Making my first foray into .357 Mag loading- advice?

tkglazie · October 18, 2012, 02:16 PM

Hi all,

Due to my error when placing my last powdervalley order I have 1000 small pistol magnum primers on the way. I had been thinking about making up my first magnum loads for my wife's 3" SP101 for a while now so I figured what the heck. I ordered a Hogue monogrip for it to help with the recoil.

Since the goal is to use up the magnum primers and to load full-power magnum loads I bought H110 which likes magnum primers instead of 2400 which does not. If I am understanding correctly, H110 is quite a bit more violent than the more forgiving 2400, hence me reaching out to the group for any advice.

The bullets I have on hand currently are 158gr LSWC with an 18 BRN (no gas check). They are .358" and have worked well for me in the midrange of .38 Special so far but I have not pushed them at all.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Hungry · October 18, 2012, 03:54 PM

Speer 14 recommends keeping the LSWC to about 1000' per/sec to avoid leading.

None of the loads I have listed for LSWC have magnum primers listed.

AlaskaMike · October 18, 2012, 05:23 PM

Speer #14 makes that recommendation because their load data uses their own soft, swaged SWC bullets. If using cast bullets with a hardness of 18 BHN (I'm assuming that's what you meant when you wrote BRN), no such velocity limitation is necessary unless you discover your particular gun shows leading or other problems at typical jacketed velocities.

I wouldn't call H110 more violent than 2400--it has a safety limitation that 2400 doesn't have, where you don't want to download it more than 3% or 10% (depending on the source) from the max published load. H110 is a very good powder for full power .357 mag loads using mid to heavy bullets. I like it best with 158 and 180 grain bullets, but not so much with 125 and 110 grain bullets (too blasty with noise and muzzle flash).

Anywhere from 15 to 16.5 grains of H110 with your cast 158 grain SWCs should work very well, but please be sure to verify my recommendation against authoritative published data.

Mike

spacecoast · October 18, 2012, 05:26 PM

I think some JHPs will work better for your H110 loads than lead bullets. I use 16 grains under a 158 gr JHP for a nice hot .357 load. H110 cannot be reduced much so pay attention to the min/max numbers.

tkglazie · October 18, 2012, 05:29 PM

Thanks Mike. I did mean BHN and your recommendation is right in line with what I am tentatively planning on (15gr-16gr) pending additional verification.

David Bachelder · October 18, 2012, 05:56 PM

I have used 2400 in .357 loads with mag primers. Shoots great. Sounds like you got some bad info.

I have a Henry Rifle that eats them like candy .... loves it.

150 gr, swc cast (bhn ~12 or so), 14gr 2400 and mag sp primer

jimbob86 · October 18, 2012, 06:10 PM

Quote:

I wouldn't call H110 more violent than 2400-

I have found full house H110 158gr XTP loads to be louder, with more muzzle blast and flash, yet less velocity than my 2400 loads with the same bullet. I singed an IDPA target and blew most of the pasters off it at a match once- target was less than 3' away and even from retention, the flamethrower effect out of my 6" Trooper pretty much destroyed the target..... though the flash made the next sets of targets hard to see......

Quote:

I have used 2400 in .357 loads with mag primers. Shoots great. Sounds like you got some bad info.

I have as well ... I achieved better velocity and a smaller SD with the standard primers, though.

tkglazie · October 18, 2012, 06:16 PM

Thanks David. If it works for you I am sure 2400 would work fine for me with magnum primers, but since it also works at least as good with standard primers I figured I would work with a powder that requires magnum primers since I have them. Basically I am treating my ordering mistake as a good excuse to try a powder that I normally wouldnt have.

Hammerhead · October 18, 2012, 08:16 PM

Never use less than the recommended amount of H110 (or W296) in the starting load data.

A pause for the COZ · October 18, 2012, 08:17 PM

I have been contemplating using H110 in my 357 mag loads for my Rossi Lever gun.
I picked up two pounds to use for some 300 Black out loads.
If it works good I may have to order like 16 pounds of the stuff.

tkglazie · October 18, 2012, 10:10 PM

Understood hammerhead.

And wouldnt you know it Pause, my next rifle will be some sort of .357 carbine, singleshot or lever gun. It never ends!

Thanks again all.

A pause for the COZ · October 19, 2012, 04:30 AM

Give you a little advice about the Rossi M92 in 357 magnum.
It is a great gun I love it allot. But I had intended it to be a brush gun. I wanted to load some 180 gr deer smackers.

