380 ACP Loads

[bignz]

I am about to start loading 380ACP and the reloading data for this load seems like a mess. I use data from the Lyman and Lee manuals. Someone please explain this to me:

Lyman 95g FMJ W231 Start Grain 2.1 Max Grain 2.9 OAL .900
Lee 95g FMJ W231 Start Grain 3.2 Max Gran 3.2 OAL . 975

1) The two ranges of powder don't even overlap.
2) Who ever heard of a start grain and a max grain that were identical?
3) How am I supposed to even guess how long this thing should be?

I could pick other powders they list that are even crazier.

Thanks in advance for any help with this.

[Voyageur]

Different pressure guns? Different chambers? Different lead? Different OAL?

Plunk your magic twanger Froggy and take your pick.

[TATER]

I load a bunch of calibers so I have a bunch of books. The more
books you have the more you run into this stuff. What I try to do
Is Verify the bullet type, look at the test guns and barrel length.
If that jives I then look at the lowest recipe and the highest recipe.
From those two recipes I develop a range. In this case (IF all Jives)
Would be 2.1 to 3.2... Then I start at the lower middle. 2.5 and work
up a couple from there.

I am loading my wife's 380 Colt Mustang for “target Shooting”
The load she likes is using Izzy 95 grain FMJ at 2.8 WW-231
The load works great for her, and she is the shooter so..........
I thought 3.0 was perfect..

[RidgwayCO]

The "average" .380 Auto factory load pushes a 95gr FMJ bullet at about 950 fps, giving 190 ft-lbs of energy at the muzzle. I like to load my .380 Autos to the same power level.

Win 231 (which is also HP-38) is a good powder for the .380.

You've hit upon my biggest problem with the Lee reloading manual. Lee doesn't really do anything other than take data from other sources, and the manual is slack in relating important data like COLs, etc. Additionally, for my purposes I've found the Lyman data to be so underpowered as to be ridiculous. IMHO, the lawyers have taken over there and if they're closer than 90% to a true SAAMI max load, I'd be shocked.

In my experience, I've had good luck with the Speer manuals. They often show data for a variety of jacketed and lead (swaged and cast) bullets, using powder from a variety of manufacturers, and I've been able to chronograph velocities very close to what they show. They're not perfect, but then neither am I. Speer is extremely concerned about sticking a bullet in the barrel due to low pressure, and they go out of their way to ensure this doesn't happen to you.

For what it's worth, the Speer #14 manual shows the recommended range for Win 231 with a 95gr TMJ RN bullet to be 3.6 - 4.0 gr when loaded to a COL of .970 (the .380 Auto maximum COL is given as .984"). Also, Win 231 is shown as the top-performing powder for that bullet weight. Personally, I'd start at 3.6gr of Win 231 and see how it feels/chronographs.

[Pilot]

I also use HP-38/Win231 to reload .380's under a copper washed 95 grain bullet.

[bignz]

Thanks very much.

[tiberius10721]

ive also used hp 38 for 380 loads at the time i was using a lee dipper .3 an i had great results.i was using a dipper at the time cause i didnt have the right disk for my powder measure.that was like five yrs ago when i didnt now squat about reloading

[Gdyup61]

I'm new to reloading and my first reloads were 380 for my Bersa Thunder.

The perfect load for me turned out to be 3.6 of Win 231, behind a 95gr FMJ RN. Federal 100 primers.

Good info from you folks - thanks. Oh, and btw - I have 2 manuals so far, Hornady and Speer, but undoubtedly will get more. Like they say, get data from as many sources as possible.

[ranger351w]

I just ordered the Lee dies for 380 hope it works better than I heard you guys talk about.

I already reload 12,16 and 20 gauge. 223,45/70,38sp.,357mag,9mm and 45acp.
I was hopeing the 380 would load good also. Shoot it in two Keltec p3ats.

[marcodo]

I was supprised to find that my LCP cycled fine and shot point of aim 95 gn with 2.7-2.8 grains of W231 OAL .960

[a7mmnut]

Lyman 95g FMJ W231 Start Grain 2.1 Max Grain 2.9 OAL .900
Lee 95g FMJ W231 Start Grain 3.2 Max Gran 3.2 OAL . 975

1) The two ranges of powder don't even overlap.
2) Who ever heard of a start grain and a max grain that were identical?
3) How am I supposed to even guess how long this thing should be?



The difference in OAL changes the powder capacity left in the case before pressure signs are evident. Deeper seating=higher pressure sooner. You must learn to reload every single chamber for its own cartridge OAL to prevent dangerous events related to this and add to your accuracy. -7-

[bignz]

Thanks for all the great responses. I have found that .900 is below minimum specifications for this round. I can't imagine a chamber that would require such a deep seat. Just for fun I seated a bullet into an empty case to see what it would look like and even to the naked eye it looked silly. Basically it looked like it would if I took a hammer and slammed a bullet into its case. Any type of crimp at this depth would bring the case mouth so far in (because of the slope of the bullet when that deep) that I'm quite sure it would not chamber (as 380 chambers on the case mouth). No other manual on Gods green earth has such a deep seating for the .380.

Has anyone actually seated a .380 to .900 and fired it?

[45Marlin carbine]

if you load cast slugs for this one consider Red Dot or Bullseye. does good for my BDA.

[dgang]

I would look to Alliant powder manual for data. There are a lot of powders suitable for the .380 , Bullseye for plinking, Power Pistol and Unique for max performance. They list bullet weight from 88 gr. to 100 gr. They are the only powder manufacturer that I know of that list +P pressures, up to 20,600 psi.,
withiin SAAMI specs. The Lee load book also lists loads for lead bullets and loads up to 115 gr.
Good shootin' to you, dgang

[Dave R]

I noticed the same discrepancy with loading manuals when I started loading for .380. In one manual, the STARTING load was higher than the MAX load for another manual.

So I started low and worked up.

Now using 4.0gr. of Unique under Berry's 100gr. bullet. Or 3.0gr. of Titegroup with the same bullet.

[Stargazer]

I use Lee dies and check my reloads via a PACT chronograph. I started with 4 grs. of Unique and ended up at 4.4 grs. to simulate the Federal Hydra-Shok and Speer Gold Dot speed. It is a case full but not compressed, no way to double charge. Using a Speer .355" 90 HP bullet. I got around 950 FPS with one of these and 970 FPS out of the other one and my 4.4 gr. reloads fall right in the middle at 960 FPS. No case bulging or flattened primers in my Ruger LCP. Also I set a camera up to record the flash if any. I didn't see any nor did the camera. Video is only 3 seconds long in slow motion so put player on loop to see more. You can see the slide come back and the barrel exposed as the action recoils.

http://home.roadrunner.com/~ispyu2/slo4.42.wmv

[GreenT]

Here is my load:

92 grain lead round nose bullet - 2.6 grains of TiteGroup. I shoot them in a WWII ear Barretta and a modern Keltec concealed carry gun. Both perform well with this load