Variations on a theme...

MFortie · October 14, 2005, 04:36 PM

Hi All,

New guy on the forum with a reloading question.

I have a Sig 226 with a 357Sig barrel and a .40 barrel. Bought it originally with the 357Sig barrel.

I load for it on my Dillon 550B and had a problem awhile back. One day at the range I had a serious overpressure problem -- Sig Arms called it a 'catastrophic ammunition event' (kinda like the term...)

I fired a round and it jammed the weapon, blew the grips loose, stovepiped the next round and was louder than he!!. Needless to say I ceased fire for the day. (This was at an indoor range where they have a sign to 'obtain their professional help in the event of a mis-fire' -- the counter folk all looked dumbfounded and said, "We don't know what to do"... But that's another story!)

At any rate, I contacted Sig, discussed the issue and left the 226 in for repair (and some night sights and a little trigger work while it was there.) I also ordered the .40 cal barrel at the same time.

My thinking was I overcharged the round and I had planned on weighing every single round I had left before firing any again. After receiving the pistol back I've been shooting it exclusively with .40 and haven't gone back to the handloads (commercial ammo for the .40.)

This was over a year ago and I want to start shooting 357Sig again.

So here's my dilemna: My rounds (I have about 250 left) are all 125g Speer Gold Dot HPs over 5.8g of Hodgdon Universal Clays. Brass is a mix of Speer and Starline. After weighing the rounds, I found a range of 201.6 grains to 203.5 grains with the Starline and 194.4 grains to 201.0 grains with the Speer brass. The Speer shows a difference of almost 7 grains! (The average Speer loads fall in two groups -- one around 197.5 grains and 198.7 grains -- the extremes are isolated rounds.)

So what should I consider to be an acceptable tolerance? My inclination is to shoot the 197.x - 198.x grain rounds and pull the bullets on the rest and re-measure the powder. I'm not sure how much variation I should expect in the brass itself.

BTW -- these weights all come off a Dillon electronic scale on a very solid bench.

Thoughts?

Thanks much,

Mark

Dave R · October 14, 2005, 06:08 PM

Welcome to the forum! That's an exciting first post...

Wow, sorry to hear about your kaboom. That must've been a little exciting.

Because the weight variation in brass exceed the comfort factor in powder charges, I've always used an eyeball to check powder charges. But I use a single-stage press. I think that's the only advantage they have over progressives--the ability to eyeball the powder charges before seating.

Sounds like there was no possibility of a bore obstruction (missed powder charge leaves a bullet stuck in the barrel) so a double charge of powder seems like the likely culprit?

Anyway, I don't see any reason not to go back to .357 Sig. Whatever happened was not caliber-related.

So, how did SIG treat you?

Bullet94 · October 14, 2005, 08:55 PM

MFortie

I thought I read where not all 9mm bullets were made to load in 357 Sig. I believe the trouble was with bullet setback because some of the bullets shape was to tapered to get good case neck tension. You might check this out before shooting anymore of your ammo.

918v · October 14, 2005, 10:09 PM

You probably had a double-charge in the round that blew. Or you had a bullet that fell into the case during feeding. In any case, disassemble the remaining rounds. They are clearly unsafe.

Load the 357 so that you have adequate neck tension. One way to do this is to skip the neck expanding/belling process, or to reduce the diameter of the expander plug. Another is to brush the inside of the case neck with a bronze brush to remove all the carbon. Carbon acts like a lubricant. Still another is to use nickle-plated brass. Nickle holds-on to copper much better than bare brass.

The safest way to do this is to load them on a single stage press. This way you can visually verify that each round is assembled correctly.

October 14, 2005, 04:36 PM	#1
MFortie Junior Member Join Date: October 14, 2005 Posts: 1	Variations on a theme... Hi All, New guy on the forum with a reloading question. I have a Sig 226 with a 357Sig barrel and a .40 barrel. Bought it originally with the 357Sig barrel. I load for it on my Dillon 550B and had a problem awhile back. One day at the range I had a serious overpressure problem -- Sig Arms called it a 'catastrophic ammunition event' (kinda like the term...) I fired a round and it jammed the weapon, blew the grips loose, stovepiped the next round and was louder than he!!. Needless to say I ceased fire for the day. (This was at an indoor range where they have a sign to 'obtain their professional help in the event of a mis-fire' -- the counter folk all looked dumbfounded and said, "We don't know what to do"... But that's another story!) At any rate, I contacted Sig, discussed the issue and left the 226 in for repair (and some night sights and a little trigger work while it was there.) I also ordered the .40 cal barrel at the same time. My thinking was I overcharged the round and I had planned on weighing every single round I had left before firing any again. After receiving the pistol back I've been shooting it exclusively with .40 and haven't gone back to the handloads (commercial ammo for the .40.) This was over a year ago and I want to start shooting 357Sig again. So here's my dilemna: My rounds (I have about 250 left) are all 125g Speer Gold Dot HPs over 5.8g of Hodgdon Universal Clays. Brass is a mix of Speer and Starline. After weighing the rounds, I found a range of 201.6 grains to 203.5 grains with the Starline and 194.4 grains to 201.0 grains with the Speer brass. The Speer shows a difference of almost 7 grains! (The average Speer loads fall in two groups -- one around 197.5 grains and 198.7 grains -- the extremes are isolated rounds.) So what should I consider to be an acceptable tolerance? My inclination is to shoot the 197.x - 198.x grain rounds and pull the bullets on the rest and re-measure the powder. I'm not sure how much variation I should expect in the brass itself. BTW -- these weights all come off a Dillon electronic scale on a very solid bench. Thoughts? Thanks much, Mark Last edited by MFortie; October 14, 2005 at 05:36 PM.

October 14, 2005, 06:08 PM	#2
Dave R Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2000 Location: Idaho Posts: 6,073	Welcome to the forum! That's an exciting first post... Wow, sorry to hear about your kaboom. That must've been a little exciting. Because the weight variation in brass exceed the comfort factor in powder charges, I've always used an eyeball to check powder charges. But I use a single-stage press. I think that's the only advantage they have over progressives--the ability to eyeball the powder charges before seating. Sounds like there was no possibility of a bore obstruction (missed powder charge leaves a bullet stuck in the barrel) so a double charge of powder seems like the likely culprit? Anyway, I don't see any reason not to go back to .357 Sig. Whatever happened was not caliber-related. So, how did SIG treat you? __________________ I am Pro-Rights (on gun issues).

October 14, 2005, 08:55 PM	#3
Bullet94 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2004 Location: Kansas Posts: 723	MFortie I thought I read where not all 9mm bullets were made to load in 357 Sig. I believe the trouble was with bullet setback because some of the bullets shape was to tapered to get good case neck tension. You might check this out before shooting anymore of your ammo. __________________ PRO-SECOND AMENDMENT - Live Free or Die

October 14, 2005, 10:09 PM	#4
918v Junior member Join Date: September 25, 2005 Posts: 1,372	You probably had a double-charge in the round that blew. Or you had a bullet that fell into the case during feeding. In any case, disassemble the remaining rounds. They are clearly unsafe. Load the 357 so that you have adequate neck tension. One way to do this is to skip the neck expanding/belling process, or to reduce the diameter of the expander plug. Another is to brush the inside of the case neck with a bronze brush to remove all the carbon. Carbon acts like a lubricant. Still another is to use nickle-plated brass. Nickle holds-on to copper much better than bare brass. The safest way to do this is to load them on a single stage press. This way you can visually verify that each round is assembled correctly.