I find it funny - Page 2

kilimanjaro · May 16, 2015, 03:00 PM

Same out here, 3 counties in Washington state control the other 35, and Oregon is the same sorry state of affairs.

SIGSHR · May 16, 2015, 03:27 PM

When you put the uniform on you become one of the "police or military only" elite that the anti-RKBA is always quacking about as being the only ones who should be permitted to have firearms.
When you take the uniform off, you become a knuckle dragging bitter-clinger
, etc., etc., with an IQ of 75.

kilimanjaro · May 17, 2015, 08:39 AM

Don't forget, you get to be a deranged vet with Post-Traumatic Stress, the ticking time bomb beloved by journalists. While you were in the service, of course, you were an uneducated hick with no marketable skills, a victim of trickle-down economic policies that forced you to join the military in order to eat. In other words, once a knuckle-dragging inbred mouth-breather, always a knuckle-dragging inbred mouth-breather, in or out of the service.

The only reason the gun haters use the only-military-should-have-them is to convince the public to get them out of private hands. They just don't respect the military at all.

SC4006 · May 17, 2015, 02:17 PM

I'd say that just about sums it up Kilimanjaro, as unfortunate as it is. That's okay though, it doesn't bother me. I don't need any naysayer's approval to be proud of my decisions.

45Gunner · May 17, 2015, 03:25 PM

Before I retired as a Federal Agent, I carried a duty weapon inside sterile areas of airports and on airplanes.

Now, when I fly, I have to check my armament inside my luggage like anyone else.

When I do a road trip, I have to check what states have reciprocity with my state (Florida) so I won't knowingly violate any laws. I usually avoid states such as NJ, NY, MA, etc.

The moral of the story is that we have to obey the applicable laws as they apply to us at a particular point in time and at a particular geographical location.

**Aguila Blanca** · May 17, 2015, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 45Gunner

Before I retired as a Federal Agent, I carried a duty weapon inside sterile areas of airports and on airplanes.

...

When I do a road trip, I have to check what states have reciprocity with my state (Florida) so I won't knowingly violate any laws. I usually avoid states such as NJ, NY, MA, etc.

Aren't you covered by the LEOSA, irrespective of permits and reciprocity? You should be if you're a retired federal LEO.

dvdcrr · May 17, 2015, 11:05 PM

Quote:

The moral of the story is that we have to obey the applicable laws as they apply to us at a particular point in time and at a particular geographical location.

I respect your civility and view but also I am reminded that not all laws are necessarily just. George Washington and many others chose to disregard many "applicable" laws. Martin Luther King Jr. wrote about this as well in his letters from Birmingham jail. As we speak there are one billion Chinese who are banned from using the open internet. At some point along the spectrum of restriction of personal liberty, "reasonable" government regulation just becomes tyranny does it not?

Dashunde · May 18, 2015, 08:23 AM

Quote:

The moral of the story is that we have to obey the applicable laws as they apply to us at a particular point in time and at a particular geographical location.

Quote:

I respect your civility and view but also I am reminded that not all laws are necessarily just. George Washington and many others chose to disregard many "applicable" laws. Martin Luther King Jr. wrote about this as well in his letters from Birmingham jail. As we speak there are one billion Chinese who are banned from using the open internet. At some point along the spectrum of restriction of personal liberty, "reasonable" government regulation just becomes tyranny does it not?

Both points are obviously correct, the next step is voting in figures who represent your values and personal liberty.

The process is slow with uncertain outcomes and you'll never get 100% of what you want, but neither will the other side.
While frustrating, its also a benefit because it provides stability and slows unsettling change.

Whats that they say? "A fair deal is one where both walk away feeling screwed"

We American's still have the best deal on the planet.

Bucksnort1 · May 18, 2015, 10:07 AM

Elections have consequences.

kilimanjaro · May 18, 2015, 06:37 PM

So does not voting.

If you value your rights, vote to keep them.

Bart Noir · May 19, 2015, 07:26 PM

rickyrick, you were concise and so right to the point:

Quote:

Gun laws are not about controlling criminals. Criminal have already crossed that line. Laws are for controlling the controllable.

OBTW, since I live on the edge of Seattle and have a somewhat accurate idea of the terrain down near the Columbia, I am certain that you cannot be in "Mesquite Jungle Desert, West Texas".. How recently did you move to WA State?

