Bad Gunsmith! Bad!

bullseyekp · December 28, 2000, 03:23 PM

I received a set of Williams Fire Sights for my Ruger P95 for Christmas and took them to the gunsmith at the largest indoor range in Oklahoma thinking that their reputation would guarantee a good job. Well, I dropped the gun off yesterday and picked it up today. Of course the first thing I do is check out how well the sight picture looks; amazing! Further inspection reveals that the front sight is not sitting flush against the slide. It is perfectly level instead of sloping downward as it should. There is a gap about 1/16 of an inch between the sight and the slide.

So I asked the smith about it and he said that sometimes it just doesn't fit. What the he$$ kind of an answer is that?

All he needed to do was file the bottom of the sight until it fit flush into the slide. I went ahead and paid the $15 and left so I could make it to work on time. Now, I've got to order a new front sight ($20) and then I have to pay someone competent enough to do the job correctly. How ridiculous is that? I think I'll go back tomorrow and discuss the situation with the owner of the range, get my money back, and never return. Idiots!

Ledbetter · December 28, 2000, 08:34 PM

I sent my 1911 to a "well-known" gunsmith in Idaho for new sights. It came back in terrible shape--the guy just installed the front sight blank and left it sharp and square on all corners--no shaping so the gun could be holstered. Also, no dot on the front sight. Sent it back and the front sight had been shaped and painted white instead of having a dot installed. Finally sent it to someone I trust.

Tell your friends at the range.

Dubletap45 · December 29, 2000, 12:37 PM

Which range did you take it to?? I am thinking you took it to H&H. Please let us know so we will not make a similar mistake. I too have had bad work done before by a gunsmith. I know of a good one but I heard he is trying to retire. As always if you take it to a good smith you will have to be patient. I do a lot on my own.....then I know who to blame for mistakes. I had a barrel shortened once and it looked like the guy put the crown on with a dremmell tool.

DT45

bullseyekp · December 29, 2000, 02:22 PM

Yes, it was H&H that I took the gun to. I shoot IPSC and IDPA at Bob Howard's and I do all of my practice at an outdoor range near El Reno so I don't deal much with H&H; not at all now.

So, I went back this morning and politely asked for a refund from the man behind the counter. He brought the gunsmith over to discuss it and when I told the smith that the sight should be flush against the slide, he sarcastically told the cashier, "Just give him his money back." When I asked about reimbursement for the cost of the front sight he raised his voice and began to tell me that he had no control over how it fit in the slide and that there was no way I was getting any more than my refund. When I told him what needed to be done to make it fit properly, he told me, "Then you should have just done it yourself." Then he walked off.

So let me get this straight, you are obviously an amateur and I should pay for your ignorance? Moron.

WHAT EVER YOU DO, DON'T TAKE YOUR GUNS TO THE SMITH AT H&H GUN RANGE IN OKLAHOMA CITY UNLESS YOU ARE READY TO "DO IT YOURSELF" WHEN HE SCREWS UP!!

And Ledbetter, I will tell my friends at the range!

Anyone else have any not-so-fun gunsmith stories to tell. I'm sure they get worse than this. Come on everybody, share with the group!

[Edited by KP95OKC on 12-29-2000 at 05:00 PM]

