11-87 or 391?

gtomax · March 16, 2006, 07:12 PM

Looking to get a semi soon. I've recently become quite interested in the clay sports, sporting clays and skeet. I was thinking of getting an 11-87 premier or a Beretta 391. Is the Beretta worth the extra $$ or will the 11-87 work just fine? Mostly will be used for light target loads as I do not hunt.

Thanks.

iudoug · March 16, 2006, 07:21 PM

391 Beretta. Let me say this... I own ALOT of Remingtons from a 410 up to a 10 ga. Bought the Beretta to go to Argentina with and fell in love with them...go work the actions on them (ask first

) I think you will feel and hear the difference....Dont get me wrong, you can easily get by with the Remington....think you will like the Beretta better...Thats my 2 cents

Hotbarrel · March 16, 2006, 07:43 PM

I agree. A friend has a beautiful older 1100 that requires constant attention and is very finicky about shells -basically Win AAs -and goes thru O-rings like they were Kleenex. (I think it's a problem with that gun's piston). Another friend has a 390 that gives no trouble. We mostly shoot clays together, with the occasional upland and duck hunt.
Another option would be the 3901 American. A very handsome gun assembled in Maryland, and a little cheaper than the 391. Also, you might look for a good, lightly-used 390 or 391. They're out there and a real value. Be sure to look up the used values before buying.
I have a Fabarm H368 I bought last year for $550 NIB when the store owner stopped selling H&Ks. It's a great gun, a lot like the 390 internally.

kudu · March 16, 2006, 07:46 PM

I am very much like iudoug, I have 3 1100's and an 11-87. Love them all, but I have shot the Beretta 391 Parallel Target model, fell in love with it. I don't have one yet, but it is just a matter of time.

Ruger4570 · March 16, 2006, 08:55 PM

I have shot a 391 on many occasions but I own a 390.. I think I like the 390 better. I also own a couple of 1100's but not an 11-87, but again shot the 11-87 many times. I think the only thing about the 11-87that could present a problem will be with the really light loads not functioning as well in that gun as well as they function the older 1100 models. I think any of these guns will be fine for your purposes. I do tend to lean towards the Berreta slightly,,

HSMITH · March 17, 2006, 09:01 AM

The 391 is hands down a more reliable and more durable shotgun. It is WELL worth the additional cost.

PJR · March 17, 2006, 09:05 AM

My 391 is ultra reliable with light loads right down to 7/8 oz. at 1150 fps. My now departed Remington wasn't.

The only place where Remington beats Beretta is in 28 gauge and .410 autoloaders but only because Beretta doesn't make the 391 in those gauges. If and when they do I'll be fighting to be first in line to buy one in 28 gauge.

Waterengineer · March 17, 2006, 12:39 PM

Do not compromize - get the 391 - you will be happy you did 20 years from now.

malachi · March 17, 2006, 08:53 PM

Guess I'm the only Remington fan. Started with a Sportsman 58, then a 1100, and now a 11-87. Only malfunctions that I remember were with the Sportsman 58, and that was with paper shells. When they switched to plastic the problems went away.

Rem1187 · March 17, 2006, 09:44 PM

I have owned the 1187 for two years with no problems. A friend owns a 391 which has a slightly slicer action. I say buy the 1187 in my oppinion it just is cheaper youll save money with nearly idetical performance. You wont be as sad if you get a ding on a 1187 because it didnt cost you a fortune. I bought mine used in good condition for 430 and its my favorie shotgun all around.
Have Fun
Rem1187

Rem1187 · March 17, 2006, 09:44 PM

triple post oops

Rem1187 · March 17, 2006, 09:45 PM

oops

JMag · March 17, 2006, 10:42 PM

391...if there's a better gas system, I don't know of it.

maas · March 18, 2006, 12:09 AM

to point somthing out, remington has been using the 1100 style since the 60's. some of you might say tryed and true, but i say old and beat to death. there has been alot of changes in the semi auto world since 1995 or so. my thoughts are get a browning gold hunter

grey_pilgrim · March 18, 2006, 09:09 PM

I like my 11-87LH, and would not trade it for a 391. It has less parts when you take off the gas cover, and *to me* seems easier to clean, and hasn't been plagued with problems that some people have had, even with target loads. I had three FTE's in one instance, cleaned gun and problems stopped.

But, FWIW : our shooting club uses beretta 391's (it may be 390, but i'm assuming that the gas system is the same. . . YMMV) as club guns. They are slick and reliable. We opened one up to clean, and it was nasty and all crudded up, probably hadn't been cleaned in 1000s or rounds, and it wasn't having "problems".

Which gun do you like the "feel" of?

Steve Morgan · March 20, 2006, 02:57 PM

Gtomax,

I've had them both. Either will work. Here are some differences:

391's cost more, have stock drop and cast adjustments, have a chrome lined barrel, and the two that I had patterned 70/30 high.

