You would have loved it

kx592 · December 10, 2009, 01:49 PM

Im currently a student at the local community college as a Law Enforcement major. Im talkin an intro course and the director of the police academy is my professor so we get all the info we want. We watched every from intro movies to actual investigation evidence film from previous cases. Last night we got to use a new 100,000$ judgment simulation. Your given a situation like domestic violence and your given a standard sig P220 with no mag and a lazer setup inside to indicate your shots and on a wall there is a screen that is 250'' wide so you really feel like your in it. The operator of the computer system changes the situation with a click of the mouse and can make the situation require deadly force or just a routine traffic stop and nothing happens. Awesome experience, really gives you a personal understanding of how you will react to a threatening situation and how you can justify pulling the trigger every single time. Just figured you guys would get a kick out of it and if you hear of any sort of training involving this type of machine take the opportunity.

Sefner · December 10, 2009, 11:29 PM

Can you give us more info on how this works? It sounds awesome... like what is the machine/program called? And how does the operator change the situation???

Slopemeno · December 10, 2009, 11:35 PM

Is this the FATS system?

Schneiderman · December 10, 2009, 11:40 PM

I got to use something similar with the ISMT system at Camp Lejeune (as a NJROTC cadet when I was in highschool). It was for MP training, it used an M9 hooked up to an air compressor to simulate recoil. It presented those shoot or no shoot scenarios... I was very proud of myself when I carried out a successful mozambique drill on a woman before she could get the pistol out of her purse

We also got to shoot all kinds of other things but in combat scenarios, not shoot-or-no-shoot. Mk. 19, M2, M240B, M249... Lots of fun, if I had an ISMT I'd never get anything else done!

Also one day I went back to my HS to visit my NJROTC instructors and there was an army recruiter there with a setup similar to what you describe but with an M4. He was really just there to give the cadets a good time. He had been a designated marksman, and I had been on the njrotc rifle team so I challenged him to a match and he loaded up a scenario where you just shoot for score at 50, 100 and 150 yards. I beat him by 1 point

kx592 · December 11, 2009, 08:59 AM

Yea as the last poster stated, there are different guns, they have M4's for the NJ swat team to use through the scenario and also have weapons that have live recoil and such..All it is is a huge projector screen with a computer hooked up to a weapon on the side of the screen with the operator (human in a chair telling the copputer what to do) who can use sights on the gun and shoot back and such if you wait to long...operator of the computer clicks on different branches for the situation to change...it really is designed to confuse you and see how you react and eventually react appropriately every time

firespectrum · December 11, 2009, 10:21 AM

The army has something similar called the Electronic Skills Trainer (EST). Sounds like it's exactly the same as the others from reading other posts. It's great that you can simulate many different kinds of scenarios and have weapon familiarzation without the cost and prep involved in going to a range or a field training exercize.

Unfortunately, there's talk of using in lieu of a real qualification range. This type of training is great but it cannot take the place of "real" training exercizes. As long as it is a supplement for other training, and not a replacement it's fine. I'm usually in support type units and I've noticed that some commanders like to go to the EST range to check the block instead of doing moving-and-shooting type exercizes. That's my only issue with it.

Ticman · December 11, 2009, 10:26 AM

This would be a great tool if it could be set up for CC scenarios. I would sign up in a heart beat for that. Heck, "as is" it would be great if people with CWP's could take the class.

MTT TL · December 11, 2009, 11:14 PM

The Army has been using these for a while. Saves a fortune in training dollars.

Glenn Dee · December 12, 2009, 10:05 AM

It sounts like some version of FATS. There is a local range in Pompano beach Fl. who are supposedly getting one for use by the public.

armoredman · December 12, 2009, 10:49 AM

Used FATS with Armored Transport for years, good system, but limited. I liked it.