old hawk · December 29, 2000, 05:29 PM

ok kp , i'll share with ya, i had a llama ix-b model 45 i had bought which after a bit of my own tuning turned out to be one of the most accurate 45's i have ever owned for a steal, welp anyhow in a hurry with a borrowed ride i get it , jump in the wheels and off to the range, then the extractor blew out on me, its the side mounted one , not the series 70 styl such as the model ix-a.upon getting home all tikked i clean it to find the links shot as well as some light pitting in a filthed out bore.for once i wanted the gunny to do the warranty work,just once in my 24 years as a smith it wouldve been nice to get a decnt job done where i didnt have to do it myself as im disabled and retired now.upon return to the shop i had asked that the link and extracter be done over with new parts.i explicitly said 3 times use a standard colt link.days go bye, weeks go bye, i miss a match.i go to the shop.hiya hawk how are ya he says.
the kids finished with the pistol. i said kid? you told me its going to a gunny cause the kid dont know what hes doing? ,busted lie #1,i get the gun in my hands,dissasemble it on the spot.what no new link? i said get a colt link.its 2$?
we couldnt get the link i was told.i walk out never to return.i hit my home and took a dummy out of the box.i put in the slide and slid the barrel back.i had a 3/16ths gap between the breech face and dummys primer.i call the shop.again.the kid drilled it hawk, they come undrilled.well the holes ovaled what he use a hand drill? i hung up.busted lie 2.i made a new extracter myself from some brown and sharpe tool steel water hardening stock.set the case in the barrel slide it back,shimmed the extracter so it didnt move once it was set up with a dummy in place in the chamber and made my punch mark,removed and drilled it.it hasent failed me yet to this day and this guys lost massive buisness after i spread the word.then i heard more horror storys.i keep this piece because it shoots very tight at 50 feet all day long since the workover,internal polishing,slide tighten for good measure ,a muzzle crown,link and extractor job,sear rework and also is my main carry piece and tool to ruin theyre rep with.if you can do a job ,do it.i dont trust anyone now after the country backwood gun shop screwing i took here in the hills of central maine.beware h+h in west gardiner,me on pond road.odd they both have the same initials i find as well...if ya cant do the job , get a reputable gunny with a good report from many whove been theyre to him at least.

Ledbetter · December 30, 2000, 02:31 AM

The smith should be able to explain to you what the gun needs, not the other way around. I've had to explain to gun shop drones how the products they sell work.

December 28, 2000, 08:34 PM	#2
Ledbetter Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2000 Location: California USA Posts: 4,533	Don't get me started. I sent my 1911 to a "well-known" gunsmith in Idaho for new sights. It came back in terrible shape--the guy just installed the front sight blank and left it sharp and square on all corners--no shaping so the gun could be holstered. Also, no dot on the front sight. Sent it back and the front sight had been shaped and painted white instead of having a dot installed. Finally sent it to someone I trust. Tell your friends at the range.

December 29, 2000, 02:22 PM	#4
bullseyekp Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2000 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 118	You thought right, Dubletap45! Yes, it was H&H that I took the gun to. I shoot IPSC and IDPA at Bob Howard's and I do all of my practice at an outdoor range near El Reno so I don't deal much with H&H; not at all now. So, I went back this morning and politely asked for a refund from the man behind the counter. He brought the gunsmith over to discuss it and when I told the smith that the sight should be flush against the slide, he sarcastically told the cashier, "Just give him his money back." When I asked about reimbursement for the cost of the front sight he raised his voice and began to tell me that he had no control over how it fit in the slide and that there was no way I was getting any more than my refund. When I told him what needed to be done to make it fit properly, he told me, "Then you should have just done it yourself." Then he walked off. So let me get this straight, you are obviously an amateur and I should pay for your ignorance? Moron. WHAT EVER YOU DO, DON'T TAKE YOUR GUNS TO THE SMITH AT H&H GUN RANGE IN OKLAHOMA CITY UNLESS YOU ARE READY TO "DO IT YOURSELF" WHEN HE SCREWS UP!! And Ledbetter, I will tell my friends at the range! Anyone else have any not-so-fun gunsmith stories to tell. I'm sure they get worse than this. Come on everybody, share with the group! [Edited by KP95OKC on 12-29-2000 at 05:00 PM]

December 30, 2000, 02:31 AM	#6
Ledbetter Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2000 Location: California USA Posts: 4,533	One thing I've learned The smith should be able to explain to you what the gun needs, not the other way around. I've had to explain to gun shop drones how the products they sell work.

