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Old April 15, 2014, 08:50 PM   #126
Cosmodragoon
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Quote:
Microstamping of serial numbers have been used in other fields, including such things as medical devices.
The issue is not microstamping during an industrial process but installing the capability to reliably microstamp every round in a handheld firearm. It is a very different technical challenge.
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Old May 3, 2014, 05:43 PM   #127
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even though this thread got derailed with CA issues, (and I'm a CA resident and would love to see new guns have a chance in CA) I'm still wondering about this new gun?
found this face book page

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Secon...37481712972677

and found this website
http://www.2amfg.com/

Copyright. 2nd Amendment Manufacturing. All Rights Reserved.

2AM Model 1.0

The Model 1.0 is Manufactured to the highest standards using the highest quality materials.

The Model 1.0 is chambered for the 9x19mm Parabellum cartridge.

The 2am Model 1.0 is a full size pistol Manufactured by Second Amendment Manufacturing.

The Model 1.0 is an “all metal” design utilizing an aluminum frame and stainless steel slide. All parts are CNC machined to exacting standards, there is no plastic, or cast parts used in the construction of the Model 1.0

American Owned, American Made, with American Materials. God Bless the USA

Pre purchase sales available in August of 2014
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Old May 3, 2014, 10:41 PM   #128
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Sorry I missed this earlier.
What market share are you looking to capture, the greater unwashed, the firearms enthusiasts, elite shooters, or the collectors of all things fine and rare?
I'd be more than happy to try one sometime. All I ever ask is that it be simple nd elegant.
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Old May 4, 2014, 01:23 AM   #129
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Do something different. A full size, large, double stack 9mm PPK clone. Why? Because that is the best looking handgun every made
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Old May 5, 2014, 12:26 PM   #130
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I would be looking at the other end of the market.
I would also much prefer to have 4 mags than any sort of box. The boxes won't fit in a safe so they end up in a closet unused. When I go to the range I have a foam lined universal pistol box I can fit a few in.
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Old May 6, 2014, 10:31 PM   #131
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TennJed wrote:
Quote:
Do something different. A full size, large, double stack 9mm PPK clone. Why? Because that is the best looking handgun every made
I've always liked these or their CZ clones. There's just something about them. The weight versus light caliber makes them fun to shoot but I always wondered if they could be set up in 9mm.

johnwilliamson062 wrote:
Quote:
I would also much prefer to have 4 mags than any sort of box. The boxes won't fit in a safe so they end up in a closet unused. When I go to the range I have a foam lined universal pistol box I can fit a few in.
Boxes are cool but when you have other storage utilities, they can become useless packaging. I've also got guns where I've changed the grips and now they don't fit their box anymore.
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Old May 7, 2014, 12:01 AM   #132
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Just copy the CZ P01 like TriStar and so many others have... but offer an extended/threaded barrel with tall sights.

Or make a 4.25" 1911 in 9mm!!! (Please, I'm beggin ya).
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Old May 7, 2014, 07:01 PM   #133
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Something inexpensive would be ideal...

Also, with your CNC experience, if you could make a line of inexpensive forming dies, you'd do well here....
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Old May 7, 2014, 08:32 PM   #134
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I wish hey would show some pics of the prototypes.
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Old May 7, 2014, 11:08 PM   #135
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Make it as rust proof as possible. Sig, for example, kills me. Stainless slide, alloy frame and then the barrel and all the controls (on the left side, against my sweaty body) are blued carbon steel. Really? Can't stamp those parts out of stainless?

I really like the Sig DAK trigger. I think a smooth, light And consistent DA trigger is a good thing on a defense gun. No safeties, no decocker. As soon as you are using it, it reverts back to a safe state of readiness by itself.

I prefer hammer fired. I like to carry my off duty gun appendix. A cocked and locked or cocked striker fired gun makes me queasy pointed at my femoral artery.
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Old May 8, 2014, 02:04 AM   #136
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Well.. I would look at why people buy what they do.
For sure if you listen to my wants. You will go broke.

Take AR's and AK's for instance. If you look at mine you wont find any more plane jane guns out there.
All I care about is function.

But the vast majority of people buying AR's and Ak's like to bling them up.
I bet you would be hard pressed to find any thing including fuzzy dice that wont sell.

I would suggest you make one as a 1st entry into a all ready crowded market.
Make it as customizable as possible. Give them a whole box full of swappable junk. Grips, lights, Lazers, ect.

I wont be buying one. But I bet the fuzzy dice crew will eat them up.

Now for me. I just want one gun sold as a set that can swap out 9mm for 40.
I know there are already some you can buy the extra barrel latter.
I want one sold ready and tested.
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Old May 8, 2014, 05:05 AM   #137
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I have just been lurking, but have this one thought...

Like COZ, I am not a builder or tuner. All my guns are stock. I don't order upgrade parts before I fire the weapon, I like them as they come.

That said, if mfgs could learn from the Remington R51 issue and do what they can so that the first production version is not the beta, they would win a lot of hearts and minds right then.

Also, get T&E pieces to thought leaders like Hickok45. Hickok is very gentle with reviews and rarely speaks harshly. If he does...people listen.

Last edited by SpareMag; May 9, 2014 at 05:07 AM.
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Old May 8, 2014, 06:25 PM   #138
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SpareMag is right. Making a quality product and getting it into the hands of some of the more popular web reviewers out there is a great idea. How many of us these days watch Hickock45 but skip the magazine rack? If I'm thinking about a purchase or want to know, here and YouTube are my first stops.

