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View Poll Results: General Purpose Revolver, with personal defense in mind | |||
Taurus Raging Judge 6" (.454 Casull, .45 Col and .410 Gauge) | 6 | 9.52% | |
Taurus Raging Judge 3" | 1 | 1.59% | |
Smith and Wesson "The GOVERNOR" 3" (.45 Colt, .45 ACP, and .410 Gauge) | 16 | 25.40% | |
**Theoretical** Smith and Wesson "The GOVERNOR 6" | 4 | 6.35% | |
Other Large Frame Revolver 6" | 8 | 12.70% | |
Other Large Frame Revolver 3" | 28 | 44.44% | |
Voters: 63. You may not vote on this poll |
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November 3, 2013, 12:03 PM | #51 | |||
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Quote:
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If you're happy with your judge that's fine but there are better options.
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rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 Quote:
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November 3, 2013, 12:12 PM | #52 | |||
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^^^
Obviously you didn't watch both video reviews that disproved your negative comments. Quote:
Quote:
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November 3, 2013, 12:33 PM | #53 | |
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Go ahead and ignore the facts from the video.
30 to 40 FPS less velocity nearly 2" longer OAL and nearly twice the width. 5 rounds vs 6 and 5.5" at 25 yards is pathetic accuracy for a gun that size. Sheesh get a reality check I don't care how many times you say 5 is about the same as 6, 6>5
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rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6 Quote:
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November 3, 2013, 01:16 PM | #54 | |
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If memory serves me correctly I killed the squirrel with 6's. I was sitting on the deck and noticed the top of a corn stalk shaking. He had climbed halfway up a corn stalk and was preoccupied with an ear of my prize sweet corn letting me sneak to about 15ft away. Could have shot him from the deck with either the .22 or shotgun but I felt like practicing my 'ninja' tactics that day. He died valorously(for a corn thief) and I can only hope he thought his last meal was a good one. FWIW, The Winchester PDX-1 round sound like it might be a good round to try as well but I have no personal experience with it. Last edited by shortwave; November 3, 2013 at 01:47 PM. |
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November 3, 2013, 09:09 PM | #55 | ||
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Neither I or the reviewer have argued the Judge has the same capacity as the XDs. 25 yards is an unrealistic civilian SD distance for most except the internet educated mall ninja. Possible, but so unlikely as to be non existant. That was also covered in the reviews. Claim SD at 75 feet, and have a very good, and expensive, legal team ready. To your Judge hater's talking point about the size, as they say, "a picture is worth a thousand words". Here is a side by side, one on top of the opther comparison of my Judge Public Defender Poly, and my cold weather EDC Springfield XD40 Sub Compact. Admittedly a bit wider than the XDs in the review, but still quite concealable, and comfortable in a Theis IWB hybrid holster. And a Colt 1991a1 Compact I have, but don't use as a CCW weapon.
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Cheapshooter's rules of gun ownership #1: NEVER SELL OR TRADE ANYTHING! Last edited by Cheapshooter; November 3, 2013 at 09:19 PM. |
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November 3, 2013, 09:17 PM | #56 |
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As far as accuracy, here is an example of my personal results with Winchester PDX1 225 gr. HP.
Slow fire, off hand S/A @ 10 yards. Rapid fire off hand D/A @ 10 yards. Reality check? I think "reality" is plainly shown here.
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November 3, 2013, 11:02 PM | #57 |
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Cheapshooter
The accuracy with my Judge shooting 45 LC at 10-12yds pretty much mirrors yours as well. Slugs open up a bit more but are still center mass in the kill zone. |
November 4, 2013, 12:30 PM | #58 | ||
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"There are better choices for SD than a Judge", does not mean it might not work fine, just that a gun that was smaller and lighter that holds more rounds and is far mor accurate would be better.
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November 4, 2013, 03:04 PM | #59 | |
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No, the Judge PD Poly is not the ideal SD firearm. But it is certainly not the useless "gimmick" it is described as being by it's detractors. As stated in the video reviews it would not make the perfect CCW, but would be an excellent night stand gun for home defense. I have choices in my CCW EDC firearms from a warm weather grab and go LCP to a KAHR CM9 in a Theis IWB holster, or pocket carry to a Ruger LCR, and a Springer XD40 Subcompact. But my Poly fits the bill perfectly as an anti-carjacking devise riding between the seat, and console of my truck. 8 70 gr., 36 caliber projectiles @ over 800 fps point blank within less than two seconds is undeniably an attack stopping situation. Backed up by 3 rounds of 225 gr, 45 caliber hollow points. Do that with your "six shooter". Just saying.
