Rem 870 SP shell mis-feeding problems

DuckChaser04 · December 5, 2004, 09:00 PM

Hi,
I'm new to this forum...but what a find!! I've been suffering with a Rem 870 SP 12 ga. mis-feed problem for about a year plus now. I've read your forum and found a similar thread "Rem 870 jamming, FTE, FTF problems, PLEASE HELP" that was an excellent guide to my problems. It has lead me to find my shotguns ailement....the Shell latch 12 ga right (# 102315). It appears that it doesn't contact the shell while still in the magazine, leading to the left side to do all the holding work and maybe leading to a binding problem.

THE PROBLEM:

I'm a duck hunter and a spring turkey hunter and have a few extra Remington barrels set up for what I do:

- 26" 3" mag Rem Choke system with Hi-Vis sights and extra full MAD Choke for turkey hunting. No problems with an feeding of shells.
- 26" and 30" 3" mag Rem Choke system for waterfowl hunting. Random mis feeding (not feeding the next shell) problems.

Last year my gun started to randomly "not feed the next shell" while waterfowl hunting. I broke the gun down and found it extremely dirty and cleaned it. No change in the misfeeds. I lived with it becuase it was so random. It seemed to not feed the next shell with one in the chamber and two in the magazine...leaving me completely frustrated to follow up with a kill on the second shot (denied!!!). It doesn't do this consistently. In fact, it seems to do it mostly when shooting above a 40 degree angle (which is typical when waterfowl hunting). I've expeirence one "lock-up" when the gun appeared to be jammed without letting me cycle the second shell in. I think I just used the action release to cycle the next shell but...oh well the bird was on his way to freedom. Man this is becoming very frustrating and leading to "is it going to work this time?" type mind games.

After reading the problems of Joe Momma and all the remedies from the forum members, I broke the gun down today with forum advice in hand. I think I've found the problem. The right shell latch (item #56 in Rem Parts diagram for the 870) is not engaing the shell. I'm making the assumption that "BOTH LATCHES ENGAGE RETAINED SHELLS IN THE MAGAZINE....Right???? Somebody please confirm this.

If this is so...the left is functioning fine (touching and retaining the shell in the magazine), but the right appears not to be engaed. Everything works fine when cycling shells through the gun without firing but in the field...random mis-feeds.

Today I tried to remove the right latch...it apears to be in for good. Is there a trick in it's removal? Is it spot welded? With the trigger assembly and bolt/forearm removed, I couldn't remove either the right or the left side. Not wanting to warp or kink the latches, I didn't use a lot of muster.

Please describe how to remove the latches. They appear to be locked in especially on the oposite end of where it retains the shells in the magazine. I used a flat small screw driver and lifted the side that hold the shells first but as I worked down the latch it appear to be locked in the opposite side. Help befre I order new parts.

Thanks in advance.

KD

Dfariswheel · December 5, 2004, 11:05 PM

STOP.......The shell latches are staked in place, DO NOT REMOVE THEM.

Remington's shell latches are staked in place with a special staking tool. They cannot be properly replaced without this tool.
If you remove the latch, you're SCREWED without the special staking tool.

Here's how the shell latches are SUPPOSED to work:

When a shell is inserted into the magazine, the LEFT shell latch catches and holds the shell in the magazine tube.

When the pump handle is pulled to the rear, a small "Ramp" on the left operating bar pushes the shell latch outward, and releases the shell into the receiver.

When the pump handle is pushed forward to chamber the shell, a "Ramp" on the RIGHT operating bar pushes the RIGHT shell latch outward, releasing another shell from the magazine, which is caught by the LEFT shell latch before it can be push all the way out into the receiver.

If you turn the gun upside down and look inside the receiver, as you push the pump handle back and forth you will see the LEFT latch being pushed outward on the back stroke, and the RIGHT latch on the forward stroke.

Things to check:
First, field strip the gun, including removing the bolt, trigger guard, and fore end assembly.

Check BOTH shell latches to be sure they are FIRMLY staked in place and can't move out of position. Again, DO NOT try to remove them.

Gently press the latches toward the receiver walls to be sure they are "springy" AND will move without catching or sticking.
Often shell latches give problems because of burrs or just plain crud impacted underneath.
CLEAN the receiver with a pressurized spray cleaner like "Gun Scrubber", then re-lube with a spray on lube like Rem-Oil.
Often, all that's wrong is CRUD under the latches.

Check both action bars on the fore end. The bars must be straight, and not bent, burred, distorted, or otherwise damaged.

Check the "ramps" on each action bar for burrs, or deformed areas.

Disassemble and clean the MAGAZINE tube, spring, and follower. Check inside the tube for rust, dents, or debris.
Check the spring for kinks, wear, or weakness.
Sometimes shells won't feed because the magazine is dirty or the spring is weak, and it just can't force the shells back fast enough.

If in doubt, replace the spring, their cheap.

Reassemble the gun, and with the safety ON, and BEING CAREFUL, insert one shell into the magazine.
It should be held by the LEFT shell latch against the shell head.

