870 Express Shurshot Turkey Shooting High

Marquezj16 · October 23, 2011, 02:19 PM

So I beat my shoulder up today. I started out with a box of Rem Target Club followed up with a box of Rem Turkey Load, Winchester 00 Buckshot and finally Winchester Rifled Slugs.

Barrel is Remington 870 12 Gauge 3" 21" Rem Choke with Extra Full Turkey Choke Tube Vent Rib Matte Black.

Distance to target is 10, 20 and 30 yards. At 40, I'm outside of the berm lane and pistol shooters to the right would not be happy with a shotgun going off 10 yards behind them, so I did not go back farther than 30 yards.

I aim with the bead directly over the turkey target from Rem website (red circle on turkey head. This resulted in hits above the target. I wish I would have taken pictures. I then put the bead under the target which resulted in some pellets hitting the red circle and then I put the bead about 4 inches low of the red circle and that's how I was able to get on target. This was consistent with all four loads and the farther away I was from the target, the lower my aim to hit the red.

The grouping is great as I was repeatedly hitting the same area and pretty much destroyed the backer board. The slugs at 30 yards were pretty much touching.

However, I'd like to be able to put the bead on the target and be on. The idea of aiming low is putting me off a little.

How can I change this point of aim? I don't sink my cheek on the stock as much on a shotgun as I do my rifles so could that be my problem? Do you think it could be the turkey choke? Your information/advise would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

oregunner · October 23, 2011, 04:18 PM

I got a deal from Cabelas on a Shurshot stock and tried mounting it on one of my Remingtons. The comb is high, like a trap gun, so for a lot of people it will raise your rear vision, which will make you shoot high. You might try getting into the gun harder, and looking straight down the rib. I think this stock is also designed to be used with a scope, where you would need to keep your head up. You might try using a higher front sight, which would also help correct the issue. You might try another choke, but I don't think that is the problem. Mark

zippy13 · October 23, 2011, 08:08 PM

Elevated the front bead (and/or lower the rear sight).

Marquezj16 · October 23, 2011, 08:41 PM

I was thinking of maybe getting this.

Dave McC · October 24, 2011, 02:24 PM

Are you seeing ALL the rib when you shoot? Scrunch down harder on the comb with your cheek if so.

oneounceload · October 24, 2011, 02:34 PM

Just as Dave said - if you are seeing ANY rib, you will be shooting too high - either your head is not on the stock, or the gun does not fit you properly

Marquezj16 · October 24, 2011, 03:17 PM

I mount the same way I shoot my other shotguns (Beretta, Weatherby, and Rem 870) and I don't have the same problem. I'll look in the mirror and see if there's a difference.

TheKlawMan · October 25, 2011, 01:36 AM

I am confused as to how you can be mounting the sureshot the same as your 870's more traditional sloped stock. I am also wondering if that shurehot stock is designed to lift the eye up higher to see through a scope.

highvel · October 25, 2011, 08:00 AM

Maybe you are concentrating too much. Try starting from a low position swing the gun up and fire, after a couple of shots you will see how the gun fits.
Or, maybe after a few boots of heavy recoil you are scrunching up at pulling the trigger?
I have a Mossberg that shoots low when I need it in a hurry but shoots fine at the pattern board, the stock needs to have a little less drop and all should be good !

Marquezj16 · October 25, 2011, 08:02 AM

When I say mount, I mean how I shoulder, cheek rest and sight. Same pattern.

I did not get a chance to look last night to see if I can see any rib. I've never noticed them before.

hogdogs · October 25, 2011, 08:16 AM

With my guns and my cheek weld, at 30 yards with a full speed (power) load, I would have the tturkey head fully above my bead for a head shot. Bead would be on his little throat...

Brent

oneounceload · October 25, 2011, 08:43 AM

Quote:

When I say mount, I mean how I shoulder, cheek rest and sight. Same pattern.

Just because you do your part the same every time, doesn't mean the stocks are all shaped exactly the same to give you the same results

Doyle · October 25, 2011, 08:51 AM

Quote:

I aim with the bead directly over the turkey target

That's part of the problem. A shotgun bead should always be placed UNDER the desired point of impact. Dot the "i" with the bead.

