Wana school a youngun?

[HALL,AUSTIN]

I was hoping someone could teach me about semiautomatic shotguns. I dont know the 1st thing about gas vs inertia (recoil) driven systems or what is vetter. Which is easier to clean and maintain? Which is more reliable is snow, rain, dust, hot weather,what have you. Can someone please help me out here?

[Lee Lapin]

A quick and dirty...

Technically the earliest semiauto shotgun was a gas gun, the Clair sporting shotgun introduced in France in about 1895. The black powder of that era doomed it to unpopularity however.

Long recoil designs like the 'humpback' Browning Auto-5 and the Remington Model 11 are the 'old reliables,' and date back to 1903 when the first Browning came off the FN manufacturing line. The first Remington 11 was manufactured in 1905. Winchester had its own long recoil design, also known as the Model 1911, which was ... shall we say, constrained severely by Browning's patents. For instance, it had no bolt handle, and had to be initially operated by grasping a knurled section of the barrel and forcing it rearward. It was nicknamed 'The Widowmaker' in part as a result of this unfortunate method of operation.

Some people like the long recoil design better than anything else. In good condition and properly set up for the loads they're shooting, they are hard to beat for reliability, and they don't require a lot in the way of maintenance relatively speaking - just unworn reciprocating parts and springs and an owner who knows how to set them up and lubricate them properly.

Winchester's Model 50 was introduced in 1954 and was the first 'short recoil' operated semiauto. It featured the 'floating chamber' design of David Marshall "Carbine" Williams. The Model 50 was also a 'streamlined' receiver in the style that pump shotguns had shifted to several decades earlier, and it prompted others in the same style, including redesigned long recoil shotguns like the Remington Model 11-48.

Gas guns are much newer in the scheme of things, the first successful American gas operated shotgun was the High Standard Model 60, based on a Bob Hillberg design and introduced in 1954. Remington came along with the Model 878 in 1959 and the much better known Model 1100 in 1963.

The gas guns require a bit more cleaning and attention to keep running, but with modern designs takedown is simple and cleaning may be messy but is not that much of a chore.

The inertial designs came along later, around 1986 or so. The patent documents reference the earlier Williams floating chamber design, and the design is simple, relatively inexpensive to manufacture and easy to maintain in that it has fewer stressed parts. Like the long recoil guns, the inertial designs do require a solid 'base' to recoil against, or they may malfunction. Given a lighter bolt return spring, they might not feed troublesome ammunition as reliably as some other designs as well.

[Husqvarna]

Lee you are of by you nearly 80 years

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sj%C3%B6gren_shotgun

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XznhQ35AxCQ

[chadio]

Keep in mind I'm not an experienced trap shooter / hunter, nor have I shot a bunch of different shotguns...

Just bought a Beretta AL391 used for $630, synthetic stock.

Like:

- you can adjust the weight of the front end (swing characteristics)
- shim between buttstock and receiver allows adjustment of comb / cast
- different recoil pads for LOP adjustability
- utoob disassembly, clean, reassembly videos from Beretta Service mgr

(^makes gun ownership much easier)

- recoil is a 'love tap' ... like an AR15, no joke
- something about Italian Beretta - they take pride in the performance of their firearms
- first time shooting trap, I was busting clays and sporting a big grin

Dislike:

- being a gas gun, the cleaning regimen is a bit more involved
- doesn't look "classy" like a Beretta White Onyx o/u (gorgeous shotgun)
- in fact, it looks like a toy from Mal Wart

[SauerGrapes]

I have 3 semi autos, all of which I still own. Browning Auto-5, Remington 11-87 and a Beretta AL391 urika 2.

Easiest to clean, Browning Auto.
Lightest recoiling, Beretta 391
Most reliable, dead heat.

As far as adverse conditions operations, the Browning has been hunted hard and after 40+ years, it's still my go to gun if it's bad weather. {Although I rarely shoot in bad weather anymore}
If I'm going out to shoot 100+ rounds at clay targets, the gas guns are a joy to shoot.
If your going to buy a gas operated gun, go very light on oil. I generally only put oil on the bolt and a drop or two on the trigger group. Start slathering oil all over the internals on a gas gun and they are a mess to clean.

Like Lee said, if you know how to set up a long recoil semi auto like the Browning Auto-5, they are great guns IMO.