Found a Traditions "Crockett Rifle" .32 cal. - comments on rifle and ?? for owners

[bedbugbilly]

I was interested in finding a .32 ML for plinking, etc. I once had a CVA "Squirrel Rifle" - like an idiot I sold it a few years back. Anyway . . . although I'd never seen one of the Traditions "Crockett Rifles" in person - I have read all the threads on here in regards to them and generally the owners like them. After lots of looking at various sites, etc. - I posted on another site and within an hour located one that a fellow would sell or trade. Long story short - I had what he wanted and he had what I wanted so "horse trade" was completed. He said that he had shot it a few times at a RB club. He sent along a bag of 100 .310 swaged balls and a nice little powder horn so those were nice "additions".

Today was "get acquainted day" and I was able to shoot about 40 rounds. I was using a one inch bull with rings an inch apart and a squirrel profile target. As a result of this shooting - I have some questions I'm hoping some Crockett owners can answer?

This was what I was using . . . .

.310 swaged balls
3F Goex Black Powder
Patches - pillow ticking. I'm not sure of the thickness as my micrometer is in AZ and I'm currently in MI. I make my own patches utilizing a modified hole saw and the drill press. Pillow ticking is washed to remove sizing - I use the same patch in my .36 underhammer with a Green Mountain barrel with a .350 ball and it works well.
Patch lubricant - I usually use a mixture of 1 small can of Crisco and I toilet bowl ring melted together - soak patches and then blot well with paper towel.
One set of patches was lubed with this formula and one was lubed with Virgin Olive Oil (never tried it before so thought I would). Both seemed to work equally well.
Range - all shots at 25 yards.

I was shooting offhand since I don't have a bench. The previous owner said he used 25 grains of FFFG so I started with that load. After the initial shot with a clean barrel, I used a "spit patch" down the barrel between shots.

With 25 Grains, after the 1st shot, I was hitting about six inches high while aiming at the bull. I decided to cut down to 20 Grains and that dropped to about 4 inches high. I then dropped to 18 Grains and was hitting about 3 inches high. In order to bring my hits down on both the bull target and the squirrel, I ended up aiming (and guesstimating) 3 to 4 inches below in order to bring the shots down where they should be. Windage seemed to be right on (ignoring my unsteadiness at times).

Even though this was my "maiden voyage" with a new rifle, shooting high like I was doing would indicate to me that the front sight needs to be taller to bring the point of impact down. (These are open iron style sights). I know that everyone has their own preferred "sight picture" - I have to shoot left handed even though I am right handed (and right eyed) as my central vision in the right eye is not good. I am a "plinker" - not a competitive shooter so I use a variety of different target sizes and animal profile targets, suckers, cans, etc. The majority of my shooting is at 25 yards at these various targets so I would like my point of aim to be my point of impact. So far the 18 grain load seemed to work the best and I'm hesitant to drop it any further. The next time I shoot, I can try to reduce it lower to see if POA and POI get closer but what would you suggest would be the lowest charge to go to?

These balls were .310. Unfortunately, I sold my Lee .310 mold as I didn't think I would ever need it again so I just got a new one but it is one of the newer style Lee double cavities only in .311. Since this is the ball I'll be using all the time, I will cast some up and try them before I get serious about any sight adjustments, etc. Should I expect any difference in how the .310 and the .311 shoot? It doesn't seem like there would be any significant weight difference that would matter but will I notice a difference on POI?

I haven't been able to find out the size of the front sight dovetail so will probably contact Traditions to see if they can tell me should I need to replace with a taller one. If worse comes to worse, I can make one without a lot of hassle.

I had never seen one of these rifles in person but was basing my desire to try one by the reviews that I've read and the comments on them on this forum. The CVA "squirrel rifle" that I had I would classify as more of a "kid's rifle" - smaller in size. When this arrived, I was pleasantly surprised. I'm not sure when my rifle was made but it's very nice. Fit and finish are very good for a production rifle. I'm partial to walnut stocks and although the stock isn't walnut (grain resembles maple) but with a walnut tone, it's very nicely finished. The double set triggers are a pleasure to use. They are equal to the custom built Hawken I made years ago with higher quality set triggers. The bolster flash channel into the breech seems to be well designed as ignition was instant on all shots - used CCI #11 caps. I can easily see why these are a popular, well liked little .32 rifle. I'm 6 foot, 200 pounds and the balance and feel of this rifle is terrific. All in all it kind of reminds me of what a typical "trade rifle" would be back in the 1860's and '70's - similar to what was sold by such suppliers as Blue Grass Hardware, etc. - a nice functional rifle that would give years of service.

