CVA Wolf opinion

Blindstitch · August 4, 2015, 04:50 PM

I've been debating getting a 209 primer break action muzzleloader and the wolf is on my list. There's a guy selling one of the early ones locally for $100. Or would you just buy a new one for $180 plus tax?

I like the idea of the new one with finger tight breech plug. I have two older traditional muzzleloaders but I'm liking the ease of the newer break actions and less fuss cleaning/unloading.

Blindstitch · August 6, 2015, 04:28 AM

Anybody own one of these?

Pahoo · August 6, 2015, 10:02 AM

I do not own one but have shot them, just to say I did. The heart of an M/L, is the barrel and I believe these are supplied with Bergara barrels. "IF" it's mechanically sound and bore is good, I don't think you could go wrong with that price. .....

Be Safe !!!

FrontierGander · August 6, 2015, 04:57 PM

New one. Its a whole different rifle.

Blindstitch · August 6, 2015, 08:58 PM

FrontierGander,
Any reason you say that besides the obvious age difference?

Doyle · August 6, 2015, 09:19 PM

Google CVA explosion and you'll see why you might not want to risk buying an older one. Their earlier models (I'm talking a decade or more back) had a nasty habit of blowing up.

Even for a good ML brand, a problem with buying a used muzzleloader is that black powder (and substitutes) is extremely corrosive. Way too many newbies buy a muzzleloader, shoot it, then put it away uncleaned. That's why buying one without a very careful inspection of the barrel (especially the area just in front of the plug) is not smart.

Blindstitch · August 7, 2015, 03:53 AM

Jeeze nobody wants a portable pipe bomb.

FrontierGander · August 7, 2015, 10:24 AM

dont listen to that crap! The wakeman guy that writes these articles pimps an ambulance chasing lawyer and even advertises for that lawyer. Not to mention he used to work for savage, whos owners son in law was injured by one of the recalls gun 20 years ago. Im sure it paid well to do a smear campaign.

The newer 2010+ model is a completely different rifle. Better designed stock, breech plug and especially the trigger! The old wolf could have a 6lb trigger. Its normal for the new wolf models to have a 3lb trigger with no grit or take up.

6.5 million remingtons were recalled. How many still own their remington? or did you sell them off when ya got scar't?!

Blindstitch · August 7, 2015, 03:31 PM

FrontierGander,

Makes a lot of sense. But you may have sold me on the newer. 3 pound trigger you say. Before that the only thing that I really like was the finger tight breech plug idea.

My dad has a American Knight inline and somewhere in the cleaning process I assume the threads of the barrel flash rusted and he couldn't get the breach plug back in. It spent 9 months with a gunsmith who said it needed a new breech plug which looked brand new. Eventually I took the gun back from this guy who's name must have been smith. Shot the plug with wd40 and after the first thread grabbed it went right in and back out just as easy.

Doyle · August 7, 2015, 04:11 PM

One trick to keeping muzzleloaders in good shooting condition is to put a very thin coating of anti-sieze lube on the plug threads. Instead of buying the expensive stuff that is made for muzzleloaders, you can use spark plug anti-sieze lube from the auto parts store. It is made for dirty, high-temp environments so it's just as good or better than the ML stuff.

Pahoo · August 7, 2015, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Instead of buying the expensive stuff that is made for muzzleloaders, you can use spark plug anti-sieze lube from the auto parts store.

That is one that I have been using for a number of years now. Mine came as a crayon type stick and very easy to use. As you stated, is very inexpensive and lasts a lone time. ....

Be Safe !!!

FrontierGander · August 7, 2015, 11:22 PM

even better, get the new wolf and you dont need anything on the plug due to the way they designed the threads to seal.

Blindstitch · August 8, 2015, 06:39 AM

You guys make it hard not to go buy another gun this second.

I'll probably end up fondling some today.

Blindstitch · August 9, 2015, 07:27 PM

Oh no I played with several muzzleloaders and I think i'm going back to get the optima.

BirchOrr · August 9, 2015, 08:36 PM

... rush into it!

Take your time. Ease into it. Look at other models.

You get what ya pay for!