These newer M92's at least since they have been owned by Taurus, Have a 1 in 30 twist rate. No matter how hard you try you wont get the big bullets to shoot right. They just wont stabilize. hitting a 8 inch pie plate at 50 yards will be a challenge.
158 gr pills are about the max at 50 yards.
I found that 125gr pills shoot just fine. I can put ten shots in the bull at a 100 yards with my scout scope.

1 in 16 twist rate would be better. Obviously they must only shoot 125's in Brazil.
Great gun as long as you know what it is. A hog getter its not.

David Bachelder · October 19, 2012, 06:41 AM

"Thanks David. If it works for you I am sure 2400 would work fine for me with magnum primers, but since it also works at least as good with standard primers I figured I would work with a powder that requires magnum primers since I have them. Basically I am treating my ordering mistake as a good excuse to try a powder that I normally wouldnt have"

You taught me something. I assumed I had to use a magnum primer in a magnum load.

Live and learn.

tkglazie · October 19, 2012, 08:34 AM

I was thinking about picking up some JHP to try spacecoast but havent settled on one yet. I only have about half enough LSWC on hand to use up the 1000 primers so I will be in the market for sure. Since I only have a 3" barrel I am not sure if I will see any expansion out of a JHP though. I will do some more research.

jimbob86 · October 19, 2012, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Since I only have a 3" barrel

.... with full loads of H110, you may set the target on fire if it's close.....

tkglazie · October 19, 2012, 09:21 AM

Quote:

.... with full loads of H110, you may set the target on fire if it's close.....

Fortunately I shoot at a small private club that is generally empty when I shoot so I will take my chances

I generally shoot at 8-9 paces anyway so I should be ok...

m&p45acp10+1 · October 19, 2012, 05:57 PM

Just note the starting load with H-110. Do not go below that. Be ready to have a good firm grip on the gun. You will get a good bit of flash that is for sure. Oh and if you can get some Berry's plated bullets I use them in .41 Mag like jacketed, and they shoot just fine.

tkglazie · October 19, 2012, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m&p45acp10+1

Just note the starting load with H-110. Do not go below that. Be ready to have a good firm grip on the gun. You will get a good bit of flash that is for sure. Oh and if you can get some Berry's plated bullets I use them in .41 Mag like jacketed, and they shoot just fine.

Not a bad idea to try Berry's. I only have 148gr HBWC Berry's on hand but I see there are lots of good 158gr options available. Prices are OK too.

joneb · October 19, 2012, 10:14 PM

For 357 mag loading with 158gr lswc and a BHN of 18 I would think 2400 would be a workable choice.
With 170gr lswc BHN 15 .358 dia I had to down load a bit to avoid leading with 2400 and AA#9. With this bullet a faster powder maybe more efficient.

Hammerhead · October 20, 2012, 08:39 AM

It's tough to get a heavy crimp with plated bullets and they are generally not recommended for heavy loads. Maybe that would be another good reason to look at 2400. You can down load 2400 to match the speed you're after for plated or if you just want to shoot some softer recoiling lead loads.

mrawesome22 · October 20, 2012, 10:10 AM

Even with a 6 inch barrel, QL predicts a very inefficient 74% powder burn with H110.

Sport45 · October 22, 2012, 08:46 PM

You can also use up SPM primers in .38spcl loads. If they're being used in a .357 or a +P rated .38 you should be able to load to maximum published loads without worry.

FM12 · October 22, 2012, 10:21 PM

Just FYI, I tried loading 38 spls with ww296/H110 and got ONLY SQUIBS!! Even with mag primers, heavy buillets and heavy crimp. Each round popped the bullet about 2" into the 4" bbl of my diamondback.

joneb · October 22, 2012, 11:28 PM

For 158gr LSWC in 357 mag with a 3" barrel I would use AA#5, Universal, VV N350, AA#7, and maybe 2400 ?
For this combo faster powders will be easier to load.
Just my 2 cents

Sport45 · October 23, 2012, 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FM12

Just FYI, I tried loading 38 spls with ww296/H110 and got ONLY SQUIBS!! Even with mag primers, heavy buillets and heavy crimp. Each round popped the bullet about 2" into the 4" bbl of my diamondback.

