else but I don't have rifles for any of those calibers anymore. They're close in size but usually not close enough. They may interchange one way but not the other, meaning cartridges for one caliber will fit and (maybe) work in a clip meant for a different cartridge but not the other way round.

James K · January 9, 2013, 02:07 PM

"Stripper" clips were designed to be a pretty close fit in the clip guides. One reason is that they had to stay in the guide if the rifle was being moved around while being loaded. Further, clips (with a few exceptions, one of which is the Russian Mosin-Nagant clip) are designed so they will pop out of the clip guide when the bolt is closed. The shooter should never have to manually remove the clip from a Mauser, Springfield, M1917 Enfield, British No. 1 or No. 4/5, Japanese Arisaka, SKS, etc. Just close the bolt.

The photo shows a clip in a M1903 rifle. The picture is not upside down, the rifle is.

M1903clip.JPG

Jim

January 9, 2013, 07:34 AM	#28
BlueTrain Senior Member Join Date: September 26, 2005 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 6,141	To SIGSHR, I had totally forgotten that the M14 would take the stripper clip. It's only been 45 years since I got out, so why didn't I remember that? To James K., my comment was for the present day owners of those old rifles, not about field use in WWII. There was some use of captured ammuntion, along with the weapons that used them but that probably didn't happen much in the Pacific. In the European theater, some captured weapons were quite prized for their utility beyond their trophy value as long as the ammunition held out. For most of the war, British armored vehicles, but not those supplied by the U.S., used 7.92mm Mauser ammunition but not because they could rely on using captured ammuntion. I think I have at home some clips made for 7.5 French, 7.92 Mauser, 6.5 Swedish and maybe something else but I don't have rifles for any of those calibers anymore. They're close in size but usually not close enough. They may interchange one way but not the other, meaning cartridges for one caliber will fit and (maybe) work in a clip meant for a different cartridge but not the other way round. __________________ Shoot low, sheriff. They're riding Shetlands! Underneath the starry flag, civilize 'em with a Krag, and return us to our own beloved homes! Buy War Bonds.

January 8, 2013, 05:49 PM	#26
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	The M-14 was designed to be loaded by either changing magazines OR with stripper clips, that answered the complaint that the M-1 Rifle could not be "topped off".

January 8, 2013, 08:03 PM	#27
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	CLC: I don't know what source you want, but I think I have one of the fired cases around someplace. I don't have a notarized statement signed by Douglas MacArthur and Hideki Tojo, complete with an original WWII uTube video. Johnwilliamson: M1 clips were sometimes reloaded from boxed ammo, but it was uncommon. Ammo was issued in "spam cans" already loaded in bandoliers in the appropriate clips and no one tried to keep track of ejected clips or reloaded them; they were expendable. ("Excuse, please, honorable Japanese soldier, please do not shoot while I am picking up my clips; we must keep the battlefield tidy!) Blue Train: Well, the soldiers certainly didn't have a variety of clips laying around. I would guess that American soldiers found out they could use the Japanese ammo simply by trying it for the heck of it, not because of some desperate need.* My own test was based simply on proving or disproving the story of the ammo; it was interesting to find that the clips would work in an M1903 as well. (They are not a perfect fit in the guide, but they work well enough for an expedient.) *Some say it is unsafe, but I don't think safety is high on the worry list for combat troops; the job is kind of unsafe to begin with. Jim

January 9, 2013, 02:07 PM	#29
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	"Stripper" clips were designed to be a pretty close fit in the clip guides. One reason is that they had to stay in the guide if the rifle was being moved around while being loaded. Further, clips (with a few exceptions, one of which is the Russian Mosin-Nagant clip) are designed so they will pop out of the clip guide when the bolt is closed. The shooter should never have to manually remove the clip from a Mauser, Springfield, M1917 Enfield, British No. 1 or No. 4/5, Japanese Arisaka, SKS, etc. Just close the bolt. The photo shows a clip in a M1903 rifle. The picture is not upside down, the rifle is. M1903clip.JPG Jim