11-87's cost less, do not have adjustable stock drop, have zero stock cast off, do not have chrome lined barrels, and most will pattern 50/50.

The 70/30 pattern thing, once used to, is OK but doesn't match my other guns, so I no longer have a 391.

gtomax · March 20, 2006, 04:18 PM

thanks for all the info guys.

steve - did you by any chance ever live in california? knew someone with your same name years ago...

Steve Morgan · March 24, 2006, 01:05 PM

Gtomax,

No, it wasn't me. I'm in TN. Which gun are you going to get?

gtomax · March 27, 2006, 12:30 PM

After handling several, i'm leaning way over to the Beretta side. The 11-87 is a hell of a gun and would be better suited as a hunter in my opinion. It's heavier and feels like it's built like a tank, I have no doubt it would go the distance.

The Beretta is a lighter gun that seems more purpose-built towards the shooting sports. In fact, i think I'll save up (for a long time) and eventually go after a Beretta AL391 Teknys Gold Sporting. Now the only question I need to answer is 'where'd I stash that 'extra' $1500?'

biglabsrule · March 27, 2006, 12:40 PM

good choice, im a remington man myself, only hitch is they do jam above average, remingtons are designed more for hunting, "woodsmaster...", they do have a 11-87 skeet i beleive but they series is made simply for the woods... oh and I enjoy cleaning my guns so don't mind having remingtons that might become prone to jam when dirty

grey_pilgrim · March 27, 2006, 02:29 PM

Question about hunting/competition guns. I thought it was the other way around: that is, you want a light hunting gun because you might have to hump it halfway to holland and back, and will only shoot a few times. On the flip side, a heavier gun during competition might be advantageous for mitigating recoil (although I must admit that at the end of some rounds of doubles trap, i've been exhausted. . . need to work on them arm muscles

. My shoulder felt fine, tho

) Again, correct me if i'm wrong about this.

For most of us, it doesn't matter. We can get away with using whatever we like. It sounds like you like the beretta, so go for it. A well maintained shotgun will last a long time. (I guess we 11-87 ppl better stock up on o-rings)

gtomax · March 27, 2006, 03:52 PM

grey_pilgrim, you're also correct. Different people need different things I suppose. For me, if I'm going to shoulder a gun 50 to 100 times in a few hours I'd like it to be lighter rather than heavier. If I'm slogging through the woods, a lighter gun makes an easier carry, but a good sling can take care of that, I'd like something that could take a beating. I guess it's personal though... lighter (in general) is probably better for most cases other than beating something over the head with the thing

. Yeah, the Beretta fits me a bit better than the Remington (which I'm also VERY fond of)... that said the price tag is the only thing holding me back at the moment. Ideally I'd like both!!!

InSoMNiaX23 · March 27, 2006, 04:13 PM

Not to hijack the post, but what does it mean to pattern 70/30 or 50/50? I've never seen these terms before.

kudu · March 27, 2006, 07:08 PM

InSoMNiaX23, if you aim at a target at about 25 yards, with a dot in the center, the pattern of the shot above and below the halfway mark is what 50/50 means. If they are evenly spaced above and below of your aiming point, it's 50/50. Many target guns run 60/40 and trap guns run up to 70/30 and 80/20 for the rising targets. Many clay shooters like the target above their barrel so they can see any moves it makes suddenly, if it is right on where you look it may drop and you may not see it, this is where a 60/40 pattern works well.

HSMITH · March 27, 2006, 08:45 PM

I fiddle with EVERY one of my shotguns to shoot at least 60/40 and like 75/25. I like to be able to see what I am shooting at, even on a rising target I can see a lot more of the target for longer than I would with a 50/50 gun. It makes a big difference once you learn where the gun is looking.

March 16, 2006, 07:12 PM	#1
gtomax Member Join Date: November 23, 2005 Posts: 84	11-87 or 391? Looking to get a semi soon. I've recently become quite interested in the clay sports, sporting clays and skeet. I was thinking of getting an 11-87 premier or a Beretta 391. Is the Beretta worth the extra $$ or will the 11-87 work just fine? Mostly will be used for light target loads as I do not hunt. Thanks.