Marquezj16 · October 25, 2011, 09:54 AM

Quote:

I aim with the bead directly over the turkey target from Rem website (red circle on turkey head. This resulted in hits above the target. I wish I would have taken pictures. I then put the bead under the target which resulted in some pellets hitting the red circle and then I put the bead about 4 inches low of the red circle and that's how I was able to get on target. This was consistent with all four loads and the farther away I was from the target, the lower my aim to hit the red.

Quote:

That's part of the problem. A shotgun bead should always be placed UNDER the desired point of impact. Dot the "i" with the bead.

Did that too and it was still shooting high. 4" below target was my aim at 20 yards and that resulted in being on target.

Marquezj16 · October 26, 2011, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Just because you do your part the same every time, doesn't mean the stocks are all shaped exactly the same to give you the same results

That's why I asked the question. I was making sure I was not doing something different. I may have to adjust the way I mount, higher on the shoulder and lower my cheek more on the stock.

Quote:

if you are seeing ANY rib, you will be shooting too high

I checked on whether I can see the rib last night and it's a negative. Just flat up to the bead.

Quote:

Try starting from a low position swing the gun up and fire, after a couple of shots you will see how the gun fits.

I'll give this a try next time.

Thanks

classicshotgunner · October 27, 2011, 12:00 AM

Some barrels with vent ribs have been known to shoot high from P.O.A. It could also have the barrel threaded at an angle causing the choke tubes to not go into the barrel completely straight. It has happened before and will happen again. Not saying that is definitely what is wrong with your shotgun but it's a possibility. If it were me I would try a taller front sight bead put in with blue locktite. That way it could be removed if it had to be. Another option is to put the barrel in an exhaust pipe bending machine and bump bend it a little at a time until it's P.O.I. is at the P.O.A. It can be done without any damage to the barrel. I have a good friend that owns a auto repair garage and he has an exhaust pipe bending machine that he lets me use. I've did a few before on a Ithaca model 37, a Remington model 870 Wingmaster, a Marlin model 55, and a Winchester model 370 single shot that had a 36 inch barrel on it that got bent after being dropped from the cab of a pick up truck (none were my shotguns). I wrapped them in 1 layer of electrical tape and bump bent them a little at a time, then tested them on the shotguns until they were right. You couldn't find a scratch on any of the barrels or even tell the barrels had ever been put in the bending machine. One other option is to contact Remington and have them trouble shoot your problem and fix it.

Marquezj16 · November 10, 2011, 10:05 AM

I went back to the range with the 21" turkey barrel with extra full chocke and the original 26" barrel with modified choke for my 870 Express.

And here are the results. I aim with the bead under the center of the target.

Turkey Barrel

Original Barrel

The turkey barrel groups higher than the original barrel. I just have to compensate when using that barrel.

zippy13 · November 10, 2011, 11:15 AM

Why not try the x-full choke in the 26-in barrel?

Marquezj16 · November 10, 2011, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Why not try the x-full choke in the 26-in barrel?

Funny, I was actually thinking of that for the next time I take it out to the range. And using a different choke on the 21" barrel as well just to check if it's the barrel or choke that's causing the higher grouping.

AZAK · November 10, 2011, 02:33 PM

I also have this exact same model.

I currently am running a Vortex Strikefire red/green dot on it, mounted with a Remington brand (really B-Square made) saddle mount. I really like this set up! So far, so good. I run slugs through from time to time, scope has held up great.

Part of the reason that I went to the Strikefire scope is that I didn't want to "dot the i" as was mentioned above, especially when shooting slugs, and now I can adjust exactly where I want to aim.

Marquezj16 · November 11, 2011, 08:23 AM

AZAK - I have the Vortex Strikefire mounted on one of my rifles however I would still need a mount. Been looking around my area and no one is selling one. I may have to order online or go to neighbor state (only an hour from Bass Pro Shop) to get one.

Doyle · November 11, 2011, 01:40 PM

You will sometimes get hold of a barrel that isn't perfectly straight. This may be your case here. If it is slightly bent, there are ways to straighten it but for a turkey gun I'd just compensate.