I've been here since I was in high school and Nixon was POTUS then. I've learned to love this state and realized that the gun laws were not too bad. And then that damn initiative was passed and the state gets into every single gun sale. But, looking on the bright side, we got suppressors and short-barreled rifles legalized in just the last few years.

Bart Noir

rickyrick · May 19, 2015, 09:27 PM

Beginning of 2014

WA is a magical place

kilimanjaro · May 20, 2015, 07:49 PM

Rickyrick, welcome to Washington. If you haven't done it yet, spend a weekend going across the North Cascades on Highway 20.

rickyrick · May 20, 2015, 08:07 PM

Thanks, I will definitely do that.

I go shoot in Gifford Pinchot.

But sometimes I explore around,

Unlicensed Dremel · May 21, 2015, 11:09 PM

....Or, better yet, you're disarmed on base. Now THAT's weird.

rickyrick · May 22, 2015, 07:41 AM

When I was in the army, my buddy got into trouble for having a cheap novelty crossbow and a flea market blow gun

Blue Grass · May 22, 2015, 05:19 PM

To paraphrase Shane: "A gun is just a tool, Marion. No better or worse than the man who holds it."

The antis have to treat you like a criminal. If they didn't, they'd have to admit that people, not guns, are the problem.

tirod · May 24, 2015, 07:22 AM

Some of us definitely get it.

I can fly with an M16A2 under my seat into a foreign country, I can't drive into NJ with a pistol.

The disconnect that the anti gunners are attempting to enforce is that the individual cannot ever be trusted with firearms unless they are in an organized social hierarchy with dominant leaders who control and direct their behavior.

We are not allowed to be free with our own independent view of what to do. That's why when I got out of the military after 22 years my state would not recognize any of my previous service, knowledge, or expertise in using the numerous firearms I (and many others) trained on.

Six months on duty carrying an M9 every hour, and in rotation, an M16A2 with full magazine? Not good enough, we won't even trust you to have a CCW permit.

It's taken years to recover the rights we have lost, and every incident where someone goes rogue killing innocents only adds to the burden. Because one or two percent of the population does that, the other 98% can't be trusted.

It's part of our human nature - people in general don't accept risk, even that low. A 2% risk can and does affect our decision making, especially after the event. Up to then, we almost ignored it, after, it's suddenly much larger in our perspective.

Add up all the 2% risk events that have happened, and the general public becomes concerned, politicians and anti's get onto a campaign, things start moving toward legislation.

Notwithstanding that many other risks in life are far more prevalent - like, distracted moms with children under 6 with a swimming pool in the yard. Thousands of kids drown annually - but nobody is ever going to campaign about it.

Evil guns? You bet. Big political stakes there, because it empowers the powerless to force others to be officially anointed before they can exercise their rights. It's about control - not about logic or freedom.

If there truly was freedom local groups would be hunting down drug dealers and shooting them on sight.
Gangstas would nod politely on the street as they pass by.
Bank robbers would be laughed at while the staff pulled out their AR's from the cabinet and the floor manager shouted the action plan.
Retail employees could carry as they see fit.
"No weapons allowed" would never be posted - or need to.

We just can't trust a very few, and we won't do anything in terms of prior restraint to prevent them acting on their potential plans. Which is another ball of snakes.

So we live with disarmament and lump it, until it becomes absolutely necessary to deal with it. Usually at the expense of somebody's life, at which point tongues cluck and it's said, something should have been done.

Which only covers up the real issue. Restrictions on our rights only create freedom for those who lack morals.

rickyrick · May 24, 2015, 12:43 PM

Love the last line

SC4006 · May 24, 2015, 06:26 PM

Tirod, you're spot on. What you said is exactly how I think. I wish we could live in a world you described, but unfortunately I don't think it will happen; there are still just too many people that haven't caught on to the logic of defending yourself from the people who have zero regard to the law.

Tinbucket · May 24, 2015, 09:21 PM

I have thought about like everyone has. They don't trust us does not mean they don't trust us to be good Citizens. It means they don't trust us because
we may rise up to defend the Republic and our Constitution.
After what Session said on the floor in regard to the passage of TPA it reaffirms the conclusion.

