AR15 for HD...what condition?

chris in va · June 7, 2012, 09:39 PM

Reading a few posts on the subject has me thinking my AR would be a good HD gun.

So those 'in the know', what condition works best for the platform...

1). Mag inserted, empty chamber, bolt closed
2). Chambered, safety on
3). Empty chamber, bolt open
4). Other?

myshoulderissore · June 7, 2012, 09:50 PM

Same as I would keep any self defense weapon, ready to go, only needing safety off and trigger pulled. I vote 2 on your list.

MLeake · June 7, 2012, 10:49 PM

I'd go with one, personally.

If I have time to retrieve a rifle, I almost certainly have time to pull a charging handle.

Marquezj16 · June 7, 2012, 11:28 PM

My AR 15s are my third option for HD. Something terrible happened and my pistols and shotguns have not done the job. That said, I keep mine in the safe, mags out and bolts forward. It if becomes my primary, it would sit next to my bed in condition 2.

MLeake · June 7, 2012, 11:29 PM

Yeah, mine is normally in the safe, as well. Mags out but on the shelf next to it.

Wife prefers a shotgun for the bedroom long gun.

Water-Man · June 8, 2012, 12:05 AM

#1 works for me in my house.

swopjan · June 8, 2012, 03:14 AM

My personal preference, Condition 4 with a mag next to it. I would reach for a handgun if the bad guy was at the foot of my bed, if i need a rifle I've got the distance and time to load it and chamber a round and am probably under siege.

Bartholomew Roberts · June 8, 2012, 08:16 AM

I think it depends on how you intend to use it. Are you going to keep the AR close at hand where you can respond to a threat immediately? If not, then the extra time you spend charging the weapon is probably negligble compared to the time you spend going to get the weapon.

I think it makes a lot more sense to keep a pistol in condition one because it is easier to keep a pistol close-at-hand for a situation that requires the type of immediate response where you don't have time to charge the weapon.

mavracer · June 8, 2012, 11:29 AM

normaly bolt closed on an empty chamber, 1 loaded mag on shelf close by another in pouch on stock. Right next to the AR there's a cruizer ready 1897 Chinchester full of g00dness. However right now my AR is locked up waiting for a trip to the range to sight in the new EO-Tech and my M1 carbine is standing guard 1-15 round mag on shelf 2 more in stock pouch.

LockedBreech · June 9, 2012, 12:50 AM

Bolt closed, fired on a empty chamber, safety off, magazine inserted. Pull the charging handle and it's ready to rock.

dcobler · June 9, 2012, 01:51 AM

As a side note to the above posts, I think your personal circumstances dictate the answer better than anyone else's advice.

Are there children in the home? What kind of neighborhood do you live in? Do you live in apartments? What barriers are in between you and retrieving your weapon in a defensive situation?

I keep my primary home defense weapons with a round in the chamber. That's just me though.

What do you do with your firearm when you leave the house? Leave it the same way? Lock it up? Empty the chamber? Its just my personal opinion that your situation should dictate your answer.

As added food for thought, in the event of a fire, the rounds that are not chambered are not serious threats but a round that is chambered is a loaded gun in a ghost's hands. In a semi-auto this could result in a cook-off situation involving multiple random shots(in theory, not always the case). If you do keep a round loaded in a firearm that is not attended (put in a safe place but prepared for a defensive situation) be mindful of the muzzle direction and notify any emergency response personnel of this in the event of a fire.

sonick808 · June 9, 2012, 02:52 AM

ready to fire, safety on

WV_gunner · June 9, 2012, 08:35 AM

I've considered this samething when I was deciding to use my AK for home defense. I was going to leave a loaded magazine in it with an empty chamber. But the gun is just too loud to even consider shooting without earmuffs.

Stevie-Ray · June 10, 2012, 02:01 PM

Quote:

I'd go with one, personally.

If I have time to retrieve a rifle, I almost certainly have time to pull a charging handle.

That's me as well, so far.

Superhouse 15 · June 10, 2012, 05:32 PM

I plan to count on the sound of the charging handle and bolt racking to scare the bad guys away, just like my pump shotgun.....

ok, seriously, mine is a secondary weapon. Mag in, bolt forward, spare mag on the stock. I have 55gr JSP in it, 55gr FMJ in the mag. Outside I use 64gr JSP and M855 in the spare.

ClydeFrog · June 11, 2012, 11:44 AM

If I owned a M4 or AR type rifle for home protection, I'd have it; "cruiser ready": empty chamber, safety(ambi) on, 10/15 round rifle mag(PMAG or the cool type that shows the remaining magazine rounds: red/yellow/green

).
Unless I expected armed threats or death threats, a limited AR magazine would be okay. I might keep a loaded Cmag or Beta rifle magazine close by,

.

