Firearms and the Mentally Ill

Hardcase · January 2, 2014, 12:24 PM

As part of an ongoing family drama that I would not believe if I hadn't experienced it myself, I've ended up with custody of my father in law's two rifles. I'm faced with the dilemma of what to do when he eventually demands to have them back.

(Deleted a ton of stuff based on Pax's reply below)

The distilled essence is that my father in law is suicidal and at the minimum verbally violent. I've got the guns - he wants them back. I have an obvious difficulty putting firearms in the hands of a suicidal and potentially violent person, particularly a family member.

I guess that I'll be calling a lawyer today, but I appreciate your insight as well.

pax · January 2, 2014, 12:43 PM

First -- I'm sorry your family is going through such tough times. That's really rough and you have my sympathy!

Second -- that's way too much personal information to put out on the web. Sucks, but true anyway.

Third -- there's nobody on TFL who can definitively answer a question like that; or rather, you should never ever gamble your freedom and your "not-a-criminal" status on the word of a casual online acquaintance. Not on something like this.

You need a good lawyer who practices in your state to answer that question, and to advise you what to do next.

If you're anything like me, you probably balk at the thought of spending money on something like that. Please trust the voice of experience here: The cost of a short consultation with a good lawyer will be far, far, far lower than the cost of cleaning things up if you get it wrong.

pax

Hardcase · January 2, 2014, 02:00 PM

Thanks, Pax. I'm meeting an attorney tomorrow morning.

**Spats McGee** · January 2, 2014, 02:04 PM

pax has spoken wisely on all counts. We wish you the best of luck in this terribly difficult situation.

ClydeFrog · January 2, 2014, 06:03 PM

Not to pry or get to detailed, but do you legally own these firearms or possess them by court order/will/power-of-atty?
If the guns are in your possession(not custody which implies that you need to return them to the lawful owner by contract or court order).
If your family member is adjudicated as unstable or meets the legal criteria as someone determined not to be in possession of firearms/ammunition by court order/state law then you should be able to maintain ownership of them.

If this person is threatening you or keeps harassing you, Id consider a PFA(protection from abuse) or restraining order.
If & I mean if(due in part to not knowing both sides of the disputes/legal details) the family member is violent/making serious threats, you need to document these actions to show cause of why you want to keep the firearms.
From the information posted, it sounds like a serious domestic dispute. I'd find a legal advisor with family court/domestic law experience.
Depending on your area/laws/ordinances if the person has a PFA/protection order they may not be allowed to buy new firearms & ammunition.

Clyde

4runnerman · January 2, 2014, 06:27 PM

Much different sinerio for me,but I had to take the car away from my mom.
Now no comparison at all,but it was hard. I do believe I got called some new 4 letter names I have never heard before. My only condolence was that I was maybe saving her life and someone else too. In the end as I was told by the pastor of our Church- Put your faith in God. Just keep in mind you are saving someones life and it will pass, like mine did.

shortwave · January 2, 2014, 08:51 PM

Sorry for your times of trouble Hardcase.

Pax has advised you wisely.

Goodluck!

**Frank Ettin** · January 2, 2014, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClydeFrog

Not to pry or get to detailed, but do you legally own these firearms or possess them by court order/will/power-of-atty?
If the guns are in your possession(not custody which implies that you need to return them to the lawful owner by contract or court order)....

And no, we're not going to go there.

As pax has advised, this is not the place for the OP to (1) go into the details; or (2) get advice upon which he will rely.

The OP is doing the right thing by seeing an attorney. And we would be doing the wrong thing by intruding into that process.

I probably ought to close this, but I'll leave it open to see if anyone has anything appropriate/supportive to contribute. But if things start getting inappropriate or intrusive, I'll close it in a flash.

**Spats McGee** · January 2, 2014, 10:47 PM

To best avoid the temptation to travel any further down this road, . . . .