December 10, 2009, 01:49 PM	#1
kx592 Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2009 Posts: 645	You would have loved it Im currently a student at the local community college as a Law Enforcement major. Im talkin an intro course and the director of the police academy is my professor so we get all the info we want. We watched every from intro movies to actual investigation evidence film from previous cases. Last night we got to use a new 100,000$ judgment simulation. Your given a situation like domestic violence and your given a standard sig P220 with no mag and a lazer setup inside to indicate your shots and on a wall there is a screen that is 250'' wide so you really feel like your in it. The operator of the computer system changes the situation with a click of the mouse and can make the situation require deadly force or just a routine traffic stop and nothing happens. Awesome experience, really gives you a personal understanding of how you will react to a threatening situation and how you can justify pulling the trigger every single time. Just figured you guys would get a kick out of it and if you hear of any sort of training involving this type of machine take the opportunity.

December 11, 2009, 11:14 PM	#8
MTT TL Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 2009 Location: Quadling Country Posts: 2,780	The Army has been using these for a while. Saves a fortune in training dollars. __________________ Thus a man should endeavor to reach this high place of courage with all his heart, and, so trying, never be backward in war.

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December 10, 2009, 11:29 PM	#2
Sefner Senior Member Join Date: June 24, 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 769	Can you give us more info on how this works? It sounds awesome... like what is the machine/program called? And how does the operator change the situation???

December 10, 2009, 11:35 PM	#3
Slopemeno Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2007 Posts: 2,663	Is this the FATS system?

December 10, 2009, 11:40 PM	#4
Schneiderman Member Join Date: November 3, 2009 Posts: 41	I got to use something similar with the ISMT system at Camp Lejeune (as a NJROTC cadet when I was in highschool). It was for MP training, it used an M9 hooked up to an air compressor to simulate recoil. It presented those shoot or no shoot scenarios... I was very proud of myself when I carried out a successful mozambique drill on a woman before she could get the pistol out of her purse We also got to shoot all kinds of other things but in combat scenarios, not shoot-or-no-shoot. Mk. 19, M2, M240B, M249... Lots of fun, if I had an ISMT I'd never get anything else done! Also one day I went back to my HS to visit my NJROTC instructors and there was an army recruiter there with a setup similar to what you describe but with an M4. He was really just there to give the cadets a good time. He had been a designated marksman, and I had been on the njrotc rifle team so I challenged him to a match and he loaded up a scenario where you just shoot for score at 50, 100 and 150 yards. I beat him by 1 point

December 11, 2009, 08:59 AM	#5
kx592 Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2009 Posts: 645	Yea as the last poster stated, there are different guns, they have M4's for the NJ swat team to use through the scenario and also have weapons that have live recoil and such..All it is is a huge projector screen with a computer hooked up to a weapon on the side of the screen with the operator (human in a chair telling the copputer what to do) who can use sights on the gun and shoot back and such if you wait to long...operator of the computer clicks on different branches for the situation to change...it really is designed to confuse you and see how you react and eventually react appropriately every time

December 11, 2009, 10:21 AM	#6
firespectrum Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2009 Posts: 112	The army has something similar called the Electronic Skills Trainer (EST). Sounds like it's exactly the same as the others from reading other posts. It's great that you can simulate many different kinds of scenarios and have weapon familiarzation without the cost and prep involved in going to a range or a field training exercize. Unfortunately, there's talk of using in lieu of a real qualification range. This type of training is great but it cannot take the place of "real" training exercizes. As long as it is a supplement for other training, and not a replacement it's fine. I'm usually in support type units and I've noticed that some commanders like to go to the EST range to check the block instead of doing moving-and-shooting type exercizes. That's my only issue with it.

December 11, 2009, 10:26 AM	#7
Ticman Member Join Date: February 25, 2009 Posts: 81	This would be a great tool if it could be set up for CC scenarios. I would sign up in a heart beat for that. Heck, "as is" it would be great if people with CWP's could take the class.

December 12, 2009, 10:05 AM	#9
Glenn Dee Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2009 Location: South Florida Posts: 1,560	It sounts like some version of FATS. There is a local range in Pompano beach Fl. who are supposedly getting one for use by the public.

December 12, 2009, 10:49 AM	#10
armoredman Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2007 Location: Arizona Posts: 5,297	Used FATS with Armored Transport for years, good system, but limited. I liked it.