Birch

Blindstitch · August 10, 2015, 03:22 AM

Oh I looked at other models. Several Knights, Traditions, TC Encore and CVA.

My cousin is trying to talk me into the Encore but every time I hold it the stock doesn't feel right in my hand. Something about it and my body don't mesh.

The traditions and Knights were used but it seemed like they were still asking full price. And I don't want the bolt style action.

I've actually been looking for a while and kind of decided on the CVA line. Oddly enough I really didn't like the cva Accura in my hands. This has pretty much been almost a 2 year process to add another week to my deer season.

I do have a traditional Muzzleloader of some company. I think it was a kit gun at one time and then my uncle who's a metalurgist chromed it. And then I have a Thompson traditional style. I forget the name but I want to add a break action 209 rifle to the mix.

I had an incident with the chrome one that involved tracking a deer for over an hour just to pop 3 caps with no big bang. Then I got the fun of pulling the ball. Ended up hooking up a grease gun and pumping it out. That really sucked. With the newer style I could have fixed it in the field and maybe put some meat on the ground.

I'm open to suggestions but I really like the feel of the Optima V2. And the $254 price new isn't bad either.

BirchOrr · August 10, 2015, 03:20 PM

...Optima is a good rifle! Have you checked out the T/C Triumph?

Birch

FrontierGander · August 10, 2015, 03:32 PM

Love the Optima!

I've had several over the years. My personal favorite is the thumbhole version if you can use a scope in your state.

5 shots at 100 yards

Blindstitch · August 10, 2015, 08:28 PM

I couldn't find a TC triumph here. I don't know why.

I ended up picking up the Optima today and I like the way it looks with the stainless barrel.

My state allows scopes I believe but in case I get in a zone/state that doesn't I have the open sights. Yeah I know you can't see them through the scope mount but I may never have to use them. I do think a gun looks naked without open sights.

Now the question is what kind of projectile to send down range. I plan on using white hots and 777 primers. I see the basic ballistic table that came with it shows a slightly high 25 yard zero should have a 150 yard zero. Of course that has to be tested. I'll probably limit myself to 100 yards. But I really like the feel of this trigger. I can't wait to get it to the range.

Blindstitch · August 10, 2015, 08:55 PM

FrontierGander,
What kind of a load are you running through that? If I could get that kind of group I would be more than happy.

FrontierGander · August 11, 2015, 11:22 AM

That was 100gr blackhorn209, cci 209m primers and the 250gr powerbelt aerolite.

Use this search to look for the Optima posts. Muzzleloading and the shooting range will be most helpful topic areas.
http://www.frontiermuzzleloading.com...results=topics

Blindstitch · August 11, 2015, 04:32 PM

Thanks for the link. I just went down to a few local stores to see what common powders, primers and projectiles I should expect them to have in stock.

Looks like i'm down to Hornady SST, TC Shockwave and Powerbelts locally.
Then Triple 7, Pyrodex and White hot powders.

I'm a reloader so it's no big deal working up loads or figuring out which components shoot best for me. Just don't want to be one of those guys who looks in the ammo box 3 days prior to season and realize it's empty and the new components don't shoot the same.

BirchOrr · August 11, 2015, 04:55 PM

...Are you using the special breech plug CVA makes specifically for Blackhorn 209?

Birch

Doyle · August 11, 2015, 07:41 PM

Blindstitch, when I shot a ML (don't need one here in MS) I used 100gr of 777 with a 250gr Hornady SST with a 777 primer. I was getting just over 1" groups with a T/C Omega and a little larger with the Encore that replaced it.

Blindstitch · August 11, 2015, 08:35 PM

Doyle,
That's good to know. I'm leaning toward the Hornady because they're my go to with reloading.

The one thing I have to wonder is if CVA is exclusively in bed with Powerbelt. All of their videos are powerbelt this and powerbelt that. Then they say something like Sabots are ok but they require more cleaning. But it seems like they do it more like a scare warning kind of saying you will need to clean your barrel every few loads. Is that anywhere true?

I'm more worried about having to shoot a handful of times at a pay range and not being able to clean on site.

