Shotshells Out of a Rifled Barrel

tacticalgoldaxe · November 11, 2013, 07:11 PM

Will shot shells damage the rifling in a shotgun barrel? I do know that you get a HUGE spread if you shoot them out a rifled barrel, but will you get any kind of actual damage to the rifling?

BigD_in_FL · November 11, 2013, 07:20 PM

no

Bake · November 11, 2013, 08:15 PM

No problem, or damage. Plus it will really open up the pattern at short ranges. Might be worth checking out for HD....

tacticalgoldaxe · November 11, 2013, 08:23 PM

OK, thanks for the replies guys

Dreaming100Straight · November 12, 2013, 02:57 AM

I dunno, Bake. HD guns are typically open cylinder and this test by Box of Truth using an improved cylinder choke suggests to me that the use of a rifled barrel may open the pattern so much that you risk shooting around the area you wish to hit. http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot43.htm

This is the pattern at 5 yards with the same Wolf buckshot that produced a tight 4" pattern at the same distance.

Bake · November 12, 2013, 11:57 AM

The "Box of True" test were pretty good. The only thing I would change would be the distances. 2 yards (end of hall to the front door) 3 yards (closet to bedroom door), 6 yards (bedroom door to end of the hallway), 7 yards (back door to the garage door) and 9 yards (bedroom door, down the hall to the other side of living room). Wonder what would happen, if one was to use just a "rifled interchangeable choke tube" in a 20" barrel?

Using our friend the "pattern broad" it might be possible find just the right combination of load and distances for HD. I would also use a more human silhouette target to pattern the loads.

Plus, I like #4 buck shot for HD.

Dreaming100Straight · November 12, 2013, 03:59 PM

I just found that test of buckshot in a rifled barrel and I was pretty astonished by the doughnut, even though I had heard of it. I just didn't expect such an open circular pattern with such a completely empty middle. It is kind of like a hoop you train animals to jump thru. I believe there are two primary schools of thought for hd loads. One likes a load that opens quickly. I think they tend to live in less dense areas such as the country. The other prefers a tight pattern. I believe Dave McCracken, RIP, liked it saying something about how the shooter is responsible for every bit of shot and he wanted to keep it all on target.

There is no way of knowing well what anything will do without testing it, but at very shot disatnces like 2 yards I think the rifled barrel or choke wouldn't be a problem, but the rifled barrel could be a big problem at 9 yards. That picture of the Hornady through the rifled barrel at 12 yards barely stayed on the paper.

My guess is that the rifle choke the would impart less spin than a rifled barrel and that would mean less of a doughnut but the only way to know is to test. If I had gun that served for HD that took tubes I think I would simply not keep a different choke in the gun while home. Just as I swithch barrels when I take the 870 out to shoot clays and replace the short barrel when I get home.

MarkCO · November 12, 2013, 04:02 PM

Try it with Flit Control wads.

RMcL · February 19, 2014, 10:27 PM

The only buckshot round that will pattern tight through a 12 gauge rifled bore is the Dixie Tri-Ball round manufactured by Dixie Slugs Co.

JimDandy · February 20, 2014, 04:33 PM

Are we assuming lead shot, not steel shot? Probably obvious to most, but we might want to cover that.

B.L.E. · February 22, 2014, 04:16 PM

With steel shot loads, the only thing that touches the sides of the barrel is the plastic shot protecter cup. This is also mostly true of modern lead birdshot loads also.
I never had problems with barrel leading shooting skeet, I did have problems with barrel plasticing, plastic fouling usually building up in the choke tubes from the shot protecter cup style wads.

Nickel Plated · February 22, 2014, 05:35 PM

I'd guess the spread would be similar between a rifled choke and a fully rifled barrel of the same twist. The length of the rifled section has little bearing on the spin. Once you start it spinning even with a couple inches of rifling. The rest is mostly unnecessary.
See Paradox Guns
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_gun

It would be nice to see a rifled choke with very slow twist so it opens the patern just a tad at typical HD ranges to improve hit probability but not so much as to have your shot go everywhere.

I personally prefer a slightly bigger pattern on my HD loads. That's kinda the point of a shotgun, the spread to improve hit probability. If I wanted a single neat hole, I'd use a rifle or a slug.

Unlicensed Dremel · February 23, 2014, 10:26 AM

Lead, no.

Steel, yes.

Bismuth & Tungsten, I don't know.

Quote:

Try it with Flit Control wads.