Unlike Hollywood, you are HIGHLY unlikely going to get into a major shootout. 2/3 rounds may be expended total in a home protection event.

Clyde

Skadoosh · June 11, 2012, 12:56 PM

AR's kept in Weapon Condition 4 with loaded mags nearby.

Grant D · June 11, 2012, 01:38 PM

If I was going to use my Mini 30 or AK, they would be chambered with the safety on.
My guns are locked up during the day,but when I'm home I have pistols and shotguns at the ready.

Dwight55 · June 11, 2012, 07:52 PM

It is my second line of firearm defense.

Mag in, chamber loaded, safety on, standing next to my night stand if my wife is at home.

If she is away for any reason, . . . it is laying on my bed, . . . in her spot.

May God bless,
Dwight

ltc444 · June 13, 2012, 11:17 PM

My home defense is different than most. I live in an isolated/remote location in eastern AZ.

My primary threat is varmints (coyotes or cougars) going after my livestock.

I keep my AR in my cabinet chamber empty firing pin down with a ten round mag inserted. (Can't close the door with a 20 or 30 round mag inserted) I have a jump coat with three 30 round mags and a flash light.

In the house I allways have a 1911 close at hand.

ScotchMan · June 15, 2012, 02:29 PM

Do ARs have drop safeties? My understanding is that they do NOT. Meaning if a round is chambered, the trigger is forward, and you drop the gun in the right way, the firing pin can strike the primer and the gun can fire.

If that is the case, I would store it in #1. Agree that there will be time to chamber a round if you can get to an AR. My shotgun is stored the same way, full tube, empty chamber, safety off. A handgun is the only weapon I'd be comfortable storing with a loaded chamber, and only if it had a firing pin block (most do).

Edit:
I believe I was wrong and ARs do have drop safeties.

RedBowTies88 · June 15, 2012, 02:58 PM

I store my ak with a full mag and bolt closed on an empty chamber. I've practiced racking it as I pick it up

Maximus856 · June 16, 2012, 03:08 AM

[iquote]As added food for thought, in the event of a fire, the rounds that are not chambered are not serious threats but a round that is chambered is a loaded gun in a ghost's hands. In a semi-auto this could result in a cook-off situation involving multiple random shots(in theory, not always the case). If you do keep a round loaded in a firearm that is not attended (put in a safe place but prepared for a defensive situation) be mindful of the muzzle direction and notify any emergency response personnel of this in the event of a fire.[/quote]

My last mission in Afghanistan included an MRAP being hit by an IED and catching fire. All of the guys crawled out (flipped over), and there weapons had to be left inside. Given the theatre, they were all condition one. The two LAWs going off was scary, the mk19 cooking off grenades was a bit more scary, but for me I was really worried about the m16's cooking off. And sure enough they did. Fortunately, by the time the helo landed most of them were cooked off, so after getting the guys to the CCP we just kind of took cover from our own weapons

Anyway, thats a bit out there compared to AR's in the home. It is still a threat, and muzzle orientation is important. If I kept my rifle condition one in the basement or first floor, I would make sure it's facing down. Opposite if it's located in the 2d story of the house. I also maintain this practice while carrying a loaded weapon in the house. What the probability of something happening is, I don't know. However, there is no such thing as being too safe. Personally, I keep my AR condition 3 (mag inserted, bolt forward, no round in the chamber.) while in the house.

rburch · July 3, 2012, 09:42 PM

My 15 is only half built, but my AR-180b might as well be the same gun for this discussion.

I keep it in my gun cabinet with a fully loaded 20rd Pmag, (Hard to shut door with a 30) bolt locked back safety off.

ChileVerde1 · July 3, 2012, 10:39 PM

Your condition 1 is what was taught to me and what I teach as "Hot Stand-by." This is how we carry our M4's when deployed in vehicles, etc... Other circumsatnces may dictate"locked and loaded." Hot stan-by is safest and most efficient for HD. I would never recommend a loaded chamber with the weapon on safe for fear of AD if dropped, bumped, etc... Just my two cents!

June 9, 2012, 12:50 AM	#10
LockedBreech Senior Member Join Date: July 6, 2009 Location: Rocky Mountain West Posts: 3,395	Bolt closed, fired on a empty chamber, safety off, magazine inserted. Pull the charging handle and it's ready to rock. __________________ 16 Pistols, 5 Rifles, 1 Shotgun, no time to shoot them

June 9, 2012, 01:51 AM	#11
dcobler Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2008 Location: Oklahoma, America Posts: 286	As a side note to the above posts, I think your personal circumstances dictate the answer better than anyone else's advice. Are there children in the home? What kind of neighborhood do you live in? Do you live in apartments? What barriers are in between you and retrieving your weapon in a defensive situation? I keep my primary home defense weapons with a round in the chamber. That's just me though. What do you do with your firearm when you leave the house? Leave it the same way? Lock it up? Empty the chamber? Its just my personal opinion that your situation should dictate your answer. As added food for thought, in the event of a fire, the rounds that are not chambered are not serious threats but a round that is chambered is a loaded gun in a ghost's hands. In a semi-auto this could result in a cook-off situation involving multiple random shots(in theory, not always the case). If you do keep a round loaded in a firearm that is not attended (put in a safe place but prepared for a defensive situation) be mindful of the muzzle direction and notify any emergency response personnel of this in the event of a fire. __________________ "Be kind, be courteous, and have a plan to kill everybody you meet."