**44 AMP** · May 25, 2015, 11:09 AM

And yet, they trust us to vote....or do they??

rickyrick · May 25, 2015, 03:53 PM

In a world shaped by television, people vote by what's "in" not what's right

**Aguila Blanca** · May 25, 2015, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyrick

When I was in the army, my buddy got into trouble for having a cheap novelty crossbow and a flea market blow gun

When I was in Vietnam (and not exactly downtown Saigon), I got in touble for having an MP nightstick.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tirod

We are not allowed to be free with our own independent view of what to do. That's why when I got out of the military after 22 years my state would not recognize any of my previous service, knowledge, or expertise in using the numerous firearms I (and many others) trained on.

Six months on duty carrying an M9 every hour, and in rotation, an M16A2 with full magazine? Not good enough, we won't even trust you to have a CCW permit.

This shows quite clearly the difference among the states. I had to take an 8-hour NRA Basic Pistol class to get a carry permit in my home state. Florida, on the other hand, readily accepted my DD-214 as proof of firearms safety training -- even though the DD-214 was almost 40 years old at the time and didn't show any qualifications with handguns (although I did for a time shoot on my unit's pistol team, I was never formally "qualified" with the M1911A1).

kilimanjaro · May 25, 2015, 05:24 PM

Even the most abbreviated military firearms training is head and shoulders above state requirements for licensees.

May 17, 2015, 08:39 AM	#28
kilimanjaro Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2009 Posts: 3,963	Don't forget, you get to be a deranged vet with Post-Traumatic Stress, the ticking time bomb beloved by journalists. While you were in the service, of course, you were an uneducated hick with no marketable skills, a victim of trickle-down economic policies that forced you to join the military in order to eat. In other words, once a knuckle-dragging inbred mouth-breather, always a knuckle-dragging inbred mouth-breather, in or out of the service. The only reason the gun haters use the only-military-should-have-them is to convince the public to get them out of private hands. They just don't respect the military at all. Last edited by kilimanjaro; May 17, 2015 at 11:38 AM.

May 17, 2015, 02:17 PM	#29
SC4006 Senior Member Join Date: June 27, 2012 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 525	I'd say that just about sums it up Kilimanjaro, as unfortunate as it is. That's okay though, it doesn't bother me. I don't need any naysayer's approval to be proud of my decisions. __________________ I don't always go to the range, but when I do, I prefer dosAKs. They say 5 out of 4 people are bad at math.

May 17, 2015, 03:25 PM	#30
45Gunner Senior Member Join Date: August 8, 2009 Location: Boca Raton, FL Posts: 1,902	Before I retired as a Federal Agent, I carried a duty weapon inside sterile areas of airports and on airplanes. Now, when I fly, I have to check my armament inside my luggage like anyone else. When I do a road trip, I have to check what states have reciprocity with my state (Florida) so I won't knowingly violate any laws. I usually avoid states such as NJ, NY, MA, etc. The moral of the story is that we have to obey the applicable laws as they apply to us at a particular point in time and at a particular geographical location. __________________ 45Gunner May the Schwartz Be With You. NRA Instructor NRA Life Member

May 19, 2015, 09:27 PM	#37
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	Beginning of 2014 WA is a magical place __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 20, 2015, 08:07 PM	#39
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	Thanks, I will definitely do that. I go shoot in Gifford Pinchot. But sometimes I explore around, __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 16, 2015, 03:00 PM	#26
kilimanjaro Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2009 Posts: 3,963	Same out here, 3 counties in Washington state control the other 35, and Oregon is the same sorry state of affairs.

May 16, 2015, 03:27 PM	#27
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	When you put the uniform on you become one of the "police or military only" elite that the anti-RKBA is always quacking about as being the only ones who should be permitted to have firearms. When you take the uniform off, you become a knuckle dragging bitter-clinger , etc., etc., with an IQ of 75.

May 18, 2015, 10:07 AM	#34
Bucksnort1 Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2013 Location: Littleton, Colorado Posts: 1,121	Elections have consequences.

May 18, 2015, 06:37 PM	#35
kilimanjaro Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2009 Posts: 3,963	So does not voting. If you value your rights, vote to keep them.

May 20, 2015, 07:49 PM	#38
kilimanjaro Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2009 Posts: 3,963	Rickyrick, welcome to Washington. If you haven't done it yet, spend a weekend going across the North Cascades on Highway 20.