January 2, 2014, 12:24 PM	#1
Hardcase Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Location: Sunny Southern Idaho Posts: 1,909	Firearms and the Mentally Ill As part of an ongoing family drama that I would not believe if I hadn't experienced it myself, I've ended up with custody of my father in law's two rifles. I'm faced with the dilemma of what to do when he eventually demands to have them back. (Deleted a ton of stuff based on Pax's reply below) The distilled essence is that my father in law is suicidal and at the minimum verbally violent. I've got the guns - he wants them back. I have an obvious difficulty putting firearms in the hands of a suicidal and potentially violent person, particularly a family member. I guess that I'll be calling a lawyer today, but I appreciate your insight as well. __________________ Well we don't rent pigs and I figure it's better to say it right out front because a man that does like to rent pigs is... he's hard to stop - Gus McCrae Last edited by Hardcase; January 2, 2014 at 01:26 PM.

January 2, 2014, 12:43 PM	#2
pax Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2000 Location: In a state of flux Posts: 7,520	First -- I'm sorry your family is going through such tough times. That's really rough and you have my sympathy! Second -- that's way too much personal information to put out on the web. Sucks, but true anyway. Third -- there's nobody on TFL who can definitively answer a question like that; or rather, you should never ever gamble your freedom and your "not-a-criminal" status on the word of a casual online acquaintance. Not on something like this. You need a good lawyer who practices in your state to answer that question, and to advise you what to do next. If you're anything like me, you probably balk at the thought of spending money on something like that. Please trust the voice of experience here: The cost of a short consultation with a good lawyer will be far, far, far lower than the cost of cleaning things up if you get it wrong. pax __________________ Kathy Jackson My personal website: Cornered Cat

January 2, 2014, 02:00 PM	#3
Hardcase Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Location: Sunny Southern Idaho Posts: 1,909	Thanks, Pax. I'm meeting an attorney tomorrow morning. __________________ Well we don't rent pigs and I figure it's better to say it right out front because a man that does like to rent pigs is... he's hard to stop - Gus McCrae

January 2, 2014, 02:04 PM	#4
Spats McGee Staff Join Date: July 28, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 8,821	pax has spoken wisely on all counts. We wish you the best of luck in this terribly difficult situation. __________________ I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. If you need some honest-to-goodness legal advice, go buy some.

January 2, 2014, 06:03 PM	#5
ClydeFrog Junior member Join Date: May 1, 2010 Posts: 5,797	Details, legal issues.... Not to pry or get to detailed, but do you legally own these firearms or possess them by court order/will/power-of-atty? If the guns are in your possession(not custody which implies that you need to return them to the lawful owner by contract or court order). If your family member is adjudicated as unstable or meets the legal criteria as someone determined not to be in possession of firearms/ammunition by court order/state law then you should be able to maintain ownership of them. If this person is threatening you or keeps harassing you, Id consider a PFA(protection from abuse) or restraining order. If & I mean if(due in part to not knowing both sides of the disputes/legal details) the family member is violent/making serious threats, you need to document these actions to show cause of why you want to keep the firearms. From the information posted, it sounds like a serious domestic dispute. I'd find a legal advisor with family court/domestic law experience. Depending on your area/laws/ordinances if the person has a PFA/protection order they may not be allowed to buy new firearms & ammunition. Clyde

January 2, 2014, 06:27 PM	#6
4runnerman Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2010 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,577	Much different sinerio for me,but I had to take the car away from my mom. Now no comparison at all,but it was hard. I do believe I got called some new 4 letter names I have never heard before. My only condolence was that I was maybe saving her life and someone else too. In the end as I was told by the pastor of our Church- Put your faith in God. Just keep in mind you are saving someones life and it will pass, like mine did. __________________ NRA Certified RSO NwCP- Performance Isn't Optional

January 2, 2014, 08:51 PM	#7
shortwave Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 2007 Location: SOUTHEAST, OHIO Posts: 5,970	Sorry for your times of trouble Hardcase. Pax has advised you wisely. Goodluck!

January 2, 2014, 10:47 PM	#9
Spats McGee Staff Join Date: July 28, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 8,821	To best avoid the temptation to travel any further down this road, . . . . __________________ I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. If you need some honest-to-goodness legal advice, go buy some.