June 11, 2012, 11:44 AM	#16
ClydeFrog Junior member Join Date: May 1, 2010 Posts: 5,797	"cruiser ready"... If I owned a M4 or AR type rifle for home protection, I'd have it; "cruiser ready": empty chamber, safety(ambi) on, 10/15 round rifle mag(PMAG or the cool type that shows the remaining magazine rounds: red/yellow/green ). Unless I expected armed threats or death threats, a limited AR magazine would be okay. I might keep a loaded Cmag or Beta rifle magazine close by, . Unlike Hollywood, you are HIGHLY unlikely going to get into a major shootout. 2/3 rounds may be expended total in a home protection event. Clyde

June 11, 2012, 12:56 PM	#17
Skadoosh Senior Member Join Date: December 13, 2010 Location: Virginia Beach Posts: 2,016	AR's kept in Weapon Condition 4 with loaded mags nearby. __________________ NRA Life Member USN Retired

June 11, 2012, 07:52 PM	#19
Dwight55 Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2004 Location: Central Ohio Posts: 2,568	It is my second line of firearm defense. Mag in, chamber loaded, safety on, standing next to my night stand if my wife is at home. If she is away for any reason, . . . it is laying on my bed, . . . in her spot. May God bless, Dwight __________________ www.dwightsgunleather.com If you can breathe, . . . thank God! If you can read, . . . thank a teacher! If you are reading this in English, . . . thank a Veteran!

June 7, 2012, 09:39 PM	#1
chris in va Senior Member Join Date: December 26, 2004 Location: Louisville KY Posts: 13,806	AR15 for HD...what condition? Reading a few posts on the subject has me thinking my AR would be a good HD gun. So those 'in the know', what condition works best for the platform... 1). Mag inserted, empty chamber, bolt closed 2). Chambered, safety on 3). Empty chamber, bolt open 4). Other?

June 7, 2012, 09:50 PM	#2
myshoulderissore Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2010 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 447	Same as I would keep any self defense weapon, ready to go, only needing safety off and trigger pulled. I vote 2 on your list.

June 7, 2012, 10:49 PM	#3
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	I'd go with one, personally. If I have time to retrieve a rifle, I almost certainly have time to pull a charging handle.

June 7, 2012, 11:28 PM	#4
Marquezj16 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2011 Posts: 2,088	My AR 15s are my third option for HD. Something terrible happened and my pistols and shotguns have not done the job. That said, I keep mine in the safe, mags out and bolts forward. It if becomes my primary, it would sit next to my bed in condition 2.

June 7, 2012, 11:29 PM	#5
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	Yeah, mine is normally in the safe, as well. Mags out but on the shelf next to it. Wife prefers a shotgun for the bedroom long gun.

June 8, 2012, 12:05 AM	#6
Water-Man Senior Member Join Date: March 23, 2008 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 2,126	#1 works for me in my house.

June 8, 2012, 03:14 AM	#7
swopjan Senior Member Join Date: August 12, 2011 Posts: 156	My personal preference, Condition 4 with a mag next to it. I would reach for a handgun if the bad guy was at the foot of my bed, if i need a rifle I've got the distance and time to load it and chamber a round and am probably under siege.

June 8, 2012, 08:16 AM	#8
Bartholomew Roberts member Join Date: June 12, 2000 Location: Texas and Oklahoma area Posts: 8,462	I think it depends on how you intend to use it. Are you going to keep the AR close at hand where you can respond to a threat immediately? If not, then the extra time you spend charging the weapon is probably negligble compared to the time you spend going to get the weapon. I think it makes a lot more sense to keep a pistol in condition one because it is easier to keep a pistol close-at-hand for a situation that requires the type of immediate response where you don't have time to charge the weapon.

June 9, 2012, 02:52 AM	#12
sonick808 Senior Member Join Date: November 19, 2009 Location: Chandler, AZ Posts: 396	ready to fire, safety on

June 9, 2012, 08:35 AM	#13
WV_gunner Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2011 Location: WV Posts: 938	I've considered this samething when I was deciding to use my AK for home defense. I was going to leave a loaded magazine in it with an empty chamber. But the gun is just too loud to even consider shooting without earmuffs.