Insert another shell, then slowly pump the handle as you watch the shell latch on the LEFT. As the pump handle "ramp" contacts the shell latch, it should move toward the receiver wall, and the shell should be pushed into the receiver.

With the pump handle all the way back, dump the shell out the ejection port, then slowly push the handle forward.

Watch as the RIGHT action bar "ramp" contacts the RIGHT shell release. It should move the latch outward against the receiver wall, and the next shell should move back JUST SLIGHTLY, until it's caught and held by the LEFT shell latch.

If none of the cleaning and inspection solve the problem, I'd take the gun to a Remington qualified gunsmith, (Not that many gunsmith's have the staking tool either) and have him figure out what's wrong. Or send it to the factory for a repair.

To re-cap: The LEFT shell latch holds the shell until the pump handle is pumped back, then it releases the shell into the gun.

When the pump goes forward, the RIGHT latch releases another shell, which is immediately caught by the LEFT latch before it can be pushed into the gun.

Clean under the latches, check the latches for burrs or impacted dirt underneath, and clean the magazine tube, checking the spring for tension.

DuckChaser04 · December 6, 2004, 08:52 PM

Dfarriswheel,
Thanks for your quick response. I didn't know that the shell latches work alternately...makes sense. I checked the cycling of shells as you suggested...you're right. The left holds the initial shell until pumped. The Right holds the second shell until the pump is recycled to the shoot position where the Left takes over. Thanks!!!

Well, I disassembled the gun exactly as you described on Sunday (day I posted) and performed the exact cleaning as you described. I did find a little debris behind the Left but everything else seemed fine. Magazine tube was not debris filled but did have some minor filming that I removed with swabs and solvent.

The shell latches appear to be springgy...so I assume they're OK.

Regarding the magazine spring...I agree, in a 16 year old shot gun...order another...they're cheap.

I haven't had a chance to test my cleaning to see if we've solved my mis-feed problem. Let me do that and get back to you. Sure appreciate your advice.

KD

DuckChaser04 · December 18, 2004, 07:30 AM

Dfariswheel,

Took the ol' meat gun duck hunting yesterday and it performed without a mis-feed. I broke the gun down again and paid extra attention to the shell latches and found a little debris behind the Right latch. I didn't see any burrs or debris that would cause any other problems. Re-assembled and off to the marsh.

One shell hung but I think I "short pumped" on a real verticle shot. I shot 11 times with this one incident so....Good so far!

Thanks for your descritiions...they helped me look a little closer.

KD

December 5, 2004, 09:00 PM	#1
DuckChaser04 Junior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: Missouri Posts: 14	Rem 870 SP shell mis-feeding problems Hi, I'm new to this forum...but what a find!! I've been suffering with a Rem 870 SP 12 ga. mis-feed problem for about a year plus now. I've read your forum and found a similar thread "Rem 870 jamming, FTE, FTF problems, PLEASE HELP" that was an excellent guide to my problems. It has lead me to find my shotguns ailement....the Shell latch 12 ga right (# 102315). It appears that it doesn't contact the shell while still in the magazine, leading to the left side to do all the holding work and maybe leading to a binding problem. THE PROBLEM: I'm a duck hunter and a spring turkey hunter and have a few extra Remington barrels set up for what I do: - 26" 3" mag Rem Choke system with Hi-Vis sights and extra full MAD Choke for turkey hunting. No problems with an feeding of shells. - 26" and 30" 3" mag Rem Choke system for waterfowl hunting. Random mis feeding (not feeding the next shell) problems. Last year my gun started to randomly "not feed the next shell" while waterfowl hunting. I broke the gun down and found it extremely dirty and cleaned it. No change in the misfeeds. I lived with it becuase it was so random. It seemed to not feed the next shell with one in the chamber and two in the magazine...leaving me completely frustrated to follow up with a kill on the second shot (denied!!!). It doesn't do this consistently. In fact, it seems to do it mostly when shooting above a 40 degree angle (which is typical when waterfowl hunting). I've expeirence one "lock-up" when the gun appeared to be jammed without letting me cycle the second shell in. I think I just used the action release to cycle the next shell but...oh well the bird was on his way to freedom. Man this is becoming very frustrating and leading to "is it going to work this time?" type mind games. After reading the problems of Joe Momma and all the remedies from the forum members, I broke the gun down today with forum advice in hand. I think I've found the problem. The right shell latch (item #56 in Rem Parts diagram for the 870) is not engaing the shell. I'm making the assumption that "BOTH LATCHES ENGAGE RETAINED SHELLS IN THE MAGAZINE....Right???? Somebody please confirm this. If this is so...the left is functioning fine (touching and retaining the shell in the magazine), but the right appears not to be engaed. Everything works fine when cycling shells through the gun without firing but in the field...random mis-feeds. Today I tried to remove the right latch...it apears to be in for good. Is there a trick in it's removal? Is it spot welded? With the trigger assembly and bolt/forearm removed, I couldn't remove either the right or the left side. Not wanting to warp or kink the latches, I didn't use a lot of muster. Please describe how to remove the latches. They appear to be locked in especially on the oposite end of where it retains the shells in the magazine. I used a flat small screw driver and lifted the side that hold the shells first but as I worked down the latch it appear to be locked in the opposite side. Help befre I order new parts. Thanks in advance. KD