Marquezj16 · November 11, 2011, 06:18 PM

Doyle, that could be the case here. i'm gonna try one more thing and put a different choke on it to see if the POI changes. If the barrel is the reason why it's hitting high then I most likely get a red dot so I can use that to adjust my POA. Thanks.

oneounceload · November 11, 2011, 07:05 PM

Quote:

If the barrel is the reason why it's hitting high

Unless the barrel is bent, that is NOT the reason it is shooting high - it is the stock dimensions. There are adjustable combs and pads to allow a wide variety of adjustments to get the gun close to fitting you right

Doyle · November 11, 2011, 07:36 PM

Oneounceload, take a peek at the two pictures he posted. If both barrels were hitting high, I'd definately be looking at a ill fitting stock. However, it looks like the original barrel patterns to POA while the 21" barrel shoots high. That has got me leaning towards a bent barrel.

If it were a wing shooting or target barrel that was shooting high, I'd consider straightening. For a turkey shooter though, there is usually time for the shooter to compensate.

October 23, 2011, 02:19 PM	#1
Marquezj16 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2011 Posts: 2,088	870 Express Shurshot Turkey Shooting High So I beat my shoulder up today. I started out with a box of Rem Target Club followed up with a box of Rem Turkey Load, Winchester 00 Buckshot and finally Winchester Rifled Slugs. Barrel is Remington 870 12 Gauge 3" 21" Rem Choke with Extra Full Turkey Choke Tube Vent Rib Matte Black. Distance to target is 10, 20 and 30 yards. At 40, I'm outside of the berm lane and pistol shooters to the right would not be happy with a shotgun going off 10 yards behind them, so I did not go back farther than 30 yards. I aim with the bead directly over the turkey target from Rem website (red circle on turkey head. This resulted in hits above the target. I wish I would have taken pictures. I then put the bead under the target which resulted in some pellets hitting the red circle and then I put the bead about 4 inches low of the red circle and that's how I was able to get on target. This was consistent with all four loads and the farther away I was from the target, the lower my aim to hit the red. The grouping is great as I was repeatedly hitting the same area and pretty much destroyed the backer board. The slugs at 30 yards were pretty much touching. However, I'd like to be able to put the bead on the target and be on. The idea of aiming low is putting me off a little. How can I change this point of aim? I don't sink my cheek on the stock as much on a shotgun as I do my rifles so could that be my problem? Do you think it could be the turkey choke? Your information/advise would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

October 25, 2011, 08:00 AM	#9
highvel Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2010 Location: Powhatan VA Posts: 633	Maybe you are concentrating too much. Try starting from a low position swing the gun up and fire, after a couple of shots you will see how the gun fits. Or, maybe after a few boots of heavy recoil you are scrunching up at pulling the trigger? I have a Mossberg that shoots low when I need it in a hurry but shoots fine at the pattern board, the stock needs to have a little less drop and all should be good ! __________________ Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.--Mark Twain "I have opinions of my own 'strong opinions' but I don't always agree with them."--George Bush

November 10, 2011, 02:33 PM	#20
AZAK Senior Member Join Date: May 15, 2008 Location: the object towards which the action of the sea is directed Posts: 2,123	I also have this exact same model. I currently am running a Vortex Strikefire red/green dot on it, mounted with a Remington brand (really B-Square made) saddle mount. I really like this set up! So far, so good. I run slugs through from time to time, scope has held up great. Part of the reason that I went to the Strikefire scope is that I didn't want to "dot the i" as was mentioned above, especially when shooting slugs, and now I can adjust exactly where I want to aim. __________________ The lowest paid college major/degree in this country after graduation... Elementary Education. Now, go figure...

October 23, 2011, 04:18 PM	#2
oregunner Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2011 Location: Oregon, of course Posts: 136	I got a deal from Cabelas on a Shurshot stock and tried mounting it on one of my Remingtons. The comb is high, like a trap gun, so for a lot of people it will raise your rear vision, which will make you shoot high. You might try getting into the gun harder, and looking straight down the rib. I think this stock is also designed to be used with a scope, where you would need to keep your head up. You might try using a higher front sight, which would also help correct the issue. You might try another choke, but I don't think that is the problem. Mark

October 23, 2011, 08:08 PM	#3
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Elevated the front bead (and/or lower the rear sight).