June 10, 2012, 05:32 PM	#15
Superhouse 15 Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2007 Location: Sunny Florida Posts: 844	I plan to count on the sound of the charging handle and bolt racking to scare the bad guys away, just like my pump shotgun..... ok, seriously, mine is a secondary weapon. Mag in, bolt forward, spare mag on the stock. I have 55gr JSP in it, 55gr FMJ in the mag. Outside I use 64gr JSP and M855 in the spare.

June 11, 2012, 01:38 PM	#18
Grant D Senior Member Join Date: August 14, 2011 Location: Brazos County, Texas Posts: 1,038	If I was going to use my Mini 30 or AK, they would be chambered with the safety on. My guns are locked up during the day,but when I'm home I have pistols and shotguns at the ready.

June 13, 2012, 11:17 PM	#20
ltc444 Senior Member Join Date: March 3, 2011 Location: Vernon AZ Posts: 1,195	My home defense is different than most. I live in an isolated/remote location in eastern AZ. My primary threat is varmints (coyotes or cougars) going after my livestock. I keep my AR in my cabinet chamber empty firing pin down with a ten round mag inserted. (Can't close the door with a 20 or 30 round mag inserted) I have a jump coat with three 30 round mags and a flash light. In the house I allways have a 1911 close at hand.

June 15, 2012, 02:29 PM	#21
ScotchMan Senior Member Join Date: July 3, 2011 Posts: 1,368	Do ARs have drop safeties? My understanding is that they do NOT. Meaning if a round is chambered, the trigger is forward, and you drop the gun in the right way, the firing pin can strike the primer and the gun can fire. If that is the case, I would store it in #1. Agree that there will be time to chamber a round if you can get to an AR. My shotgun is stored the same way, full tube, empty chamber, safety off. A handgun is the only weapon I'd be comfortable storing with a loaded chamber, and only if it had a firing pin block (most do). Edit: I believe I was wrong and ARs do have drop safeties. __________________ Everyday Loadout NRA Instructor NRA Member Last edited by ScotchMan; June 19, 2012 at 02:18 PM.

June 15, 2012, 02:58 PM	#22
RedBowTies88 Senior Member Join Date: October 18, 2011 Location: 609 NJ Posts: 705	I store my ak with a full mag and bolt closed on an empty chamber. I've practiced racking it as I pick it up

June 16, 2012, 03:08 AM	#23
Maximus856 Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Location: PA Posts: 547	[iquote]As added food for thought, in the event of a fire, the rounds that are not chambered are not serious threats but a round that is chambered is a loaded gun in a ghost's hands. In a semi-auto this could result in a cook-off situation involving multiple random shots(in theory, not always the case). If you do keep a round loaded in a firearm that is not attended (put in a safe place but prepared for a defensive situation) be mindful of the muzzle direction and notify any emergency response personnel of this in the event of a fire.[/quote] My last mission in Afghanistan included an MRAP being hit by an IED and catching fire. All of the guys crawled out (flipped over), and there weapons had to be left inside. Given the theatre, they were all condition one. The two LAWs going off was scary, the mk19 cooking off grenades was a bit more scary, but for me I was really worried about the m16's cooking off. And sure enough they did. Fortunately, by the time the helo landed most of them were cooked off, so after getting the guys to the CCP we just kind of took cover from our own weapons Anyway, thats a bit out there compared to AR's in the home. It is still a threat, and muzzle orientation is important. If I kept my rifle condition one in the basement or first floor, I would make sure it's facing down. Opposite if it's located in the 2d story of the house. I also maintain this practice while carrying a loaded weapon in the house. What the probability of something happening is, I don't know. However, there is no such thing as being too safe. Personally, I keep my AR condition 3 (mag inserted, bolt forward, no round in the chamber.) while in the house. __________________ "In 1968 for my senior field trip I was sent to RVN" -Hunter Customs "It is far more important to be able to hit the target than it is to haggle over who makes a weapon or who pulls a trigger." -Dwight D. Eisenhower

July 3, 2012, 09:42 PM	#24
rburch Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2007 Location: Blacksburg VA Posts: 750	My 15 is only half built, but my AR-180b might as well be the same gun for this discussion. I keep it in my gun cabinet with a fully loaded 20rd Pmag, (Hard to shut door with a 30) bolt locked back safety off. __________________ I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.

July 3, 2012, 10:39 PM	#25
ChileVerde1 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2006 Posts: 101	"Hot Stand-by" Your condition 1 is what was taught to me and what I teach as "Hot Stand-by." This is how we carry our M4's when deployed in vehicles, etc... Other circumsatnces may dictate"locked and loaded." Hot stan-by is safest and most efficient for HD. I would never recommend a loaded chamber with the weapon on safe for fear of AD if dropped, bumped, etc... Just my two cents!

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