Where on earth did you get load data for .38 special using H-110/W296? It's much too slow a powder for those pressures and I'm not surprised it didn't light.

But that's the typical failure I see with this powder when the charge is too light. The bullet will be just a little way into the barrel with a plug of compressed powder bits behind it. That, or the bullet won't even jump crimp and the powder just fizzles away underneath it.

October 18, 2012, 05:56 PM	#6
David Bachelder Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2011 Location: Trinity, Texas Posts: 636	I have used 2400 in .357 loads with mag primers. Shoots great. Sounds like you got some bad info. I have a Henry Rifle that eats them like candy .... loves it. 150 gr, swc cast (bhn ~12 or so), 14gr 2400 and mag sp primer __________________ David Bachelder Trinity, Texas I load, 9mm Luger, 38 and 40 S&W, 38 Special, 357Magnum, 45ACP, 45 Colt, 223, 300 AAC, 243 and 30-06

October 19, 2012, 06:41 AM	#13
David Bachelder Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2011 Location: Trinity, Texas Posts: 636	"Thanks David. If it works for you I am sure 2400 would work fine for me with magnum primers, but since it also works at least as good with standard primers I figured I would work with a powder that requires magnum primers since I have them. Basically I am treating my ordering mistake as a good excuse to try a powder that I normally wouldnt have" You taught me something. I assumed I had to use a magnum primer in a magnum load. Live and learn. __________________ David Bachelder Trinity, Texas I load, 9mm Luger, 38 and 40 S&W, 38 Special, 357Magnum, 45ACP, 45 Colt, 223, 300 AAC, 243 and 30-06

October 19, 2012, 05:57 PM	#17
m&p45acp10+1 Senior Member Join Date: May 3, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 3,930	Just note the starting load with H-110. Do not go below that. Be ready to have a good firm grip on the gun. You will get a good bit of flash that is for sure. Oh and if you can get some Berry's plated bullets I use them in .41 Mag like jacketed, and they shoot just fine. __________________ No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.

October 20, 2012, 08:39 AM	#20
Hammerhead Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2004 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,432	It's tough to get a heavy crimp with plated bullets and they are generally not recommended for heavy loads. Maybe that would be another good reason to look at 2400. You can down load 2400 to match the speed you're after for plated or if you just want to shoot some softer recoiling lead loads. Last edited by Hammerhead; October 20, 2012 at 08:46 AM.

October 22, 2012, 08:46 PM	#22
Sport45 Senior Member Join Date: May 25, 1999 Location: Too close to Houston Posts: 4,196	You can also use up SPM primers in .38spcl loads. If they're being used in a .357 or a +P rated .38 you should be able to load to maximum published loads without worry. __________________ Proud member of the NRA and Texas State Rifle Association. Registered and active voter.

October 18, 2012, 02:16 PM	#1
tkglazie Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Posts: 558	Making my first foray into .357 Mag loading- advice? Hi all, Due to my error when placing my last powdervalley order I have 1000 small pistol magnum primers on the way. I had been thinking about making up my first magnum loads for my wife's 3" SP101 for a while now so I figured what the heck. I ordered a Hogue monogrip for it to help with the recoil. Since the goal is to use up the magnum primers and to load full-power magnum loads I bought H110 which likes magnum primers instead of 2400 which does not. If I am understanding correctly, H110 is quite a bit more violent than the more forgiving 2400, hence me reaching out to the group for any advice. The bullets I have on hand currently are 158gr LSWC with an 18 BRN (no gas check). They are .358" and have worked well for me in the midrange of .38 Special so far but I have not pushed them at all. Thanks in advance for any advice.

October 18, 2012, 03:54 PM	#2
Hungry Junior Member Join Date: May 30, 2012 Posts: 3	Speer 14 recommends keeping the LSWC to about 1000' per/sec to avoid leading. None of the loads I have listed for LSWC have magnum primers listed.

