Boxer, Berdan

stanmanplan · August 1, 1999, 10:02 PM

I don't reload and am kind of new so be gentle please. What are Boxer and/or Berdan primers. I've heard that one or the other is corrosive.

------------------
Thanks,

Stan

Grayfox · August 1, 1999, 10:35 PM

First thing is to explain primer parts. You have the cup, priming mixture and the anvil.
The cup is the part you see in the base of the cartridge, exactly what the name implies. Inside the cup is the priming mixture or compound. Thats the stuff that goes bang when you hit it. The anvil is a small bump or teat that the cup is crushed against when the firing pin strikes it and causes the mixture to ignite.
In the Boxer system, all three parts are contained it one unit. If you turn one over you can see how its made. The cartridge case has one flash hole centered in the primer pocket.
In the Berdan system, the anvil is part of the cartridge case and is centered in the primer pocket with two flash holes, one on either side.
Virtually all American made ammo uses the Boxer system.
The Berdan system is found in foreign, originally British, made stuff. Although this is changing.
Boxer primed ammo is readily reloadable with no problems. While Berdan primed ammo can be reloaded, it's such a time consuming major pain in the butt that the vast majority of shooters consider it unreloadable.
Interestingly enough, Boxer, the man who designed that priming system was an Englishman. While Berdan, whose system found favor in England, was an American.

As for corrosive primers. The original priming compound for primers was Fulminate of Mercury and it was found to be very corrosive. Guns hade to be cleaned shortly after shooting to prevent ruining the barrel.
Now a days, these corrosive primers are pretty much gone. However you can still run into them occasionally especially with older foreign military surlpus ammo.

There ya go. Everything you always wanted to know about primers.

**Mal H** · August 1, 1999, 10:37 PM

Stan - The difference between boxer and berdan primers is in their construction. Either type can have corrosive or non-corrosive chemicals, although non-corrosive primers of both types has been standard for several decades. Boxer primers have a built-in anvil whereas berdan primers have the anvil integral to the cartridge case. The most common primer you will probably encounter in the US is the boxer type, it is used in most of the modern cartridges. The berdan primer is a little more common in Europe and in military type cartridges. The two types are not interchangeable and berdan primed cartridges, in general, cannot be reloaded.

Now for the irony, the boxer primer was invented by an Englishman, Col. Edward Boxer. And the berdan primer was invented by an American, Col. Hiram Berdan.

**Mal H** · August 1, 1999, 10:39 PM

Wow, Grayfox! Deja vu! (I've got to start typing faster...)

Grayfox · August 1, 1999, 10:50 PM

Mal H,
I guess it's true that great minds think alike.

stanmanplan · August 2, 1999, 10:49 AM

Thank you for the info.
Stan

James K · August 2, 1999, 05:13 PM

Hi Grayfox and Stan,

Good job Grayfox, but just a minor comment. True corrosive primers contain potassium chlorate; on firing, this becomes potassium chloride, which is similar to, but more active than, common table salt (sodium chloride). The potassium chloride rusts the barrel of the gun; if not cleaned immediately, it will completely ruin the barrel.

Fulminate of mercury was an early substitute for potassium chlorate, but when fired it releases free mercury, which amalgamates with the brass in the cartridge case and makes it brittle. Fulminate of mercury primers are no problem unless the cases are to be reloaded, and it has not been used for 70 years.

The military, here and elsewhere, kept using corrosive primers (with exceptions - the .30 carbine was non-corrosive from day one) during WWII because they were concerned that the newer primers might not be stable in tropical climates.

As Grayfox said, most modern commercial primers are non-corrosive and non-mercuric. But vendors of military surplus ammunition that is corrosive will often obscure that fact in advertising by using terms like shiny, clean, not corroded, sealed, non-mercuric, etc. If they don't say non-corrosive, it probably is corrosive. The outside of the ammo may be shiny and clean, but your rifle barrel may not be after shooting it.