August 4, 2015, 04:50 PM	#1
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	CVA Wolf opinion I've been debating getting a 209 primer break action muzzleloader and the wolf is on my list. There's a guy selling one of the early ones locally for $100. Or would you just buy a new one for $180 plus tax? I like the idea of the new one with finger tight breech plug. I have two older traditional muzzleloaders but I'm liking the ease of the newer break actions and less fuss cleaning/unloading.

August 6, 2015, 10:02 AM	#3
Pahoo Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2006 Location: IOWA Posts: 8,783	Could be a good deal ??? I do not own one but have shot them, just to say I did. The heart of an M/L, is the barrel and I believe these are supplied with Bergara barrels. "IF" it's mechanically sound and bore is good, I don't think you could go wrong with that price. ..... Be Safe !!! __________________ 'Fundamental truths' are easy to recognize because they are verified daily through simple observation and thus, require no testing.

August 6, 2015, 04:57 PM	#4
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	New one. Its a whole different rifle. __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

August 7, 2015, 10:24 AM	#8
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	dont listen to that crap! The wakeman guy that writes these articles pimps an ambulance chasing lawyer and even advertises for that lawyer. Not to mention he used to work for savage, whos owners son in law was injured by one of the recalls gun 20 years ago. Im sure it paid well to do a smear campaign. The newer 2010+ model is a completely different rifle. Better designed stock, breech plug and especially the trigger! The old wolf could have a 6lb trigger. Its normal for the new wolf models to have a 3lb trigger with no grit or take up. 6.5 million remingtons were recalled. How many still own their remington? or did you sell them off when ya got scar't?! __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

August 7, 2015, 11:22 PM	#12
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	even better, get the new wolf and you dont need anything on the plug due to the way they designed the threads to seal. __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

August 6, 2015, 04:28 AM	#2
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	Anybody own one of these?

August 6, 2015, 08:58 PM	#5
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	FrontierGander, Any reason you say that besides the obvious age difference?

August 6, 2015, 09:19 PM	#6
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	Google CVA explosion and you'll see why you might not want to risk buying an older one. Their earlier models (I'm talking a decade or more back) had a nasty habit of blowing up. Even for a good ML brand, a problem with buying a used muzzleloader is that black powder (and substitutes) is extremely corrosive. Way too many newbies buy a muzzleloader, shoot it, then put it away uncleaned. That's why buying one without a very careful inspection of the barrel (especially the area just in front of the plug) is not smart.

August 7, 2015, 03:53 AM	#7
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	Jeeze nobody wants a portable pipe bomb.

August 7, 2015, 03:31 PM	#9
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	FrontierGander, Makes a lot of sense. But you may have sold me on the newer. 3 pound trigger you say. Before that the only thing that I really like was the finger tight breech plug idea. My dad has a American Knight inline and somewhere in the cleaning process I assume the threads of the barrel flash rusted and he couldn't get the breach plug back in. It spent 9 months with a gunsmith who said it needed a new breech plug which looked brand new. Eventually I took the gun back from this guy who's name must have been smith. Shot the plug with wd40 and after the first thread grabbed it went right in and back out just as easy.

August 7, 2015, 04:11 PM	#10
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	One trick to keeping muzzleloaders in good shooting condition is to put a very thin coating of anti-sieze lube on the plug threads. Instead of buying the expensive stuff that is made for muzzleloaders, you can use spark plug anti-sieze lube from the auto parts store. It is made for dirty, high-temp environments so it's just as good or better than the ML stuff.

August 8, 2015, 06:39 AM	#13
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	You guys make it hard not to go buy another gun this second. I'll probably end up fondling some today.

August 9, 2015, 07:27 PM	#14
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	Oh no I played with several muzzleloaders and I think i'm going back to get the optima.

August 9, 2015, 08:36 PM	#15
BirchOrr Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2012 Location: Eaton Rapids, MI Posts: 445	Don't... ... rush into it! Take your time. Ease into it. Look at other models. You get what ya pay for! Birch __________________ Black Powder: Not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win...