December 28, 2000, 03:23 PM	#1
bullseyekp Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2000 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 118	I received a set of Williams Fire Sights for my Ruger P95 for Christmas and took them to the gunsmith at the largest indoor range in Oklahoma thinking that their reputation would guarantee a good job. Well, I dropped the gun off yesterday and picked it up today. Of course the first thing I do is check out how well the sight picture looks; amazing! Further inspection reveals that the front sight is not sitting flush against the slide. It is perfectly level instead of sloping downward as it should. There is a gap about 1/16 of an inch between the sight and the slide. So I asked the smith about it and he said that sometimes it just doesn't fit. What the he$$ kind of an answer is that? All he needed to do was file the bottom of the sight until it fit flush into the slide. I went ahead and paid the $15 and left so I could make it to work on time. Now, I've got to order a new front sight ($20) and then I have to pay someone competent enough to do the job correctly. How ridiculous is that? I think I'll go back tomorrow and discuss the situation with the owner of the range, get my money back, and never return. Idiots! __________________ "The great German poet, Goethe, who also lived through a crisis of freedom, said to his generation: 'What you have inherited from your fathers, earn over again for yourselves or it will not be yours'. We inherited freedom. We seem unaware that freedom has to be remade and re-earned in each generation of man." --Adlai Stevenson, "Politics and Morality", Saturday Review, February 7, 1959.

December 29, 2000, 12:37 PM	#3
Dubletap45 Member Join Date: October 1, 2000 Posts: 28	Which range did you take it to?? I am thinking you took it to H&H. Please let us know so we will not make a similar mistake. I too have had bad work done before by a gunsmith. I know of a good one but I heard he is trying to retire. As always if you take it to a good smith you will have to be patient. I do a lot on my own.....then I know who to blame for mistakes. I had a barrel shortened once and it looked like the guy put the crown on with a dremmell tool. DT45

December 29, 2000, 05:29 PM	#5
old hawk Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2000 Location: somewhere,maine. Posts: 175	ok kp , i'll share with ya, i had a llama ix-b model 45 i had bought which after a bit of my own tuning turned out to be one of the most accurate 45's i have ever owned for a steal, welp anyhow in a hurry with a borrowed ride i get it , jump in the wheels and off to the range, then the extractor blew out on me, its the side mounted one , not the series 70 styl such as the model ix-a.upon getting home all tikked i clean it to find the links shot as well as some light pitting in a filthed out bore.for once i wanted the gunny to do the warranty work,just once in my 24 years as a smith it wouldve been nice to get a decnt job done where i didnt have to do it myself as im disabled and retired now.upon return to the shop i had asked that the link and extracter be done over with new parts.i explicitly said 3 times use a standard colt link.days go bye, weeks go bye, i miss a match.i go to the shop.hiya hawk how are ya he says. the kids finished with the pistol. i said kid? you told me its going to a gunny cause the kid dont know what hes doing? ,busted lie #1,i get the gun in my hands,dissasemble it on the spot.what no new link? i said get a colt link.its 2$? we couldnt get the link i was told.i walk out never to return.i hit my home and took a dummy out of the box.i put in the slide and slid the barrel back.i had a 3/16ths gap between the breech face and dummys primer.i call the shop.again.the kid drilled it hawk, they come undrilled.well the holes ovaled what he use a hand drill? i hung up.busted lie 2.i made a new extracter myself from some brown and sharpe tool steel water hardening stock.set the case in the barrel slide it back,shimmed the extracter so it didnt move once it was set up with a dummy in place in the chamber and made my punch mark,removed and drilled it.it hasent failed me yet to this day and this guys lost massive buisness after i spread the word.then i heard more horror storys.i keep this piece because it shoots very tight at 50 feet all day long since the workover,internal polishing,slide tighten for good measure ,a muzzle crown,link and extractor job,sear rework and also is my main carry piece and tool to ruin theyre rep with.if you can do a job ,do it.i dont trust anyone now after the country backwood gun shop screwing i took here in the hills of central maine.beware h+h in west gardiner,me on pond road.odd they both have the same initials i find as well...if ya cant do the job , get a reputable gunny with a good report from many whove been theyre to him at least.