Jim

August 1, 1999, 10:02 PM	#1
stanmanplan Member Join Date: July 15, 1999 Posts: 28	I don't reload and am kind of new so be gentle please. What are Boxer and/or Berdan primers. I've heard that one or the other is corrosive. ------------------ Thanks, Stan

August 1, 1999, 10:35 PM	#2
Grayfox Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 1998 Posts: 1,885	First thing is to explain primer parts. You have the cup, priming mixture and the anvil. The cup is the part you see in the base of the cartridge, exactly what the name implies. Inside the cup is the priming mixture or compound. Thats the stuff that goes bang when you hit it. The anvil is a small bump or teat that the cup is crushed against when the firing pin strikes it and causes the mixture to ignite. In the Boxer system, all three parts are contained it one unit. If you turn one over you can see how its made. The cartridge case has one flash hole centered in the primer pocket. In the Berdan system, the anvil is part of the cartridge case and is centered in the primer pocket with two flash holes, one on either side. Virtually all American made ammo uses the Boxer system. The Berdan system is found in foreign, originally British, made stuff. Although this is changing. Boxer primed ammo is readily reloadable with no problems. While Berdan primed ammo can be reloaded, it's such a time consuming major pain in the butt that the vast majority of shooters consider it unreloadable. Interestingly enough, Boxer, the man who designed that priming system was an Englishman. While Berdan, whose system found favor in England, was an American. As for corrosive primers. The original priming compound for primers was Fulminate of Mercury and it was found to be very corrosive. Guns hade to be cleaned shortly after shooting to prevent ruining the barrel. Now a days, these corrosive primers are pretty much gone. However you can still run into them occasionally especially with older foreign military surlpus ammo. There ya go. Everything you always wanted to know about primers.

August 1, 1999, 10:37 PM	#3
Mal H Staff Join Date: March 20, 1999 Location: Somewhere in the woods of Northern Virginia Posts: 16,949	Stan - The difference between boxer and berdan primers is in their construction. Either type can have corrosive or non-corrosive chemicals, although non-corrosive primers of both types has been standard for several decades. Boxer primers have a built-in anvil whereas berdan primers have the anvil integral to the cartridge case. The most common primer you will probably encounter in the US is the boxer type, it is used in most of the modern cartridges. The berdan primer is a little more common in Europe and in military type cartridges. The two types are not interchangeable and berdan primed cartridges, in general, cannot be reloaded. Now for the irony, the boxer primer was invented by an Englishman, Col. Edward Boxer. And the berdan primer was invented by an American, Col. Hiram Berdan.

August 1, 1999, 10:39 PM	#4
Mal H Staff Join Date: March 20, 1999 Location: Somewhere in the woods of Northern Virginia Posts: 16,949	Wow, Grayfox! Deja vu! (I've got to start typing faster...)

August 1, 1999, 10:50 PM	#5
Grayfox Senior Member Join Date: December 17, 1998 Posts: 1,885	Mal H, I guess it's true that great minds think alike.

August 2, 1999, 10:49 AM	#6
stanmanplan Member Join Date: July 15, 1999 Posts: 28	Thank you for the info. Stan

August 2, 1999, 05:13 PM	#7
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Hi Grayfox and Stan, Good job Grayfox, but just a minor comment. True corrosive primers contain potassium chlorate; on firing, this becomes potassium chloride, which is similar to, but more active than, common table salt (sodium chloride). The potassium chloride rusts the barrel of the gun; if not cleaned immediately, it will completely ruin the barrel. Fulminate of mercury was an early substitute for potassium chlorate, but when fired it releases free mercury, which amalgamates with the brass in the cartridge case and makes it brittle. Fulminate of mercury primers are no problem unless the cases are to be reloaded, and it has not been used for 70 years. The military, here and elsewhere, kept using corrosive primers (with exceptions - the .30 carbine was non-corrosive from day one) during WWII because they were concerned that the newer primers might not be stable in tropical climates. As Grayfox said, most modern commercial primers are non-corrosive and non-mercuric. But vendors of military surplus ammunition that is corrosive will often obscure that fact in advertising by using terms like shiny, clean, not corroded, sealed, non-mercuric, etc. If they don't say non-corrosive, it probably is corrosive. The outside of the ammo may be shiny and clean, but your rifle barrel may not be after shooting it. Jim