IMR 8208 XBR and the 45/70 with 405gr Rem

300magman · July 14, 2011, 06:35 PM

Does anyone have any loads using these components. I found one source online that listed

Brass - unknown make
Primer - standard
Powder - IMR 8208 XBR
Bullet - 405gr Remington
Min - 48.5gr
Max - 51gr

But I am unable to verify that this is actually safe data for a MARLIN 45/70 LEVER ACTION and I have plenty of these components so I would like to try it, IF anyone can verify that this (or something close to it) is a safe recipe.

PawPaw · July 14, 2011, 06:53 PM

Hodgdon doesn't list any lever action loads with IMR 8208 for a 400 grain jacketed bullet. They list two loads, one for the Sierra 300 grain HP and one for the Hornady 350 RN.

CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

Having used the standard caution, you might be able to extrapolate data from those loads, understanding what every handloader understands about pressure and bullet weight. For both of the listed loads, the table shows a compressed load, and the pressures are under the 40,000 usually listed for lever action rifles. They also show some trapdoor loads with that powder. You might want to start with the trapdoor loads and work up slowly and cautiously. The max trapdoor load with a 405 LRN bullet is listed at 1727 fps and 23,600 CUP, so that's a fairly low pressure load. From experience I can tell you that pushing a 405 grain bullet at that velocity is going to recoil. That rifle might kill on one end and wound on the other.

JACK308 · July 14, 2011, 07:53 PM

barnes said for a marlin 45/70 400 grain bullet imr 4198 40.00 min. 43.00 max

300magman · July 15, 2011, 08:08 AM

Thanks PawPaw, I hadn't thought to look in the "trapdoor" section of the manual. But it looks like the data I found online nearly duplicates the listed trap door load (which isn't compressed)
I don't think I would be too foolish to start out with a mid load for the trap door and work my way up a bit beyond "trap door" MAX in 0.5gr increases....would I?

As for recoil, it can be a little harsh, but that's the price of ownership with a 45/70. And I have found a fantastically fun little load to shoot with Trail Boss.
All my Trail Boss loads with the 45/70 come out Far Far under the listed velicities, infact at 90% case capacity, I am still Sub-Sonic! (with 405gr bullets)
Those are fun little loads, recoil is almost too slight to feel, and 100 yard trajectory is still pretty decent...and 405grs make so much more "effect" than a .22lr with you just want to plink away for an afternoon.

Al57 · July 18, 2011, 10:12 AM

300magnum, this is not the powder you mentioned, but I can tell you from many years of experience that your 405 gr Rem SP bullet on top of 32.0 grs. of IMR 4198 will give you true original BP velocities in your 45-70. From my 22" bbl, this recipe yields about 1350 FPS, is reasonably mild shooting, burns efficiently, is very accurate and has on numerous occasions proven to be a quick whitetail stopper.

July 14, 2011, 06:35 PM	#1
300magman Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2008 Posts: 714	IMR 8208 XBR and the 45/70 with 405gr Rem Does anyone have any loads using these components. I found one source online that listed Brass - unknown make Primer - standard Powder - IMR 8208 XBR Bullet - 405gr Remington Min - 48.5gr Max - 51gr But I am unable to verify that this is actually safe data for a MARLIN 45/70 LEVER ACTION and I have plenty of these components so I would like to try it, IF anyone can verify that this (or something close to it) is a safe recipe.

July 14, 2011, 06:53 PM	#2
PawPaw Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2010 Location: Central Louisiana Posts: 3,137	Hodgdon doesn't list any lever action loads with IMR 8208 for a 400 grain jacketed bullet. They list two loads, one for the Sierra 300 grain HP and one for the Hornady 350 RN. CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information. Having used the standard caution, you might be able to extrapolate data from those loads, understanding what every handloader understands about pressure and bullet weight. For both of the listed loads, the table shows a compressed load, and the pressures are under the 40,000 usually listed for lever action rifles. They also show some trapdoor loads with that powder. You might want to start with the trapdoor loads and work up slowly and cautiously. The max trapdoor load with a 405 LRN bullet is listed at 1727 fps and 23,600 CUP, so that's a fairly low pressure load. From experience I can tell you that pushing a 405 grain bullet at that velocity is going to recoil. That rifle might kill on one end and wound on the other. __________________ Dennis Dezendorf http://pawpawshouse.blogspot.com

July 14, 2011, 07:53 PM	#3
JACK308 Junior member Join Date: July 10, 2011 Posts: 377	barnes said for a marlin 45/70 400 grain bullet imr 4198 40.00 min. 43.00 max

July 15, 2011, 08:08 AM	#4
300magman Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2008 Posts: 714	Thanks PawPaw, I hadn't thought to look in the "trapdoor" section of the manual. But it looks like the data I found online nearly duplicates the listed trap door load (which isn't compressed) I don't think I would be too foolish to start out with a mid load for the trap door and work my way up a bit beyond "trap door" MAX in 0.5gr increases....would I? As for recoil, it can be a little harsh, but that's the price of ownership with a 45/70. And I have found a fantastically fun little load to shoot with Trail Boss. All my Trail Boss loads with the 45/70 come out Far Far under the listed velicities, infact at 90% case capacity, I am still Sub-Sonic! (with 405gr bullets) Those are fun little loads, recoil is almost too slight to feel, and 100 yard trajectory is still pretty decent...and 405grs make so much more "effect" than a .22lr with you just want to plink away for an afternoon.

July 18, 2011, 10:12 AM	#5
Al57 Member Join Date: December 5, 2006 Location: Nebraska Posts: 69	300magnum, this is not the powder you mentioned, but I can tell you from many years of experience that your 405 gr Rem SP bullet on top of 32.0 grs. of IMR 4198 will give you true original BP velocities in your 45-70. From my 22" bbl, this recipe yields about 1350 FPS, is reasonably mild shooting, burns efficiently, is very accurate and has on numerous occasions proven to be a quick whitetail stopper.