I really don't have any criticism of the rifle but if I could make any changes it would be first, to have a hooked breech so the barrel could easily be removed. It has a nice single wedge barrel lug but the tang screw has to be removed to remove the barrel. It would be a lot easier to have a hooked breech so you could remove the barrel quickly, stick it in a bucket of hot soapy water and clean it. My rifle has an aluminum ramrod and that's the second thing I'd change. While it works o.k. it is going "bye bye". It's 5/16" and I'll make up a hickory rod with a brass tip for a jag this week. Like I put on all of the rifles I've made or purchased, I'll make it so it extends beyond the muzzle a couple of inches just to have more to hang on to when loading. I'll probably also make up a longer "range rod".

The patches that I used today are what I use in my .36. They are cut with a modified 1 1/4" hole saw so the overall diameter is around 1 1/8" inch. Although I usually make such things as "short starters", etc. - I bought a Treso short starter to use. It's made for a .32 through a .40 and it works great on my .36 but the 5/16" brass shaft is just too large for the .32. With the patch size I was using, there wasn't enough clearance and in getting the ball in the barrel, the extra patch material would bind between the starter shaft and the bore. I picked up a piece of 1/4" round aluminum and will make a different short starter for the .32 which should work much better. I'm also going to pick up a 1" hole saw which when altered, should give a patch about 7/8" in diameter that should work much better.

If any of your Crockett Rifle owners could make suggestions or those that shoot .32 - I'd greatly appreciate it. I'm not going to work on the sights until I can experiment more with the .311 balls. I'd like to get a load worked out and the sighting on this rifle so POA and POI are the same at 25 yards since that is what I usually shoot.

I have a 50 yard marker as well and then I would move back to that after I get it tuned for the 25 yard range. What advice is there for finding a good combination for hitting POA and POI at that range. Some of the reading I've done say it's "iffy" with a .32 beyond 40 yards. Is that correct or can I work out a load for 50 yards that will compensate for the drop at that range to raise the POI as close as possible to POA - maybe having to have the POA elevated a little to compensate for the drop?

Thoughts and suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I know I could get better results with a larger caliber but I really like the smaller .32. Or is my thinking flawed? From what i've experienced so far, the front sight need to be raised - can't really do a whole lot in regards to altering the rear. For those who have the Crockett - what's your experience in regards to your sights, POA and POI? Is this typical of the Crocketts as they are, out of the box at 25 yards? What is the best load you've found out of your rifle at 25 yards? Am I expecting too much out of the .32 round ball at 50 yards?

As mentioned in several of the threads on here - the smaller calibers don't get discussed much so would appreciate any help/suggestions. Many thanks.

[kwhi43]

I had one, and it shot pretty well. By that I mean I could shoot 5 shot in
a 1 1/4 groups all day long at 50 yds. Sold it to my next door neighbor who
Has a 13 yr old boy who wanted it. He won the JR's last weekend state shoot.
Load is the Hornady "0" Buck and a .017 patch and 20 grs Goex FFF.

[Rifleman1776]

I didn't wade all the way through your very long post. I'll still offer a comment or two.
Do not do anything to the sights until you have shot from a bench rest. The results will be different.
With a tiny caliber like that the difference between .310 and .311 might be disconcerting to you. You may find the .311 hard to load with ticking patching. If it requires a hammer to short start the .311 you certainly do not have a woods rifle there.
A thinner patch will probably work for you. Unfortunately, a good, strong, tight weave, pure cotton material might very hard to find these days. I used to use airplane cloth. It is (was?) a material used for restoring antique airplanes. Do some searching for this or something similar and buy a lot when you find it.
Other than that you seem on the right track. I would also look for Delrin for your everyday ram rod use. It is strong and won't break as tiny rods are prone to do. That makes it safer, particularly in the woods.

[Hawg]

Never fired one that small but I know on other forums people that have them really like them. I wouldn't think there would be a lot of difference between .310 and .311 but what do I know. I have used bulk rags from work but they have to be washed a few times to get the Scotch Guard off of them. I don't understand why they put that stuff on rags.