March 16, 2006, 07:21 PM	#2
iudoug Member Join Date: October 29, 2005 Posts: 82	Well....my opinion is the 391 Beretta. Let me say this... I own ALOT of Remingtons from a 410 up to a 10 ga. Bought the Beretta to go to Argentina with and fell in love with them...go work the actions on them (ask first ) I think you will feel and hear the difference....Dont get me wrong, you can easily get by with the Remington....think you will like the Beretta better...Thats my 2 cents

March 16, 2006, 07:43 PM	#3
Hotbarrel Senior Member Join Date: August 7, 2004 Location: Sacracalifas Posts: 122	I agree. A friend has a beautiful older 1100 that requires constant attention and is very finicky about shells -basically Win AAs -and goes thru O-rings like they were Kleenex. (I think it's a problem with that gun's piston). Another friend has a 390 that gives no trouble. We mostly shoot clays together, with the occasional upland and duck hunt. Another option would be the 3901 American. A very handsome gun assembled in Maryland, and a little cheaper than the 391. Also, you might look for a good, lightly-used 390 or 391. They're out there and a real value. Be sure to look up the used values before buying. I have a Fabarm H368 I bought last year for $550 NIB when the store owner stopped selling H&Ks. It's a great gun, a lot like the 390 internally. __________________ VT VENIANT OMNES -"Let them all come!"

March 16, 2006, 07:46 PM	#4
kudu Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 273	I am very much like iudoug, I have 3 1100's and an 11-87. Love them all, but I have shot the Beretta 391 Parallel Target model, fell in love with it. I don't have one yet, but it is just a matter of time. __________________ "a shootin' we will go"

March 17, 2006, 12:39 PM	#8
Waterengineer Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2006 Location: Aurora, CO and Palm Beach, FL Posts: 863	391 Do not compromize - get the 391 - you will be happy you did 20 years from now.

March 16, 2006, 08:55 PM	#5
Ruger4570 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2005 Location: Rochester, New York Posts: 2,136	I have shot a 391 on many occasions but I own a 390.. I think I like the 390 better. I also own a couple of 1100's but not an 11-87, but again shot the 11-87 many times. I think the only thing about the 11-87that could present a problem will be with the really light loads not functioning as well in that gun as well as they function the older 1100 models. I think any of these guns will be fine for your purposes. I do tend to lean towards the Berreta slightly,,

March 17, 2006, 09:01 AM	#6
HSMITH Senior Member Join Date: June 21, 2002 Posts: 2,019	The 391 is hands down a more reliable and more durable shotgun. It is WELL worth the additional cost.

March 17, 2006, 09:05 AM	#7
PJR Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2000 Posts: 1,127	My 391 is ultra reliable with light loads right down to 7/8 oz. at 1150 fps. My now departed Remington wasn't. The only place where Remington beats Beretta is in 28 gauge and .410 autoloaders but only because Beretta doesn't make the 391 in those gauges. If and when they do I'll be fighting to be first in line to buy one in 28 gauge.

March 17, 2006, 08:53 PM	#9
malachi Senior Member Join Date: May 6, 2005 Location: Arkansas Posts: 303	Guess I'm the only Remington fan. Started with a Sportsman 58, then a 1100, and now a 11-87. Only malfunctions that I remember were with the Sportsman 58, and that was with paper shells. When they switched to plastic the problems went away.

March 17, 2006, 09:44 PM	#10
Rem1187 Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2006 Location: VA Posts: 166	1187 all the way I have owned the 1187 for two years with no problems. A friend owns a 391 which has a slightly slicer action. I say buy the 1187 in my oppinion it just is cheaper youll save money with nearly idetical performance. You wont be as sad if you get a ding on a 1187 because it didnt cost you a fortune. I bought mine used in good condition for 430 and its my favorie shotgun all around. Have Fun Rem1187

March 17, 2006, 09:44 PM	#11
Rem1187 Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2006 Location: VA Posts: 166	1187 all the way triple post oops

March 17, 2006, 09:45 PM	#12
Rem1187 Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2006 Location: VA Posts: 166	1187 all the way oops

March 17, 2006, 10:42 PM	#13
JMag Senior Member Join Date: May 28, 2004 Posts: 284	391...if there's a better gas system, I don't know of it.

March 18, 2006, 12:09 AM	#14
maas Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2005 Location: The state of Jefferson Posts: 897	to point somthing out, remington has been using the 1100 style since the 60's. some of you might say tryed and true, but i say old and beat to death. there has been alot of changes in the semi auto world since 1995 or so. my thoughts are get a browning gold hunter __________________ I don't try to offend....some times i get lucky! There's always one thing that makes Republicans look good on election day...........Democrats!

March 18, 2006, 09:09 PM	#15
grey_pilgrim Senior Member Join Date: May 26, 2004 Location: mid-atlantic Posts: 352	I like my 11-87LH, and would not trade it for a 391. It has less parts when you take off the gas cover, and to me seems easier to clean, and hasn't been plagued with problems that some people have had, even with target loads. I had three FTE's in one instance, cleaned gun and problems stopped. But, FWIW : our shooting club uses beretta 391's (it may be 390, but i'm assuming that the gas system is the same. . . YMMV) as club guns. They are slick and reliable. We opened one up to clean, and it was nasty and all crudded up, probably hadn't been cleaned in 1000s or rounds, and it wasn't having "problems". Which gun do you like the "feel" of? __________________ Cheers, Dave

March 20, 2006, 02:57 PM	#16
Steve Morgan Member Join Date: April 29, 2005 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 35	Gtomax, I've had them both. Either will work. Here are some differences: 391's cost more, have stock drop and cast adjustments, have a chrome lined barrel, and the two that I had patterned 70/30 high. 11-87's cost less, do not have adjustable stock drop, have zero stock cast off, do not have chrome lined barrels, and most will pattern 50/50. The 70/30 pattern thing, once used to, is OK but doesn't match my other guns, so I no longer have a 391.