October 24, 2011, 02:24 PM	#5
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Are you seeing ALL the rib when you shoot? Scrunch down harder on the comb with your cheek if so.

October 24, 2011, 02:34 PM	#6
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	Just as Dave said - if you are seeing ANY rib, you will be shooting too high - either your head is not on the stock, or the gun does not fit you properly

October 24, 2011, 03:17 PM	#7
Marquezj16 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2011 Posts: 2,088	I mount the same way I shoot my other shotguns (Beretta, Weatherby, and Rem 870) and I don't have the same problem. I'll look in the mirror and see if there's a difference.

October 25, 2011, 01:36 AM	#8
TheKlawMan Junior member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 2,149	I am confused as to how you can be mounting the sureshot the same as your 870's more traditional sloped stock. I am also wondering if that shurehot stock is designed to lift the eye up higher to see through a scope.

October 25, 2011, 08:02 AM	#10
Marquezj16 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2011 Posts: 2,088	When I say mount, I mean how I shoulder, cheek rest and sight. Same pattern. I did not get a chance to look last night to see if I can see any rib. I've never noticed them before.

October 25, 2011, 08:16 AM	#11
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	With my guns and my cheek weld, at 30 yards with a full speed (power) load, I would have the tturkey head fully above my bead for a head shot. Bead would be on his little throat... Brent

October 27, 2011, 12:00 AM	#16
classicshotgunner Member Join Date: October 25, 2011 Location: Booger Woods U.S.A. Posts: 38	Some barrels with vent ribs have been known to shoot high from P.O.A. It could also have the barrel threaded at an angle causing the choke tubes to not go into the barrel completely straight. It has happened before and will happen again. Not saying that is definitely what is wrong with your shotgun but it's a possibility. If it were me I would try a taller front sight bead put in with blue locktite. That way it could be removed if it had to be. Another option is to put the barrel in an exhaust pipe bending machine and bump bend it a little at a time until it's P.O.I. is at the P.O.A. It can be done without any damage to the barrel. I have a good friend that owns a auto repair garage and he has an exhaust pipe bending machine that he lets me use. I've did a few before on a Ithaca model 37, a Remington model 870 Wingmaster, a Marlin model 55, and a Winchester model 370 single shot that had a 36 inch barrel on it that got bent after being dropped from the cab of a pick up truck (none were my shotguns). I wrapped them in 1 layer of electrical tape and bump bent them a little at a time, then tested them on the shotguns until they were right. You couldn't find a scratch on any of the barrels or even tell the barrels had ever been put in the bending machine. One other option is to contact Remington and have them trouble shoot your problem and fix it.

November 10, 2011, 11:15 AM	#18
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Why not try the x-full choke in the 26-in barrel?

November 11, 2011, 08:23 AM	#21
Marquezj16 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2011 Posts: 2,088	AZAK - I have the Vortex Strikefire mounted on one of my rifles however I would still need a mount. Been looking around my area and no one is selling one. I may have to order online or go to neighbor state (only an hour from Bass Pro Shop) to get one.

November 11, 2011, 01:40 PM	#22
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	You will sometimes get hold of a barrel that isn't perfectly straight. This may be your case here. If it is slightly bent, there are ways to straighten it but for a turkey gun I'd just compensate.

November 11, 2011, 06:18 PM	#23
Marquezj16 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2011 Posts: 2,088	Doyle, that could be the case here. i'm gonna try one more thing and put a different choke on it to see if the POI changes. If the barrel is the reason why it's hitting high then I most likely get a red dot so I can use that to adjust my POA. Thanks.

November 11, 2011, 07:36 PM	#25
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	Oneounceload, take a peek at the two pictures he posted. If both barrels were hitting high, I'd definately be looking at a ill fitting stock. However, it looks like the original barrel patterns to POA while the 21" barrel shoots high. That has got me leaning towards a bent barrel. If it were a wing shooting or target barrel that was shooting high, I'd consider straightening. For a turkey shooter though, there is usually time for the shooter to compensate.