[bedbugbilly]

Thanks kwhi - I tried to find some "0" buckshot but didn't have any luck in finding any around my location. When I was a kid, I had a .32 made up out of old gun parts - I used the buckshot in it with a thick patch and it did o.k. in nailing tree rats. I used to by it in a 5 pound sack which gave a lot of shots.

I'm going to have to break down and make some type of shooting bench as I know that it's the best way to sight in.

Rifleman - I know the .311 will be tighter and I'll have to change patch thickness. I looked all over for a .310 mold - either a Lee or a Lyman but couldn't scare one up. I really don't know why Lee changed to the .311. My goal is to have a ball/patch combination that will slide down easily and be accurate - and I always spit patch between shots. I remember several fellows who used the airplane cloth many years ago but as you say, to find it is another story these days. I have a Delrin rod that I use as a range rod for my under hammer. I still much prefer a good hickory rod. They break basically due to one of two problems. One, the grain is wrong and two, the user grasps it too high when pushing a ball down the barrel. If you grasp closer to the muzzle and do it in steps, they'll work fine - even on larger caliber bores. Vincent Rifles with larger bores are a good example and proof that a small rod will suffice if used properly.

I've seen photos of two of these Crockett Rifles where someone "added on" to the front sight. One looked like they had soldered a piece of 1/8" brass brazing rod on. The sights on my rifle appear unaltered so I was curious if others had Crocketts that initially shot high?

Hawg - I never thought about shops rags as a source for patches. . . but they ought to work just fine with the sizing washed out. I'll keep that in mind!

I'll keep y'all posted on my progress once I get the .311 balls cast and rig up some sort of bench rest. Thanks!

[Hawg]

Hawg - I never thought about shops rags as a source for patches. . . but they ought to work just fine with the sizing washed out. I'll keep that in mind!

I'm not talking about those red shop rags like Auto Zone sells. I think the weave on those would be to loose.

[bedbugbilly]

Hawg - I agree - the red ones wouldn't be worth a darn. I'm thinking of the ones I've seen that are a really tight weave . . .

[Jbar4Ranch]

Go to Wal Mart and buy the best set of linen or cotton pillow cases you can find. I bought a set of 1000 TPI Egyptian cotton ones for about $25 and they will provide a life times supply of patches for those tiny little .32's. I've got a Crockett and a .32 barrel for my T/C Hawken - talk about the original bull barrel!

[bedbugbilly]

Thanks Jbar - good suggestion! I cast a couple hundred of the .311 balls in the new Lee mold that I bought. I checked tonight and the .311 / pillow ticking patches are way too tight. I was planning on hitting the fabric store later this week and seeing what they had in some tightly woven Irish linen. I never gave the pillow cases a thought but the TPI on them are certainly high and tight. Thanks!

In regards to your "bull barrel" . I had a friend of my family show me a original half-stock last year that had been passed down through his family. It was by all means a "utility rifle" - nothing fancy about it but what I found interesting was that the barrel was 1 1/8 inch across the flats - and it was in .32 caliber. Talk about muzzle heavy!

[Pahoo]

Go to Wal Mart and buy the best set of linen or cotton pillow cases you can find. I bought a set of 1000 TPI Egyptian cotton ones for about $25 and they will provide a life times supply of patches for those tiny little .32's. I've got a Crockett and a .32 barrel for my T/C Hawken - talk about the original bull barrel!

Great suggestion as I have found that the best patch material, is cotton linen, fine Irish linen to be exact. I have never owned a Crockett but have shot one. instead, I have owned a TC Cherokee, in .32, using, .310, .311 and .312. experiment with patch thickness and see if your Crockett will let you get away with using a .010 patch. ....

Be Safe!!!

[Sure Shot Mc Gee]

Never shot a 32. Nor wanted a B/P Garden Predator Eliminator. As I thought having a 15/16s hexagon barrel drilled for 32 would be a little too much weigh to carry thru the woods for so small a quarry in return. But those who do find the caliber unique or an interesting challenge to their marksmanship on small game or targeting. And knowing full well what appeals to Peter may not appeal to Paul. You fellows go for it. Maybe a nudge occasionally on what fun were missing out on is all that it will take to garner our interest on the 32.

S/S

[Beagle333]

I'd like to have a .32 or a .36, but I really wish I had one that would shoot my .454 revolver balls, and I could just cast all one size.