Rumors about guns and ammo

[Gunplummer]

Over the years you hear a lot of things said about firearms and ammunition that are questionable. Years back someone brought me a .35 Marlin and wanted it converted to a .358 Winchester. The guy swore he read somewhere that it had been done by a gunsmith down south somewhere. It did not seem even close to right to me. I did some research ( The internet is good for something) and it turns out he did read an article about the changeover. The part he missed was that it was a "Special" handload only gun after the conversion.
Heard any good rumors lately? Maybe someone on this forum knows where it started and can come up with the facts.

[Rifleman1776]

My passion is traditional muzzle loaders with real black powder. On the ml forums the myths are legion. To repeat, even though stated as false, only promotes these crazy notions. Folks seem to want to believe the insane and ignore facts. Sadly, most involve safety. I won't repeat any.

[PetahW]

I'm sorta torn between the one about a quick rechambering of an older .300 Savage Model 99 whatever to .308 Win and the one about converting an old Stevens Favorite to .22 Hornet.



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[Jerry45]

I fell for this one myself. Up until 9 months ago. .308 is more accurate than 03-06. I didn't realize it was BS until I got my custom built, on a Remington 700 action. 308 and shot my 40 year old factory 700 with skinny barrel against it. Of course the 06 wasn't as accurate out of the box. Put it (the 06) in a good stock and it shoots as well as the 308. When I say as well, bot rifles shoot sub, sub MOA. I've heard it my whole life and read every other day on this board that 308 is more accurate than 30-06. I'd like to know how and why this roomer/myth got started.

[Scorch]

As a gunsmith, I get all sorts of strange requests that are backed by something someone heard from someone else, but no one seems to remember where the original information came from. I have been asked to rechamber a Marlin 336 in 35 Rem to 358 before. If you do even a minimum of checking, you will find it just won't fly. I can do some really cool wildcat stuff, but often that is not what they want. I get people asking me to do questionable work, and I just tell them that they can do it that way if they want, but I cannot as I have my livelihood at stake.

But I am still learning, I suppose. For example, I still have not figured out how to rebore a 30-caliber barrel to 270. Every time I try, the hole gets bigger, not smaller. When I tell people that I cannot make the hole smaller without lining the barrel or rebarreling, they get upset with me because "they read it" somewhere. Go figure. I could go on and on, trust me.

[BoogieMan]

Scorch@ You need a metal adding wand, or just tell them the 30-06 is already chambered for 270. Fits fine, you get a nifty slot instead of a hole.

As to the 308 being more accurate than a 30-06. I just dont see how. Rumor probably started by someone who wanted to promote the 308. 30-06 has got to be the most versatile of all sub-mag cartridges available.

[Jerry45]

The smith that built my 308 even said that 308 was more accurate than 30-06. That was when I was having a brake installed on my 06. Before I had the 308 built. I said "I can't see how the length of a casing (308 being shorter) could make it more accurate." He sad it does. He offered no feather explanation and I was still of the belief it was so I just said OK.

What Scorch needs is reverse reamer. Place it in the hole turn backwards while removing and the hole gets smaller. You know it has to be true, you're reading on the internet. You can't put anythng on the internet that isn't true.

[jackpine]

358 win in a 336 marlin has been done but there were just one or two smiths out there doing the work and most smiths think is a bad idea (as do I). A better way to go would track down one of the levergun specialists that re work a new ish 336 in 35 rem into a 356 win. 356 was made for lever guns and will work better and even then your pushing hard on the safety margin with a standard frame, the factory 336 marlins in 356 look the same but they are not.

[Gunplummer]

And the rumor continues.

[James K]

Someone once proposed (and may even have patented) a barrel made like a twist of paper. Using a special wrench, the barrel could be closed or opened to vary the caliber. I could not find any information on testing, so perhaps the first shot showed some small defect in the design. Or maybe the inventor didn't survive.

Jim

[triggerman770]

my favorite is when they ask for a gunsmiths opinion in person or on one of these boards, the gunsmith gives it and they say " well my friend who knows about guns says...". I tell them " take it to your friend and let him do it for you"

[wyop]

The .308 is, under certain conditions, slightly more accurate than the .30-06.

Emphasize the word "slightly:"

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...-surprise-you/

The reason why could be the .308's case presents a more "square" powder stack. This development has been mirrored to more extreme extents in the 6mm and 6.5mm accuracy rounds for some years.

[oldscot3]

Nosler's reloading manual, in the foreward for the 308 section, describes the 308 Win as "an inherently accurate cartridge". That's not the first and only place I've seen that kind of language used by folks that have shot a lot of bullets downrange; might be something there.

Now that that's said, most of us here know, the rifles that fire any round, are each unique. No two are ever identical, no matter how much alike they may be. There are 30-06s that may be more accurate than a similar rifle in 308 and vice versa.

I read the article linked to the previous post, and it was interesting, but I'm still not convinced that the subject rifles are so identical that only the cartridge chambering is the difference.

Given all the variables, it seems unwise to issue any blanket statement implying always or never with regard to cartridge accuracy.

[Boomer58cal]

I've been told for years by early Vietnam vets that they lost several hundred yards in lethal range when they switched from 30-06 to .308. They said anyway.

[James K]

I have heard or read about many cartridges that are considered "inherently accurate." I have never heard of one that was called "inherently inaccurate".

So I still don't know what the term means.

I think the best (or worst) rumor was the one several years ago that primers were going to be banned, or that the government was going to order makers to add something that would make them inert in a short time. So everyone ran out and bought up all the primers they could find. Neither rumor was true, but the panic created a serious shortage, so of course the shortage just proved the rumor that the government was destroying primers by the hundreds of tons, which created another panic, which.... You get the picture.

Not specific to guns or ammo, but no one who lived through it will likely forget the Y2K panic. Computers were going to crash, planes fall from the sky, the world burst into flame, etc., etc. The less solidly grounded among us dug shelters, bought tons of MREs (some still have them), stocked up on rifles and ammo, etc., etc. Well, due in part to some sensible preparation, midnight on 31 Dec 1999 came and went and the world (surprise!) didn't end. Some folks crawled out of their bunkers feeling a bit foolish, though.

At the time I was working on a government system that used some rather antique computers. I told one alarmist that our date was in binary in a 32 bit word, and I wasn't worried about Y2K. I did go on record as having concerns about Y4B as we would run out of space at the end of December in the year 4294967295, and I thought we should do some planning ASAP. He, like Queen Victoria, was not amused.

Jim

[1911Tuner]

The general consensus that the .308 (sometimes) holds an accuracy edge over the old standby '06 has a small root in fact, and the explanation is simple.

Most handloaders have come to realize that best accuracy is usually accompanied by the highest loading density and less air space in the case.

Higher loading densities usually...but not always...produce more consistent velocities. Consistent velocities usually...but not always...translate to better accuracy.

With commercially loaded ammunition, there is a higher loading density in the .308 cartridge, thus a little better accuracy.

Handloaders who tailor the .30-06 loads to the rifles generally find their best accuracy with slower powders and the higher loading densities that come with them...and the accuracy edge held by the .308 disappears.