October 18, 2012, 05:23 PM	#3
AlaskaMike Senior Member Join Date: September 26, 2005 Posts: 941	Speer #14 makes that recommendation because their load data uses their own soft, swaged SWC bullets. If using cast bullets with a hardness of 18 BHN (I'm assuming that's what you meant when you wrote BRN), no such velocity limitation is necessary unless you discover your particular gun shows leading or other problems at typical jacketed velocities. I wouldn't call H110 more violent than 2400--it has a safety limitation that 2400 doesn't have, where you don't want to download it more than 3% or 10% (depending on the source) from the max published load. H110 is a very good powder for full power .357 mag loads using mid to heavy bullets. I like it best with 158 and 180 grain bullets, but not so much with 125 and 110 grain bullets (too blasty with noise and muzzle flash). Anywhere from 15 to 16.5 grains of H110 with your cast 158 grain SWCs should work very well, but please be sure to verify my recommendation against authoritative published data. Mike

October 18, 2012, 05:26 PM	#4
spacecoast Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2009 Location: Sunshine and Keystone States Posts: 4,461	I think some JHPs will work better for your H110 loads than lead bullets. I use 16 grains under a 158 gr JHP for a nice hot .357 load. H110 cannot be reduced much so pay attention to the min/max numbers.

October 18, 2012, 05:29 PM	#5
tkglazie Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Posts: 558	Thanks Mike. I did mean BHN and your recommendation is right in line with what I am tentatively planning on (15gr-16gr) pending additional verification.

October 18, 2012, 06:16 PM	#8
tkglazie Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Posts: 558	Thanks David. If it works for you I am sure 2400 would work fine for me with magnum primers, but since it also works at least as good with standard primers I figured I would work with a powder that requires magnum primers since I have them. Basically I am treating my ordering mistake as a good excuse to try a powder that I normally wouldnt have.

October 18, 2012, 08:16 PM	#9
Hammerhead Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2004 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,432	Never use less than the recommended amount of H110 (or W296) in the starting load data.

October 18, 2012, 08:17 PM	#10
A pause for the COZ Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2012 Location: Braham, Minnesota Posts: 1,314	I have been contemplating using H110 in my 357 mag loads for my Rossi Lever gun. I picked up two pounds to use for some 300 Black out loads. If it works good I may have to order like 16 pounds of the stuff.

October 18, 2012, 10:10 PM	#11
tkglazie Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Posts: 558	Understood hammerhead. And wouldnt you know it Pause, my next rifle will be some sort of .357 carbine, singleshot or lever gun. It never ends! Thanks again all.

October 19, 2012, 04:30 AM	#12
A pause for the COZ Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2012 Location: Braham, Minnesota Posts: 1,314	Give you a little advice about the Rossi M92 in 357 magnum. It is a great gun I love it allot. But I had intended it to be a brush gun. I wanted to load some 180 gr deer smackers. These newer M92's at least since they have been owned by Taurus, Have a 1 in 30 twist rate. No matter how hard you try you wont get the big bullets to shoot right. They just wont stabilize. hitting a 8 inch pie plate at 50 yards will be a challenge. 158 gr pills are about the max at 50 yards. I found that 125gr pills shoot just fine. I can put ten shots in the bull at a 100 yards with my scout scope. 1 in 16 twist rate would be better. Obviously they must only shoot 125's in Brazil. Great gun as long as you know what it is. A hog getter its not.

October 19, 2012, 08:34 AM	#14
tkglazie Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Posts: 558	I was thinking about picking up some JHP to try spacecoast but havent settled on one yet. I only have about half enough LSWC on hand to use up the 1000 primers so I will be in the market for sure. Since I only have a 3" barrel I am not sure if I will see any expansion out of a JHP though. I will do some more research.

October 19, 2012, 10:14 PM	#19
joneb Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Location: Central , OR Posts: 1,888	For 357 mag loading with 158gr lswc and a BHN of 18 I would think 2400 would be a workable choice. With 170gr lswc BHN 15 .358 dia I had to down load a bit to avoid leading with 2400 and AA#9. With this bullet a faster powder maybe more efficient.

October 20, 2012, 10:10 AM	#21
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	Even with a 6 inch barrel, QL predicts a very inefficient 74% powder burn with H110.

October 22, 2012, 10:21 PM	#23
FM12 Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2007 Location: Monroeville, Alabama Posts: 1,683	Just FYI, I tried loading 38 spls with ww296/H110 and got ONLY SQUIBS!! Even with mag primers, heavy buillets and heavy crimp. Each round popped the bullet about 2" into the 4" bbl of my diamondback.

October 22, 2012, 11:28 PM	#24
joneb Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2005 Location: Central , OR Posts: 1,888	For 158gr LSWC in 357 mag with a 3" barrel I would use AA#5, Universal, VV N350, AA#7, and maybe 2400 ? For this combo faster powders will be easier to load. Just my 2 cents