30 Rem

jpm63 · August 1, 2001, 11:00 AM

I was given an old Remington pump action hunting rifle. The Caliber indicated is 30 Remington. Is this an old name for a current cartridge (30/30 Win) or do I have an obsolete cartridge and will have to handload for it? I have not even found a set of dies which indicate this caliber.

This is a nice old gun and I'd like to try it out.

JPM

**Mike Irwin** · August 1, 2001, 12:49 PM

You have a semi-obsolete cartridge, but one that is REALLY easy to deal with.

To the best of my knowledge, no one loads this cartridge anymore, but ammo is still widely available. I routinely see boxes at gunshows.

Essentially it is a rimless .30-30 Winchester. Loading data, and even loading dies, for the .30-30 can be used, although dies should be available from any of the major manufacturers.

Cases are still readily avaiable from a number of sources, as well.

Johnny Guest · August 4, 2001, 02:49 PM

My old Speer Manual Number 8 illustrates the two cartridges on adjacent pages and says to use loading data for one in the other interchangeably. Same bullets, powders, primers, and charges. No problem. Both this book and Barnes's Cartridges of the World have good dimensional drawings of both cartridges.

As to dies--The two cases are nearly identical, except for the rim, of course. Main difference is the shoulder angle: The .30-30 shows to have a 15-degree 39 minute angle, while the .30 Remington uses a 23-degree angle. At first glance, I'd say you could load the .30 Rem on .30-30 dies, and just figure the cases formed to the shallower .30-30 shoulder angle would chamber properly and simply fire-form to the Rem angle.

Mo only real concern is that the base-to-forward end of shoulder distance (that is, to the base of the neck) is 1.613 on the .30-30, and 1.574 for the .30 Rem. This COULD give a little trouble chambering the reloaded cartridges in the .30 Rem rifle.

I have exactly ZERO experience loading ammo for pump action rifles. I don't know if there is sufficient force there to chamber a round which is just slightly oversize in this dimension. If you were using an autoloader, I'd be dubious that it'd work. If using a bolt action, I'd have no concern. But lever and pump actions fall somewhere in between.

A cursory search shows that the .30 Rem head size is considerably smaller than most similar-size cases. Please don't try using a .308/.30-06/etc shell holder, or you'll end up with a case stuck in the die. You might try the ,38 Special shell holder, but this, too, appears a touch large. You'll probably have to order the shell holder from a die manufacturer, unless you just luck onto one at a gun show.

Anyway, what I'd do if 'twere me, is obtain a proper shell holder, and then load a couple of rounds on .30-30 dies. You may know someone with a set. Or you can probably buy a used set very reasonably, because they are quite common. I'd try to make these work, because the purchase price of new obsolete-cartridge loading dies is usually pretty expensive.

If you simply want to try out the old rifle, finding a box of ammo at a gun show may be your best bet. There's a web site for Old Western Scrounger, a company specializing in hard-to-find ammo,

http://www.ows-ammunition.com/cgi-bi...ts?7UHBvWMV;;3

but their stuff is fairly dear. ($29.95 for a box of 20 rounds of .30 Rem, 170 gr. bullets.)

Hope you can work out something to make the old rifle bark again!

Best regards,
Johnny

August 1, 2001, 11:00 AM	#1
jpm63 Member Join Date: March 26, 2001 Location: Michigan Posts: 75	30 Rem I was given an old Remington pump action hunting rifle. The Caliber indicated is 30 Remington. Is this an old name for a current cartridge (30/30 Win) or do I have an obsolete cartridge and will have to handload for it? I have not even found a set of dies which indicate this caliber. This is a nice old gun and I'd like to try it out. JPM

August 1, 2001, 12:49 PM	#2
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,383	You have a semi-obsolete cartridge, but one that is REALLY easy to deal with. To the best of my knowledge, no one loads this cartridge anymore, but ammo is still widely available. I routinely see boxes at gunshows. Essentially it is a rimless .30-30 Winchester. Loading data, and even loading dies, for the .30-30 can be used, although dies should be available from any of the major manufacturers. Cases are still readily avaiable from a number of sources, as well. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

August 4, 2001, 02:49 PM	#3
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	.30 Rem in .30-30 dies My old Speer Manual Number 8 illustrates the two cartridges on adjacent pages and says to use loading data for one in the other interchangeably. Same bullets, powders, primers, and charges. No problem. Both this book and Barnes's Cartridges of the World have good dimensional drawings of both cartridges. As to dies--The two cases are nearly identical, except for the rim, of course. Main difference is the shoulder angle: The .30-30 shows to have a 15-degree 39 minute angle, while the .30 Remington uses a 23-degree angle. At first glance, I'd say you could load the .30 Rem on .30-30 dies, and just figure the cases formed to the shallower .30-30 shoulder angle would chamber properly and simply fire-form to the Rem angle. Mo only real concern is that the base-to-forward end of shoulder distance (that is, to the base of the neck) is 1.613 on the .30-30, and 1.574 for the .30 Rem. This COULD give a little trouble chambering the reloaded cartridges in the .30 Rem rifle. I have exactly ZERO experience loading ammo for pump action rifles. I don't know if there is sufficient force there to chamber a round which is just slightly oversize in this dimension. If you were using an autoloader, I'd be dubious that it'd work. If using a bolt action, I'd have no concern. But lever and pump actions fall somewhere in between. A cursory search shows that the .30 Rem head size is considerably smaller than most similar-size cases. Please don't try using a .308/.30-06/etc shell holder, or you'll end up with a case stuck in the die. You might try the ,38 Special shell holder, but this, too, appears a touch large. You'll probably have to order the shell holder from a die manufacturer, unless you just luck onto one at a gun show. Anyway, what I'd do if 'twere me, is obtain a proper shell holder, and then load a couple of rounds on .30-30 dies. You may know someone with a set. Or you can probably buy a used set very reasonably, because they are quite common. I'd try to make these work, because the purchase price of new obsolete-cartridge loading dies is usually pretty expensive. If you simply want to try out the old rifle, finding a box of ammo at a gun show may be your best bet. There's a web site for Old Western Scrounger, a company specializing in hard-to-find ammo, http://www.ows-ammunition.com/cgi-bi...ts?7UHBvWMV;;3 but their stuff is fairly dear. ($29.95 for a box of 20 rounds of .30 Rem, 170 gr. bullets.) Hope you can work out something to make the old rifle bark again! Best regards, Johnny