Which brand neck sizing die?

atek3 · December 1, 2002, 09:38 PM

I've been accumulating a lot of once fired 223 brass for my bolt gun. I have a dillon 550B and standard reloading is fine, but for super accurate rounds I'd like to try neck sizing only. Can someone give some suggestions on what dies to buy? I've seen benchresters using redding bushing dies. I've heard good things about Lee collet dies. Can anyone help me make a decision?
Brent

Dave P · December 2, 2002, 10:05 AM

Try the collet die first. It is cheap, and results in minimal runout (1-2 mil) of the brass.

Also consider a precision seater (redding, wilson, etc).

Of course you may also want a concentricity checker to measure the finished rounds ... the price of accuracy never ends!

atek3 · December 3, 2002, 09:51 PM

why get a cheap neck sizer and an expensive seater. are expensive neck sizers not worth all the extra money?

Khornet · December 4, 2002, 06:23 AM

Sinclair. They offer neat Wilson hand dies. The neck sizer uses a bushing which can be had in various diameters to size the neck just right for your brass, bullet, and chamber. You hold this die in your hand and tap the case into it with a plastic or rawhide mallet, and once it's driven all the way in and sized, you turn it around and whack the end of the decapping rod to decap and eject the case. Very easy on the brass. Slow but pleasant work, produces superb accuracy. I do it for my .30-'06 bolt rifle; I suppose that for an autoloader it might be less practical.

Lee collet neck dies have also produced excellent accuracy for me. The are cheaper than WIlson hand dies, but they do a good job.

Dave P · December 4, 2002, 09:19 AM

why get a cheap neck sizer and an expensive seater. are expensive neck sizers not worth all the extra money?

The Lee die produces high quality, concentric cases for much less money and work than most bushing dies. Esp if you have a factory (not tight necked) chamber.

I could not get a redding bushing neck die to work well with my 308 factory chamber. But the Lee does. Also, Hornady New Dimension full length dies results in nice, concentric cases.

An expensive seater will normally keep the bullet going straight into your straight cases. Cheaper ones do not guide the bullet well and/or do not hold the case tightly during the process.

TallPine · December 4, 2002, 10:13 AM

Can I jump in here and ask a related question?

The Lee Catalog says that their collet neck-sizing die is not recommended for lever and slide action guns ...

Why is this?

I want to reload 30-30 for mild plinking (cowboy) loads. Why shouldn't I get a Lee collet sizer for this purpose?

Thanks, in advance.

sundog · December 4, 2002, 10:33 AM

TallPine, you CAN neck size for lever and slide actions. However, at some point you may have to bump the shoulder back or perform some other adjustment to the case for it to work reliably in THAT firearm. Levers and slides inherently do not deliver the camming action that a bolt can, so keeping the brass to some predetermined tolerance is what makes it function (action lock up) reliably and this is normally done with FL or partial FL sizing. With observation and practice a good handloader can, if he chooses, neck size for lever and slides. As far as your example, for cowboy shooting, I would not consider neck sizing as many of the stages require rapid fire shooting and the action MUST positively lock up without binding. For the long range single shot events, it may be worthwhile. sundog

TallPine · December 4, 2002, 11:13 AM

Thanks, Sundog

Actually, all I want to do for right now is make up some low cost, low power reloads for plinking - not competition. The 30-30 is just so much fun to shoot, but I am a true Scot when it comes to ammo. The only thing I have reloaded so far is straight walled handgun ammo, and I wanted to keep it simple. When I referred to "cowboy" I meant similar to the lower powered rounds that I have store bought.

The best thing I could do is get a 357 or 45 colt lever action, but besides having to decide between the two calibers, I figured it was cheaper to get a set of dies and some hard cast bullets for 30-30 than to buy another rifle.

Sounds like maybe if I only reloaded the factory "cowboy" rounds and my own reloads, that the shoulders of the brass would probably not be stretched out ...? Otherwise, maybe get a FL die also and FL size every fourth or fifth reload?

moredes · December 4, 2002, 11:20 AM

Send 3 empty cases to RCBS. Have them make you a custom neck-sizing die for each rifle's cases. It costs about $25 as I recall. Yeah, it's more expensive than off the rack, but it's affordable enough; they're not even close to the expense of a competition seating die.

