Expanded gun rights...FAILS in Senate vote.

9mm1033 · July 23, 2009, 06:56 AM

Measure to Expand Gun Rights Falls Short in Senate

By BERNIE BECKER and DAVID M. HERSZENHORN
WASHINGTON — The Senate on Wednesday turned aside the latest attempt by gun advocates to expand the rights of gun owners, narrowly voting down a provision that would have allowed gun owners with valid permits from one state to carry concealed weapons in other states.
A group comprising mostly Republicans, along with some influential Democrats, had tried to attach the gun amendment to the annual defense authorization bill, a must-pass piece of legislation.
But the provision got only 58 votes, two short of the 6o votes needed for passage under Senate rules.
Two Republicans, Senators Richard G. Lugar of Indiana and George V. Voinovich of Ohio, joined with 37 Democrats to reject the amendment, which was bitterly opposed by a number of big-city mayors, including Michael R. Bloomberg of New York.
“Lives have been saved with the defeat of this amendment,” Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York, a leading opponent of the amendment, said in a statement.
“The passage of this amendment would have done more to threaten the safety of New Yorkers than anything since the repeal of the assault weapons ban.”
The provision was pushed by Senator John Thune, Republican of South Dakota, but was co-sponsored by several Democrats from states where gun rights are broadly supported, like Montana, where Senators Max Baucus and Jon Tester both favored it.
Senator Harry Reid of Nevada, the majority leader, who is up for re-election in 2010, also supported the amendment.
Going into Wednesday’s vote, gun rights supporters seemed to have the momentum in the Senate, with a group of Democrats looking to block the amendment but acknowledging the vote would be close. Under a parliamentary agreement, proponents needed 60 votes for passage.
This was the latest attempt by gun advocates to push for new firearms rights through Congress, where they hold increasing sway.
In May, Congress approved a measure that allowed gun owners with proper permits to carry their loaded and concealed weapons in national parks. And Mr. Thune, Senator Tom Coburn, Republican of Oklahoma, and other pro-gun lawmakers had said they intended to bring many provisions seeking to expand gun rights to the Senate floor this year.
The amendment would have let a gun owner carrying a valid permit from a state that allows concealed weapons to take guns into other states that allow concealed weapons, without a separate permit, as long as local gun control restrictions were obeyed.
After the vote, Mr. Thune signaled his disappointment. “Today, overheated rhetoric and fear mongering overcame common sense,” he said.
“My amendment would allow responsible firearms owners to protect themselves while obeying the firearms laws of the states they visit. The individual right to self-defense should not end at the state line.”
The gun provision prompted impassioned debate on the Senate floor from both sides before the vote.
Senator Kirsten Gillibrand, Democrat of New York, generally a supporter of gun rights, said she had opposed Mr. Thune’s amendment because it infringed on states and cities. “The Thune amendment would invite chaos in our cities,” she said.
Senators Robert Menendez of New Jersey and Dianne Feinstein of California, both Democrats, as well as Mr. Schumer, also railed against the amendment.
Senator David Vitter, Republican of Louisiana, countered that the provision would not undermine state and local laws. And he quoted a letter from a constituent who said she felt safer carrying her concealed weapon when she went out at night with her family.
“Specific state laws must be followed by the visiting individual,” Mr. Vitter said.
Mr. Vitter dismissed assertions that the provision would aid criminals. “At the end of the day, this is really again a fundamental debate in terms of what is the problem in terms of violent crime,” he said.
“Is the problem law-abiding citizens who follow the law and take all the time and all the trouble needed to get conceal-and-carry permits?”
Or, he said, is the problem criminals who violate all laws to obtain weapons.

Al Norris · July 23, 2009, 08:23 AM

Cut-n-paste drive-by post.

Duplicate of this thread.

Closed.