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November 4, 2013, 03:14 PM | #60 |
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I believe the pictured revolver is a S&W J-frame, holds FIVE rounds, and the paper pretty clearly shows five shots, two of them having gone through the one hole in the bottom right corner of the group.
I'm not so sure that ONE person in an argument MUST be wrong every time. Sometimes I wonder if the participants agree?
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November 4, 2013, 03:18 PM | #61 |
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I put my take earlier in the thread, but here's another take that I have...
--I would rather carry probably a couple dozen or more different things for personal defense (any situation) than any Taurus Judge --I would rather carry a Taurus Judge for personal defense than no firearm, for sure --If coming to -ME- and asking for advice, I would tell anyone I care about to shop far & wide before settling on a Taurus Judge for defense, but at the same time, I will absolutely say and believe that: --if that person has a choice between a Taurus Judge and no firearm, I'm very happy that they've chosen to carry a Taurus Judge and I'm very, very, very happy that another "good guy" has chosen to go armed. If it's is your choice to carry a Taurus Judge for defense, I'm still very happy that you've chosen to arm yourself for defense, but you're wasting as much of my time trying to convince me that it's the best choice as I am of attempting to convince you that it isn't. In the end, one more good guy out there that is armed, and I'm VERY happy about that. It might also be that I don't like the car you drive or the color you chose to paint your house, but I'm not sure why my opinion on THAT matters. (until someone asks me for it...)
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November 4, 2013, 04:41 PM | #62 |
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Buying a Judge or Governor is a personal choice just like anything else. I say buy whatever you like and don't worry about the naysayers on the internet. If Springfield had came out with the Judge instead of Taurus, 3/4 of the BS on the internet would have never happened.
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November 4, 2013, 05:25 PM | #63 | ||
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Quote:
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November 4, 2013, 09:37 PM | #64 |
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read about it from somebody that has actually shot one
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November 5, 2013, 09:44 AM | #65 | |||
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How about I just keep my HK USP in my truck that way instead of 8 36 cal 70 gr projectiles I can send 8 45 cal 230gr golddots with 5 more for backup, just saying. Quote:
Or is the cold hard reality that the Judge's accuracy sucks requiring you to divert attention away by any means?
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November 5, 2013, 01:03 PM | #66 |
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First two rounds of 410 buckshot for very up close target. 45 Colt to back up the first two in case of an additional attacker at a farther distance. In the driver's seat pocket carry would be very difficult to deploy the gun. IWB holster almost as much. But the PD in a holster, nect to the seatbelt buckle is very easy to draw. Also, no moving my EDC from holster to holster entering, and leaving my truck. Just all more reasons that the Judge/Governor platform is a viable SD firearm, not just a gimmick.
I was just pointing out that you mentioned more round capacity, however the photo you posted still only showed 5 hits. That is if as pointed out two were in the same whole. My accuracy with my PD Poly is just that, my accuracy. The photo I posted was from the very first time I shot the gun. Also, although I didn't have a shot timer to give an accurate reading, the rapid fire group was just that. Pretty much point and shoot D/A as fast as I could pull the trigger 5 times. Again, I am not saying the 45/410 handgun is the perfect do all SD firearm. For CCW, my XD40 or CM9 are my choices. Along with my Elsie Pea as a BUG, or quick grab and go pocket carry. As a nightstand gun, the Springer, or KAHR are both good, but the Judge starts to have more viability. Of course my Remington 870 18" barreled, 7 shot 12 Ga. Is about as good as It gets for a "house gun". But then there is the roll of an anti carjacking truck gun. That's where for reasons I have pointed out the Judge Public Defender Poly really fits in. As a bonus, It also serves well as a snake protection sidearm. It does produce a very snake proof pattern to 10 to 15 feet with 7 1/2 shot. And just as 75 foot shots in self defense are nearly unheard of, and would most likely result in very expensive legal fees, a poisonous snake even at 10 feet isn't a threat.
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November 5, 2013, 01:18 PM | #67 | |
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November 5, 2013, 01:59 PM | #68 |
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The Public Defender's accuracy with 45 Colts is sufficient to keep all shots on the torso a 25 yards, provided you can shoot. 50 would be a little iffy but I could make do at that distance.