August 10, 2015, 03:22 AM	#16
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	Oh I looked at other models. Several Knights, Traditions, TC Encore and CVA. My cousin is trying to talk me into the Encore but every time I hold it the stock doesn't feel right in my hand. Something about it and my body don't mesh. The traditions and Knights were used but it seemed like they were still asking full price. And I don't want the bolt style action. I've actually been looking for a while and kind of decided on the CVA line. Oddly enough I really didn't like the cva Accura in my hands. This has pretty much been almost a 2 year process to add another week to my deer season. I do have a traditional Muzzleloader of some company. I think it was a kit gun at one time and then my uncle who's a metalurgist chromed it. And then I have a Thompson traditional style. I forget the name but I want to add a break action 209 rifle to the mix. I had an incident with the chrome one that involved tracking a deer for over an hour just to pop 3 caps with no big bang. Then I got the fun of pulling the ball. Ended up hooking up a grease gun and pumping it out. That really sucked. With the newer style I could have fixed it in the field and maybe put some meat on the ground. I'm open to suggestions but I really like the feel of the Optima V2. And the $254 price new isn't bad either.

August 10, 2015, 03:20 PM	#17
BirchOrr Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2012 Location: Eaton Rapids, MI Posts: 445	the... ...Optima is a good rifle! Have you checked out the T/C Triumph? Birch __________________ Black Powder: Not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win...

August 10, 2015, 03:32 PM	#18
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	Love the Optima! I've had several over the years. My personal favorite is the thumbhole version if you can use a scope in your state. 5 shots at 100 yards __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

August 10, 2015, 08:28 PM	#19
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	I couldn't find a TC triumph here. I don't know why. I ended up picking up the Optima today and I like the way it looks with the stainless barrel. My state allows scopes I believe but in case I get in a zone/state that doesn't I have the open sights. Yeah I know you can't see them through the scope mount but I may never have to use them. I do think a gun looks naked without open sights. Now the question is what kind of projectile to send down range. I plan on using white hots and 777 primers. I see the basic ballistic table that came with it shows a slightly high 25 yard zero should have a 150 yard zero. Of course that has to be tested. I'll probably limit myself to 100 yards. But I really like the feel of this trigger. I can't wait to get it to the range.

August 10, 2015, 08:55 PM	#20
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	FrontierGander, What kind of a load are you running through that? If I could get that kind of group I would be more than happy.

August 11, 2015, 11:22 AM	#21
FrontierGander Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2009 Location: Boncarbo,Colorado Posts: 651	That was 100gr blackhorn209, cci 209m primers and the 250gr powerbelt aerolite. Use this search to look for the Optima posts. Muzzleloading and the shooting range will be most helpful topic areas. http://www.frontiermuzzleloading.com...results=topics __________________ https://buckskinsbp.blogspot.com/

August 11, 2015, 04:32 PM	#22
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	Thanks for the link. I just went down to a few local stores to see what common powders, primers and projectiles I should expect them to have in stock. Looks like i'm down to Hornady SST, TC Shockwave and Powerbelts locally. Then Triple 7, Pyrodex and White hot powders. I'm a reloader so it's no big deal working up loads or figuring out which components shoot best for me. Just don't want to be one of those guys who looks in the ammo box 3 days prior to season and realize it's empty and the new components don't shoot the same.

August 11, 2015, 04:55 PM	#23
BirchOrr Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2012 Location: Eaton Rapids, MI Posts: 445	Frontier... ...Are you using the special breech plug CVA makes specifically for Blackhorn 209? Birch __________________ Black Powder: Not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win...

August 11, 2015, 07:41 PM	#24
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Rainbow City, Alabama Posts: 7,167	Blindstitch, when I shot a ML (don't need one here in MS) I used 100gr of 777 with a 250gr Hornady SST with a 777 primer. I was getting just over 1" groups with a T/C Omega and a little larger with the Encore that replaced it.

August 11, 2015, 08:35 PM	#25
Blindstitch Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2013 Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin Posts: 2,693	Doyle, That's good to know. I'm leaning toward the Hornady because they're my go to with reloading. The one thing I have to wonder is if CVA is exclusively in bed with Powerbelt. All of their videos are powerbelt this and powerbelt that. Then they say something like Sabots are ok but they require more cleaning. But it seems like they do it more like a scare warning kind of saying you will need to clean your barrel every few loads. Is that anywhere true? I'm more worried about having to shoot a handful of times at a pay range and not being able to clean on site.