July 23, 2009, 06:56 AM	#1
9mm1033 Senior Member Join Date: April 18, 2005 Location: A big city with far too many cars and people. Posts: 932	Expanded gun rights...FAILS in Senate vote. Measure to Expand Gun Rights Falls Short in Senate By BERNIE BECKER and DAVID M. HERSZENHORN WASHINGTON — The Senate on Wednesday turned aside the latest attempt by gun advocates to expand the rights of gun owners, narrowly voting down a provision that would have allowed gun owners with valid permits from one state to carry concealed weapons in other states. A group comprising mostly Republicans, along with some influential Democrats, had tried to attach the gun amendment to the annual defense authorization bill, a must-pass piece of legislation. But the provision got only 58 votes, two short of the 6o votes needed for passage under Senate rules. Two Republicans, Senators Richard G. Lugar of Indiana and George V. Voinovich of Ohio, joined with 37 Democrats to reject the amendment, which was bitterly opposed by a number of big-city mayors, including Michael R. Bloomberg of New York. “Lives have been saved with the defeat of this amendment,” Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York, a leading opponent of the amendment, said in a statement. “The passage of this amendment would have done more to threaten the safety of New Yorkers than anything since the repeal of the assault weapons ban.” The provision was pushed by Senator John Thune, Republican of South Dakota, but was co-sponsored by several Democrats from states where gun rights are broadly supported, like Montana, where Senators Max Baucus and Jon Tester both favored it. Senator Harry Reid of Nevada, the majority leader, who is up for re-election in 2010, also supported the amendment. Going into Wednesday’s vote, gun rights supporters seemed to have the momentum in the Senate, with a group of Democrats looking to block the amendment but acknowledging the vote would be close. Under a parliamentary agreement, proponents needed 60 votes for passage. This was the latest attempt by gun advocates to push for new firearms rights through Congress, where they hold increasing sway. In May, Congress approved a measure that allowed gun owners with proper permits to carry their loaded and concealed weapons in national parks. And Mr. Thune, Senator Tom Coburn, Republican of Oklahoma, and other pro-gun lawmakers had said they intended to bring many provisions seeking to expand gun rights to the Senate floor this year. The amendment would have let a gun owner carrying a valid permit from a state that allows concealed weapons to take guns into other states that allow concealed weapons, without a separate permit, as long as local gun control restrictions were obeyed. After the vote, Mr. Thune signaled his disappointment. “Today, overheated rhetoric and fear mongering overcame common sense,” he said. “My amendment would allow responsible firearms owners to protect themselves while obeying the firearms laws of the states they visit. The individual right to self-defense should not end at the state line.” The gun provision prompted impassioned debate on the Senate floor from both sides before the vote. Senator Kirsten Gillibrand, Democrat of New York, generally a supporter of gun rights, said she had opposed Mr. Thune’s amendment because it infringed on states and cities. “The Thune amendment would invite chaos in our cities,” she said. Senators Robert Menendez of New Jersey and Dianne Feinstein of California, both Democrats, as well as Mr. Schumer, also railed against the amendment. Senator David Vitter, Republican of Louisiana, countered that the provision would not undermine state and local laws. And he quoted a letter from a constituent who said she felt safer carrying her concealed weapon when she went out at night with her family. “Specific state laws must be followed by the visiting individual,” Mr. Vitter said. Mr. Vitter dismissed assertions that the provision would aid criminals. “At the end of the day, this is really again a fundamental debate in terms of what is the problem in terms of violent crime,” he said. “Is the problem law-abiding citizens who follow the law and take all the time and all the trouble needed to get conceal-and-carry permits?” Or, he said, is the problem criminals who violate all laws to obtain weapons. __________________ No one reads or cares what is written in ones signature box. So I'm not writing anything worth reading or remembering.

July 23, 2009, 08:23 AM	#2
Al Norris Moderator Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2000 Location: Rupert, Idaho Posts: 9,660	Cut-n-paste drive-by post. Duplicate of this thread. Closed.