Legality of Buying a Short AR Barrel...

[bennnn]

Legality of Buying a Short AR Barrel...

It's still just a piece of metal,, right?

But I have to buy the Tax Stamp to be able to put it on a receiver,, but I have to have the barrel,, and the receiver,,,...

Which comes first, the chicken or the egg?

[applesanity]

before going through all the motions, why?

short barrel for rifle rounds = weak.

[Al Norris]

Applesanity? Ever do any MOUT training? SBR have a definite purpose and mission.

Bennnn, this question is best answered by the "experts" over in the NFA Guns and Gear forum. Headed there now...

[applesanity]

SBR have a definite purpose and mission.

yes yes i know. but is it really necessary to go shorter than an M4 barrel? At which point, I might look into a bullpup style rifle or a pistol-caliber weapon.

[raymond-]

mmm, i believe M4 is 14.5" so the SBR route would allow one to go below 16" here in the US. a great compromise between super short and Title 1 'legal.'

[VUPDblue]

Legally, you have to have the tax stamp before you purchase the parts *if you have another non SBR lower that is capable of hosting those parts*. Now, the ATF isn't going to come and kick-in your door because you have a short barrel laying around. My best advice is that if you have already sent in your Form 1 to build the SBR, you are most likely OK to start accumulating parts. Just to be on the safe side, don't assemble them until you get your forms back. Mine only took about 4 weeks mailbox to mailbox, so you aren't looking at an eternity of having those parts staring back at you begging to be made into a nice little rifle.
As for Applesanity's 'why' question, keep this in mind: civillian legal M4gerys have to have the 16" minimum barrel length to avoid being SBR's. Military issue actual M4's have 14" barrels. This would make them SBR's here in the states. If one wanted an authentic M4 reproduction, he would have to SBR his rifle to be legal with the 14" barrel. You'd be surprised at the ballistics from just a slightly shorter barrel. They aren't all that different from 16 inchers. Now when you start going 10" and shorter, you start running into difficulties.

[bennnn]

Military issue actual M4's have 14" barrels.

Thanks a lot VUPDblue,, I'm going to try an 11.5/5.5" first.

16" of legal barrel...

but is it really necessary to go shorter than an M4 barrel?

yeah, once I get the tax stamp,,...

[ffxmike]

so, I figure this is probably the best thread to ask this question. If you're supposed to have the tax stamp before you buy the barrel, how does it work if I build an AR 15 pistol?

How do I buy a short upper for my AR pistol without a tax stamp, since a tax stamp wouldn't be needed (because it's a pistol, not a Short Barrel Rifle)

I'm hoping I've explained this properly, but I'm pretty tired right now, so if it's confusing let me know, and i'll try to explain what I meant.

I read the thread, but it's totally possible I still missed it.

[VUPDblue]

If you've got a pistol lower, your cool to have as many short uppers as you want. Now, if you don't have a pistol lower, and you DO have some regular rifle lowers around, you are *technically* in violation by having short uppers that could mate to those rifle lowers.

[raymond-]

if you have a pistoled lower, you can have as many uppers as you want.....

....except if you have a Title 1 lower which is a rifle. in this instance, you can
only have one short bbl upper to match the pistol, and not any more. (accord-
ing to my notes)

[VUPDblue]

I read a case a short time back where it was ruled that as long as there was either a pistol lower or a SBR lower present, the number of short uppers was irrelevant, even if there were other standard rifle receivers present. Now if you have short uppers and only standard lowers, you might find yourself in hot water.

[bennnn]

Thanks,, cause the only hot water I like is in the shower..........

[raymond-]

I read a case a short time back where it was ruled that as long as there was either a pistol lower or a SBR lower present, the number of short uppers was irrelevant, even if there were other standard rifle receivers present. Now if you have short uppers and only standard lowers, you might find yourself in hot water.

are you referring to US v Thompson/Center Arms back in 91? if it's another,
can you provide cite? thx! r-

[VUPDblue]

No, it wasn't the T/C case. I'll look and see if I can find it again.

[Hkmp5sd]

I read a case a short time back where it was ruled that as long as there was either a pistol lower or a SBR lower present, the number of short uppers was irrelevant, even if there were other standard rifle receivers present. Now if you have short uppers and only standard lowers, you might find yourself in hot water.

Not quite. I have a M16A1 and AR-15 and ATF allows me only one short barreled upper for my machinegun. Same would apply to a pistol lower and AR-15s.

DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY
BUREAU OF ALCOHOL, TOBACCO AND FIREARMS
WASHINGTON, DC 20226

MAR 25 1999 903050:CHB
3311


Dear Mr. :

This refers to your letter in which you asked about possession of
spare M-16 machinegun parts by a person who possesses a registered
M-16 and a semiautomatic AR-15 rifle..
.
.
.
4. Can you have several short barrel uppers (less than 16 inches)
for the registered AR and still own semi-auto AR's?

The definition of a firearm in section 5845 of the NFA includes a
rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length.
An individual possessing more than one short (less than 16 inches)
barreled upper receiver for a registered AR15 machinegun along with
one or more semiautomatic AR15 rifles would have under their
possession of control an unregistered short barreled rifle, a
violation of the NFA.

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs/user/wb...f_letter90.txt

[VUPDblue]

Yes, I read that one too, but I know I saw a ruling to the contrary recently. I'll keep on looking...

[Hkmp5sd]

If they've changed their mind (again), I'd love to know. I want a couple more uppers for my M16. Thanks!