March 20, 2006, 04:18 PM	#17
gtomax Member Join Date: November 23, 2005 Posts: 84	thanks for all the info guys. steve - did you by any chance ever live in california? knew someone with your same name years ago...

March 24, 2006, 01:05 PM	#18
Steve Morgan Member Join Date: April 29, 2005 Location: Nashville, TN Posts: 35	Gtomax, No, it wasn't me. I'm in TN. Which gun are you going to get?

March 27, 2006, 12:30 PM	#19
gtomax Member Join Date: November 23, 2005 Posts: 84	After handling several, i'm leaning way over to the Beretta side. The 11-87 is a hell of a gun and would be better suited as a hunter in my opinion. It's heavier and feels like it's built like a tank, I have no doubt it would go the distance. The Beretta is a lighter gun that seems more purpose-built towards the shooting sports. In fact, i think I'll save up (for a long time) and eventually go after a Beretta AL391 Teknys Gold Sporting. Now the only question I need to answer is 'where'd I stash that 'extra' $1500?'

March 27, 2006, 12:40 PM	#20
biglabsrule Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2006 Location: Adirondack Park, upstate NY north of Utica Posts: 385	good choice, im a remington man myself, only hitch is they do jam above average, remingtons are designed more for hunting, "woodsmaster...", they do have a 11-87 skeet i beleive but they series is made simply for the woods... oh and I enjoy cleaning my guns so don't mind having remingtons that might become prone to jam when dirty __________________ got me a little lady, the gun buying has come to an end, sigh

March 27, 2006, 02:29 PM	#21
grey_pilgrim Senior Member Join Date: May 26, 2004 Location: mid-atlantic Posts: 352	Question about hunting/competition guns. I thought it was the other way around: that is, you want a light hunting gun because you might have to hump it halfway to holland and back, and will only shoot a few times. On the flip side, a heavier gun during competition might be advantageous for mitigating recoil (although I must admit that at the end of some rounds of doubles trap, i've been exhausted. . . need to work on them arm muscles . My shoulder felt fine, tho ) Again, correct me if i'm wrong about this. For most of us, it doesn't matter. We can get away with using whatever we like. It sounds like you like the beretta, so go for it. A well maintained shotgun will last a long time. (I guess we 11-87 ppl better stock up on o-rings) __________________ Cheers, Dave

March 27, 2006, 03:52 PM	#22
gtomax Member Join Date: November 23, 2005 Posts: 84	grey_pilgrim, you're also correct. Different people need different things I suppose. For me, if I'm going to shoulder a gun 50 to 100 times in a few hours I'd like it to be lighter rather than heavier. If I'm slogging through the woods, a lighter gun makes an easier carry, but a good sling can take care of that, I'd like something that could take a beating. I guess it's personal though... lighter (in general) is probably better for most cases other than beating something over the head with the thing . Yeah, the Beretta fits me a bit better than the Remington (which I'm also VERY fond of)... that said the price tag is the only thing holding me back at the moment. Ideally I'd like both!!!

March 27, 2006, 04:13 PM	#23
InSoMNiaX23 Senior Member Join Date: April 11, 2005 Location: STL Posts: 241	Not to hijack the post, but what does it mean to pattern 70/30 or 50/50? I've never seen these terms before.

March 27, 2006, 07:08 PM	#24
kudu Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2004 Location: Northern Indiana Posts: 273	InSoMNiaX23, if you aim at a target at about 25 yards, with a dot in the center, the pattern of the shot above and below the halfway mark is what 50/50 means. If they are evenly spaced above and below of your aiming point, it's 50/50. Many target guns run 60/40 and trap guns run up to 70/30 and 80/20 for the rising targets. Many clay shooters like the target above their barrel so they can see any moves it makes suddenly, if it is right on where you look it may drop and you may not see it, this is where a 60/40 pattern works well. __________________ "a shootin' we will go"

March 27, 2006, 08:45 PM	#25
HSMITH Senior Member Join Date: June 21, 2002 Posts: 2,019	I fiddle with EVERY one of my shotguns to shoot at least 60/40 and like 75/25. I like to be able to see what I am shooting at, even on a rising target I can see a lot more of the target for longer than I would with a 50/50 gun. It makes a big difference once you learn where the gun is looking.