There are also some popular podcasts out there. While Gun Talk is a big-time professional radio program, getting your quality product into Tom Gresham's hands couldn't hurt.

BTW, this thread is shaping up to be a nice free resource for any gun company...
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Old May 9, 2014, 09:17 AM   #139
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The elephant in the room:

It has to look so good the owner's self image is immediately boosted, while his buddies ooze jealousy they didn't get one.

No, really. It's why the PPK doesn't sell as well as it could - it's a tad too Euro, too slick, too refined. It's not a rompin stompin combat gun. It's reputation is shaped by images of a constable in trench coat walking cobblestoned streets and smoking small cheap cigarettes while holding them backwards. It doesn't help he wears little round glasses.

Nope, styling is KING on a rollout, it's where it makes or breaks the mold. The R51 - aside from it's reliability issues - lost the retro look with it's restyle and comes off as a plastic BB gun from Taiwan - the grip lines come off horribly. I've owned better looking cap guns from Hasbro.

A gun has to have clear, distinctive lines with purpose - unlike the hockey stick on the LCP/Keltec receiver that does nothing but waste time. Every line, no matter what, has to be there for a purpose, not useless embellishment. Even if that purpose itself isn't all that important - like the slide cuts on the P938 forward of the chamber. They at least look like they have a reason. The original 1911 didn't bother tho, and it's remarkably free of all that.

So, no milling or cuts for no reason - take the weight out some other way. Don't try to slick it up, avoid the ray gun look at all costs. Even the P7 was ok in it's way, much more successful than the VP70 - which I remember well, I owned a spring powered version from the local grocer's toy rack.

Toys and ray guns aren't the way to style it, it has to look like every design specific feature is there for it's purpose and nobody's making any excuses about them.

It's either "deadly serious," or it's a flash in the pan collectible. Don't compare with all the great sellers, just avoid what ruins image. The better guns are always tools first - a firearm - not an exercise in fantasy.
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Old May 10, 2014, 09:50 PM   #140
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I posted in the wrong thread. Offer a compatible carbine from day one. Same mags and as much else the same as possible. A wire frame and long barrel work for me.
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Old January 1, 2015, 05:36 PM   #141
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remember this guy? this thread?
They still have a website:
http://www.2amfg.com/
But they did not make their fall deadline for releasing their guns.
A lot of talk about custom quality and spear no measure of quality but....

Anyone hear anything about these guys?
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Old January 2, 2015, 03:21 AM   #142
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I was thinking about this thread a few days ago, but I couldn't remember enough about the company name and such to pull it up. Their site doesn't seem to have any more info than six months ago. My guess is they have hit the realities of product development.
Hope they have the cash to get through the apparent delay.
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Old January 2, 2015, 01:25 PM   #143
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Quote:
My guess is they have hit the realities of product development.
Reality...what a concept.

Well, good luck to them in the New Year.
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Old January 2, 2015, 06:19 PM   #144
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A updated copy of the 1908 380 Colt chambered in 9mm.

Single / double action with a outer coating made for a long hard life not beauty.
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Old January 2, 2015, 06:44 PM   #145
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Or make a 4.25" 1911 in 9mm!!!
That exists already ......

....but if they did it in a gun pared down to minumum dimensions, instead of just sticking a 9mm barrel into a .45ACP sized slide and frame (or a .45GAP, like Springer's EMP), then they'd have something I'd sell whatever to get ..... steel framed, please, and exend the barrel and thread it.
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Old January 2, 2015, 10:20 PM   #146
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If they made a 7.62x25 double stack 1911 (or Glock clone ) of at least RIA quality, they'd have a product not-nobody is offering, which has been quite sought after by many for a great deal of time. Very little 'development' investment required owing to the amount of re-used engineering, for a product with no peer, and many practical uses (flat shooting for competition or hunting, high velocity for armor-defeating characteristics in defense, and a long enough magazine to accommodate a plethora of wildcats and cartridges in a platform strong enough to stomach them)

Coonan sorta did this with their 357, but it's fallen over on other side of the fence, being a true automag of substantially larger frame and power (impractically so, for several of the use-cases described above)

A good quality R51 clone would also stomp its niche of the market, and Remington is probably too out of sorts to properly defend against even outright patent infringement, these days

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Old January 4, 2015, 07:20 AM   #147
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Meh...an aluminum framed 9mm.

http://www.2amfg.com/2am-fdp-9mm.html

*shrug*
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Old January 5, 2015, 11:48 AM   #148
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I don't like 9mm, but am looking for a all metal .40 full sized pistol.

For your handgun the sights need to be dovetailed so they can be replaced. You may consider offering either black on black target style sights or 3 dot combat type sights. I like both.

Make sure the grip is as thin as possible. Us short men with small hands can't stand not being able to release the mag without changing grip.

Safety lever isn't all that important, as long as it's not anywhere on the slide. The less things stick out and protrude the bettee

I prefer hammer fired guns, but that really comes down to the trigger for me, if you guys could make a striker fired weapon with a nice trigger. It would sell great.

Depending on your price point and intended customers, usually reliability is the most important factor, then comfort/ ergos, and accuracy

Good luck.
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Old January 5, 2015, 01:32 PM   #149
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2Am has not responded and this thread has obviously reached the point where new posters don't bother reading through the previous post.
Without a response I will go ahead and assume 2AM doesn't have/is out looking for the cash to deal with the delays.

Much better than pushing out a bad pistol.

Last edited by johnwilliamson062; January 5, 2015 at 01:49 PM.
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Old January 5, 2015, 03:58 PM   #150
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Yep - if the firm wants this to reopen, they can PM a mod.

Closed.
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