December 6, 2004, 08:52 PM	#3
DuckChaser04 Junior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: Missouri Posts: 14	Cleaned and checked Dfarriswheel, Thanks for your quick response. I didn't know that the shell latches work alternately...makes sense. I checked the cycling of shells as you suggested...you're right. The left holds the initial shell until pumped. The Right holds the second shell until the pump is recycled to the shoot position where the Left takes over. Thanks!!! Well, I disassembled the gun exactly as you described on Sunday (day I posted) and performed the exact cleaning as you described. I did find a little debris behind the Left but everything else seemed fine. Magazine tube was not debris filled but did have some minor filming that I removed with swabs and solvent. The shell latches appear to be springgy...so I assume they're OK. Regarding the magazine spring...I agree, in a 16 year old shot gun...order another...they're cheap. I haven't had a chance to test my cleaning to see if we've solved my mis-feed problem. Let me do that and get back to you. Sure appreciate your advice. KD

December 18, 2004, 07:30 AM	#4
DuckChaser04 Junior Member Join Date: December 5, 2004 Location: Missouri Posts: 14	870 Mis-feeds Fixed!! Dfariswheel, Took the ol' meat gun duck hunting yesterday and it performed without a mis-feed. I broke the gun down again and paid extra attention to the shell latches and found a little debris behind the Right latch. I didn't see any burrs or debris that would cause any other problems. Re-assembled and off to the marsh. One shell hung but I think I "short pumped" on a real verticle shot. I shot 11 times with this one incident so....Good so far! Thanks for your descritiions...they helped me look a little closer. KD

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December 5, 2004, 11:05 PM	#2
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,478	STOP.......The shell latches are staked in place, DO NOT REMOVE THEM. Remington's shell latches are staked in place with a special staking tool. They cannot be properly replaced without this tool. If you remove the latch, you're SCREWED without the special staking tool. Here's how the shell latches are SUPPOSED to work: When a shell is inserted into the magazine, the LEFT shell latch catches and holds the shell in the magazine tube. When the pump handle is pulled to the rear, a small "Ramp" on the left operating bar pushes the shell latch outward, and releases the shell into the receiver. When the pump handle is pushed forward to chamber the shell, a "Ramp" on the RIGHT operating bar pushes the RIGHT shell latch outward, releasing another shell from the magazine, which is caught by the LEFT shell latch before it can be push all the way out into the receiver. If you turn the gun upside down and look inside the receiver, as you push the pump handle back and forth you will see the LEFT latch being pushed outward on the back stroke, and the RIGHT latch on the forward stroke. Things to check: First, field strip the gun, including removing the bolt, trigger guard, and fore end assembly. Check BOTH shell latches to be sure they are FIRMLY staked in place and can't move out of position. Again, DO NOT try to remove them. Gently press the latches toward the receiver walls to be sure they are "springy" AND will move without catching or sticking. Often shell latches give problems because of burrs or just plain crud impacted underneath. CLEAN the receiver with a pressurized spray cleaner like "Gun Scrubber", then re-lube with a spray on lube like Rem-Oil. Often, all that's wrong is CRUD under the latches. Check both action bars on the fore end. The bars must be straight, and not bent, burred, distorted, or otherwise damaged. Check the "ramps" on each action bar for burrs, or deformed areas. Disassemble and clean the MAGAZINE tube, spring, and follower. Check inside the tube for rust, dents, or debris. Check the spring for kinks, wear, or weakness. Sometimes shells won't feed because the magazine is dirty or the spring is weak, and it just can't force the shells back fast enough. If in doubt, replace the spring, their cheap. Reassemble the gun, and with the safety ON, and BEING CAREFUL, insert one shell into the magazine. It should be held by the LEFT shell latch against the shell head. Insert another shell, then slowly pump the handle as you watch the shell latch on the LEFT. As the pump handle "ramp" contacts the shell latch, it should move toward the receiver wall, and the shell should be pushed into the receiver. With the pump handle all the way back, dump the shell out the ejection port, then slowly push the handle forward. Watch as the RIGHT action bar "ramp" contacts the RIGHT shell release. It should move the latch outward against the receiver wall, and the next shell should move back JUST SLIGHTLY, until it's caught and held by the LEFT shell latch. If none of the cleaning and inspection solve the problem, I'd take the gun to a Remington qualified gunsmith, (Not that many gunsmith's have the staking tool either) and have him figure out what's wrong. Or send it to the factory for a repair. To re-cap: The LEFT shell latch holds the shell until the pump handle is pumped back, then it releases the shell into the gun. When the pump goes forward, the RIGHT latch releases another shell, which is immediately caught by the LEFT latch before it can be pushed into the gun. Clean under the latches, check the latches for burrs or impacted dirt underneath, and clean the magazine tube, checking the spring for tension.