In the grand scheme of revolvers, it's not very accurate. Viewed in the context of short-barreled carry guns, it's not bad.
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November 5, 2013, 02:16 PM | #69 | ||||||
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Quote:
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November 5, 2013, 02:53 PM | #70 |
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You have an answer for everything obviously. I didn't say 5 seconds, or 6 or 7 because you would have doubted that as well. It's obvious that you are one of the closed minded "experts" that have no intention of ever giving the 45/410 platform it's due. Probably would be an entire different situation had S&W brought out the Governor first.
Anyway, you have your opinion, I have mine. I gave examples of what the 45/410 can do. Others may do better, others may do worse. I have no concerns about the "poor" accuracy of my Poly. 5 hits in however many seconds it took all in center mass is not an unacceptable level of accuracy for self defense. But this conversation has led away from the OP which was which one, Governor of Judge NOT is the 45/410 platform a viable self defense firearm. Judge: Smaller, and lighter variants available 45Colt/410/454 Casull (454 in larger "raging" model Lower cost Governor: 1 round more capacity ( at the expense of a bit more size) 45 Colt/410/45ACP S&W is to some a more trusted name. So each has it's own advantage. It depends on what you want it for. Personally my PD Poly works best for the intended purpose, and is also a lot of fun to just play with blowing up various targets.
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November 5, 2013, 06:05 PM | #71 |
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Maybe we could get our own WildBill45 to video his outstanding pistol shooting skills with the Judge/Gov. to see if even he can hit with one.
Would like to see him try his 100yd shots with one. FWIW, neither are target pistols. Neither were made to be. Neither claimed to be. Both are capable of shooting accurate enough with the right ammo at SD distance to do the job. |
November 5, 2013, 08:22 PM | #72 |
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I chose the Governor for several reasons. I prefer S&Ws to most other brands and after hearing horror stories from my son's friend I decided the Governor was a better choice for me. I have, however owned Taurus pistols in the past with no problems. YMMV. tom.
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November 6, 2013, 03:05 AM | #73 |
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I truly don't understand polls like this one and threads where the OP asks, "Which gun should I buy"? I have never seen or heard of a specific firearm that didn't have detractors, especially on the internet.
I do not in any way think I'm a firearm expert. There are people much more experienced than I that own many more firearms than me. I own 11 rifles. 7 handguns and 9 shotguns. Each one was purchased after research but I didn't ask for advise on a forum. I believe in buying what speaks to you and to hell what anyone else thinks. I don't believe in bashing other's firearm choices. I also don't believe in 500 yard shots at big game as so many internet posters allegedly do. These are my personal beliefs and would not try foist them on anyone(except my kids when I am paying for the firearm). When I was a kid in the 60's I just had to have a pair of PF Flyers "with the action wedge). My mother said they were a gimmick and bought my tennis shoes at Sears. PF Flyers are not around anymore and time will tell if the Governor, Judge and Raging Bull will last. I will never own one but won't bash anyone who does.
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November 6, 2013, 05:11 AM | #74 |
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I'd kind of like to own a judge.
Since it wouldn't be getting a lot of heavy use, I see to reason to spend more on the S&W. Plus, the light weight versions would be more pleasant to carry. It seems like it would - for me anyway - be a pretty perfect backup gun to carry hunting. A 30-30 does a number on small game, and a 6" 410 seems like it might have the range to pop any grouse unlucky enough to wander under my stand. Also, should the day come that I need a second shot to take a deer, the 45colt would be more than enough to fill that role. If I lived in snake country, it would have a third purpose. Also, if I ever again have to crawl under a barn to off a groundhog/raccoon it seems like it would be a pretty good tunnel gun. For CCW I'll stick to my XDs/G19/SP101, and for HD I'll stick to my 870/AR15/Wolfhounds
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November 6, 2013, 09:08 AM | #75 |
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsSiyt8XmOg
The above YouTube video shows me shooting the Governor with 6 .410 loads of 4 pellet 000 buckshot into a heart size group at 7 yards. This places 24 rounds on target in approximately 4 seconds. Other videos mentioned in this thread show the considerable penetration and power of these buckshot loads so anyone that thinks that human flesh is tougher than 3/4" plywood is not going to have their mind changed. I originally bought a Judge but sold it to get the Governor's extra round capacity and S&W fit and action. Mark |
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