Bogie · December 4, 2002, 11:47 AM

Guys, the reason to use the Lee collet die over the more expensive Redding, etc., is that your brass probably isn't perfect. Unless you're going to turn your necks, you'll still have problems when using a bushing die, etc.

My factory bolt rifles have Lee collet dies. My AR has an RCBS whatever it is that limits the growth die... My 6PPC die is a custom from Harrell, and my .22PPC is a modified Redding. My 6BR is a stock Redding. I turn the necks on the last three.

Burgie · December 6, 2002, 11:35 AM

Hi it sure would be cheaper to buy a fl die set then to buy another rifle. I reload for my Marlin 336 in 30-30 and just partial size the brass. I found my load in the Alliant free load book. 150grain cast gas check and 15 grains of Alliant #2400. Fun to shoot and you can shoot it all day. Have fun reloading......Burgie

cheygriz · December 6, 2002, 04:30 PM

Just buy a Redding, and be done with it for life!

Redding equipment is a bit pricey, but worth every penny. You're buying something that will last a lifetime. Why not get the best?

Timothy · December 6, 2002, 09:18 PM

I agree with cheygriz. Get yourself a Redding competition set with the interchangeable correct bushing. You will also get the precision seater with micrometer adjustment. The bullet is aligned perfectly before the actual seating takes place. Concentricity is very impressive.
Good source for price. Bruno Shooters Supply

December 1, 2002, 09:38 PM	#1
atek3 Member Join Date: December 1, 2002 Posts: 38	Which brand neck sizing die? I've been accumulating a lot of once fired 223 brass for my bolt gun. I have a dillon 550B and standard reloading is fine, but for super accurate rounds I'd like to try neck sizing only. Can someone give some suggestions on what dies to buy? I've seen benchresters using redding bushing dies. I've heard good things about Lee collet dies. Can anyone help me make a decision? Brent

December 4, 2002, 06:23 AM	#4
Khornet Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2001 Location: NH Posts: 585	Check out Sinclair. They offer neat Wilson hand dies. The neck sizer uses a bushing which can be had in various diameters to size the neck just right for your brass, bullet, and chamber. You hold this die in your hand and tap the case into it with a plastic or rawhide mallet, and once it's driven all the way in and sized, you turn it around and whack the end of the decapping rod to decap and eject the case. Very easy on the brass. Slow but pleasant work, produces superb accuracy. I do it for my .30-'06 bolt rifle; I suppose that for an autoloader it might be less practical. Lee collet neck dies have also produced excellent accuracy for me. The are cheaper than WIlson hand dies, but they do a good job. __________________ The M1 does MY talking!

December 4, 2002, 10:13 AM	#6
TallPine Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2002 Location: Montana Posts: 528	Can I jump in here and ask a related question? The Lee Catalog says that their collet neck-sizing die is not recommended for lever and slide action guns ... Why is this? I want to reload 30-30 for mild plinking (cowboy) loads. Why shouldn't I get a Lee collet sizer for this purpose? Thanks, in advance. __________________ "The inherent right in the people to reform their government, I do not deny; and they have another right, and that is to resist unconstitutional laws without overturning the government." --Daniel Webster

December 4, 2002, 10:33 AM	#7
sundog Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 1999 Location: Green Country, OK Posts: 782	TallPine, you CAN neck size for lever and slide actions. However, at some point you may have to bump the shoulder back or perform some other adjustment to the case for it to work reliably in THAT firearm. Levers and slides inherently do not deliver the camming action that a bolt can, so keeping the brass to some predetermined tolerance is what makes it function (action lock up) reliably and this is normally done with FL or partial FL sizing. With observation and practice a good handloader can, if he chooses, neck size for lever and slides. As far as your example, for cowboy shooting, I would not consider neck sizing as many of the stages require rapid fire shooting and the action MUST positively lock up without binding. For the long range single shot events, it may be worthwhile. sundog __________________ safety first