May 21, 2015, 11:09 PM	#40
Unlicensed Dremel Junior member Join Date: February 13, 2014 Location: Flathead Valley, MT Posts: 2,187	....Or, better yet, you're disarmed on base. Now THAT's weird.

May 22, 2015, 07:41 AM	#41
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	When I was in the army, my buddy got into trouble for having a cheap novelty crossbow and a flea market blow gun __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 22, 2015, 05:19 PM	#42
Blue Grass Senior Member Join Date: August 12, 2009 Posts: 398	To paraphrase Shane: "A gun is just a tool, Marion. No better or worse than the man who holds it." The antis have to treat you like a criminal. If they didn't, they'd have to admit that people, not guns, are the problem.

May 24, 2015, 07:22 AM	#43
tirod Junior member Join Date: January 21, 2009 Posts: 1,672	Some of us definitely get it. I can fly with an M16A2 under my seat into a foreign country, I can't drive into NJ with a pistol. The disconnect that the anti gunners are attempting to enforce is that the individual cannot ever be trusted with firearms unless they are in an organized social hierarchy with dominant leaders who control and direct their behavior. We are not allowed to be free with our own independent view of what to do. That's why when I got out of the military after 22 years my state would not recognize any of my previous service, knowledge, or expertise in using the numerous firearms I (and many others) trained on. Six months on duty carrying an M9 every hour, and in rotation, an M16A2 with full magazine? Not good enough, we won't even trust you to have a CCW permit. It's taken years to recover the rights we have lost, and every incident where someone goes rogue killing innocents only adds to the burden. Because one or two percent of the population does that, the other 98% can't be trusted. It's part of our human nature - people in general don't accept risk, even that low. A 2% risk can and does affect our decision making, especially after the event. Up to then, we almost ignored it, after, it's suddenly much larger in our perspective. Add up all the 2% risk events that have happened, and the general public becomes concerned, politicians and anti's get onto a campaign, things start moving toward legislation. Notwithstanding that many other risks in life are far more prevalent - like, distracted moms with children under 6 with a swimming pool in the yard. Thousands of kids drown annually - but nobody is ever going to campaign about it. Evil guns? You bet. Big political stakes there, because it empowers the powerless to force others to be officially anointed before they can exercise their rights. It's about control - not about logic or freedom. If there truly was freedom local groups would be hunting down drug dealers and shooting them on sight. Gangstas would nod politely on the street as they pass by. Bank robbers would be laughed at while the staff pulled out their AR's from the cabinet and the floor manager shouted the action plan. Retail employees could carry as they see fit. "No weapons allowed" would never be posted - or need to. We just can't trust a very few, and we won't do anything in terms of prior restraint to prevent them acting on their potential plans. Which is another ball of snakes. So we live with disarmament and lump it, until it becomes absolutely necessary to deal with it. Usually at the expense of somebody's life, at which point tongues cluck and it's said, something should have been done. Which only covers up the real issue. Restrictions on our rights only create freedom for those who lack morals.

May 24, 2015, 12:43 PM	#44
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	Love the last line __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 24, 2015, 06:26 PM	#45
SC4006 Senior Member Join Date: June 27, 2012 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 525	Tirod, you're spot on. What you said is exactly how I think. I wish we could live in a world you described, but unfortunately I don't think it will happen; there are still just too many people that haven't caught on to the logic of defending yourself from the people who have zero regard to the law. __________________ I don't always go to the range, but when I do, I prefer dosAKs. They say 5 out of 4 people are bad at math.

May 24, 2015, 09:21 PM	#46
Tinbucket Senior Member Join Date: January 17, 2015 Posts: 355	I find it funny.... I have thought about like everyone has. They don't trust us does not mean they don't trust us to be good Citizens. It means they don't trust us because we may rise up to defend the Republic and our Constitution. After what Session said on the floor in regard to the passage of TPA it reaffirms the conclusion.

May 25, 2015, 11:09 AM	#47
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,791	And yet, they trust us to vote....or do they?? __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

May 25, 2015, 03:53 PM	#48
rickyrick Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2010 Posts: 8,236	In a world shaped by television, people vote by what's "in" not what's right __________________ Woohoo, I’m back In Texas!!!

May 25, 2015, 05:24 PM	#50
kilimanjaro Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2009 Posts: 3,963	Even the most abbreviated military firearms training is head and shoulders above state requirements for licensees.

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