December 4, 2002, 11:13 AM	#8
TallPine Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2002 Location: Montana Posts: 528	Thanks, Sundog Actually, all I want to do for right now is make up some low cost, low power reloads for plinking - not competition. The 30-30 is just so much fun to shoot, but I am a true Scot when it comes to ammo. The only thing I have reloaded so far is straight walled handgun ammo, and I wanted to keep it simple. When I referred to "cowboy" I meant similar to the lower powered rounds that I have store bought. The best thing I could do is get a 357 or 45 colt lever action, but besides having to decide between the two calibers, I figured it was cheaper to get a set of dies and some hard cast bullets for 30-30 than to buy another rifle. Sounds like maybe if I only reloaded the factory "cowboy" rounds and my own reloads, that the shoulders of the brass would probably not be stretched out ...? Otherwise, maybe get a FL die also and FL size every fourth or fifth reload? __________________ "The inherent right in the people to reform their government, I do not deny; and they have another right, and that is to resist unconstitutional laws without overturning the government." --Daniel Webster

December 2, 2002, 10:05 AM	#2
Dave P Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 1999 Location: North Florida Posts: 1,346	Try the collet die first. It is cheap, and results in minimal runout (1-2 mil) of the brass. Also consider a precision seater (redding, wilson, etc). Of course you may also want a concentricity checker to measure the finished rounds ... the price of accuracy never ends!

December 3, 2002, 09:51 PM	#3
atek3 Member Join Date: December 1, 2002 Posts: 38	why get a cheap neck sizer and an expensive seater. are expensive neck sizers not worth all the extra money?

December 4, 2002, 09:19 AM	#5
Dave P Senior Member Join Date: August 16, 1999 Location: North Florida Posts: 1,346	why get a cheap neck sizer and an expensive seater. are expensive neck sizers not worth all the extra money? The Lee die produces high quality, concentric cases for much less money and work than most bushing dies. Esp if you have a factory (not tight necked) chamber. I could not get a redding bushing neck die to work well with my 308 factory chamber. But the Lee does. Also, Hornady New Dimension full length dies results in nice, concentric cases. An expensive seater will normally keep the bullet going straight into your straight cases. Cheaper ones do not guide the bullet well and/or do not hold the case tightly during the process.

December 4, 2002, 11:20 AM	#9
moredes Senior Member Join Date: September 7, 2001 Posts: 325	custom neck-sizing die Send 3 empty cases to RCBS. Have them make you a custom neck-sizing die for each rifle's cases. It costs about $25 as I recall. Yeah, it's more expensive than off the rack, but it's affordable enough; they're not even close to the expense of a competition seating die.

December 4, 2002, 11:47 AM	#10
Bogie Senior Member Join Date: June 5, 2000 Location: Job hunting on the road... Posts: 3,827	Guys, the reason to use the Lee collet die over the more expensive Redding, etc., is that your brass probably isn't perfect. Unless you're going to turn your necks, you'll still have problems when using a bushing die, etc. My factory bolt rifles have Lee collet dies. My AR has an RCBS whatever it is that limits the growth die... My 6PPC die is a custom from Harrell, and my .22PPC is a modified Redding. My 6BR is a stock Redding. I turn the necks on the last three. __________________ Job hunting, but helping a friend out at www.vikingmachineusa.com - and learning the finer aspects of becoming a precision machinist. And making the world's greatest bottle openers!

December 6, 2002, 11:35 AM	#11
Burgie Junior Member Join Date: November 19, 2002 Location: usa Posts: 2	For Tall Pine Hi it sure would be cheaper to buy a fl die set then to buy another rifle. I reload for my Marlin 336 in 30-30 and just partial size the brass. I found my load in the Alliant free load book. 150grain cast gas check and 15 grains of Alliant #2400. Fun to shoot and you can shoot it all day. Have fun reloading......Burgie

December 6, 2002, 04:30 PM	#12
cheygriz Senior Member Join Date: May 11, 2002 Location: high up in the rockies Posts: 2,289	Just buy a Redding, and be done with it for life! Redding equipment is a bit pricey, but worth every penny. You're buying something that will last a lifetime. Why not get the best? __________________ If you think a mighty military force is expensive, wait 'til you see what a weak one costs.

December 6, 2002, 09:18 PM	#13
Timothy Member Join Date: November 26, 2000 Posts: 97	I agree with cheygriz. Get yourself a Redding competition set with the interchangeable correct bushing. You will also get the precision seater with micrometer adjustment. The bullet is aligned perfectly before the actual seating takes place. Concentricity is very impressive. Good source for price. Bruno Shooters Supply __________________ "There ain't no use runnin' if you're on the wrong road."