That *would* be an interesting test.

natman · February 23, 2014, 12:01 PM

Shooting shot from a rifled barrel results in shot going everywhere except point of aim. You're responsible for every one of those projectiles, it's important that they go where they're supposed to. It's a bad idea for just about any use.

November 11, 2013, 07:11 PM	#1
tacticalgoldaxe Junior Member Join Date: November 8, 2013 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 14	Shotshells Out of a Rifled Barrel Will shot shells damage the rifling in a shotgun barrel? I do know that you get a HUGE spread if you shoot them out a rifled barrel, but will you get any kind of actual damage to the rifling?

November 11, 2013, 08:15 PM	#3
Bake Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2012 Location: San Joaquin Valley, Calif. Posts: 482	No problem, or damage. Plus it will really open up the pattern at short ranges. Might be worth checking out for HD.... __________________ 1. The pattern board is your friend, use the Dam thing!!! 2. The maximum range of a firearm and/or cartridge, is usually measured in miles, and means nothing. 2a. The effective range of a firearm and/or cartridge, is usually (the ability of the shooter) measured in yards, and means everything.

November 12, 2013, 11:57 AM	#6
Bake Senior Member Join Date: November 11, 2012 Location: San Joaquin Valley, Calif. Posts: 482	The "Box of True" test were pretty good. The only thing I would change would be the distances. 2 yards (end of hall to the front door) 3 yards (closet to bedroom door), 6 yards (bedroom door to end of the hallway), 7 yards (back door to the garage door) and 9 yards (bedroom door, down the hall to the other side of living room). Wonder what would happen, if one was to use just a "rifled interchangeable choke tube" in a 20" barrel? Using our friend the "pattern broad" it might be possible find just the right combination of load and distances for HD. I would also use a more human silhouette target to pattern the loads. Plus, I like #4 buck shot for HD. __________________ 1. The pattern board is your friend, use the Dam thing!!! 2. The maximum range of a firearm and/or cartridge, is usually measured in miles, and means nothing. 2a. The effective range of a firearm and/or cartridge, is usually (the ability of the shooter) measured in yards, and means everything.

November 12, 2013, 03:59 PM	#7
Dreaming100Straight Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 2013 Posts: 1,235	I just found that test of buckshot in a rifled barrel and I was pretty astonished by the doughnut, even though I had heard of it. I just didn't expect such an open circular pattern with such a completely empty middle. It is kind of like a hoop you train animals to jump thru. I believe there are two primary schools of thought for hd loads. One likes a load that opens quickly. I think they tend to live in less dense areas such as the country. The other prefers a tight pattern. I believe Dave McCracken, RIP, liked it saying something about how the shooter is responsible for every bit of shot and he wanted to keep it all on target. There is no way of knowing well what anything will do without testing it, but at very shot disatnces like 2 yards I think the rifled barrel or choke wouldn't be a problem, but the rifled barrel could be a big problem at 9 yards. That picture of the Hornady through the rifled barrel at 12 yards barely stayed on the paper. My guess is that the rifle choke the would impart less spin than a rifled barrel and that would mean less of a doughnut but the only way to know is to test. If I had gun that served for HD that took tubes I think I would simply not keep a different choke in the gun while home. Just as I swithch barrels when I take the 870 out to shoot clays and replace the short barrel when I get home. Last edited by Dreaming100Straight; November 12, 2013 at 04:11 PM.

November 12, 2013, 04:02 PM	#8
MarkCO Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 1998 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 4,307	Try it with Flit Control wads. __________________ Good Shooting, MarkCO www.CarbonArms.us

November 11, 2013, 07:20 PM	#2
BigD_in_FL Junior member Join Date: December 20, 2012 Location: The "Gunshine State" Posts: 1,981	no

November 11, 2013, 08:23 PM	#4
tacticalgoldaxe Junior Member Join Date: November 8, 2013 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 14	OK, thanks for the replies guys

November 12, 2013, 02:57 AM	#5
Dreaming100Straight Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 2013 Posts: 1,235	I dunno, Bake. HD guns are typically open cylinder and this test by Box of Truth using an improved cylinder choke suggests to me that the use of a rifled barrel may open the pattern so much that you risk shooting around the area you wish to hit. http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot43.htm This is the pattern at 5 yards with the same Wolf buckshot that produced a tight 4" pattern at the same distance.

February 19, 2014, 10:27 PM	#9
RMcL Senior Member Join Date: May 7, 2006 Location: Alabama Posts: 273	The only buckshot round that will pattern tight through a 12 gauge rifled bore is the Dixie Tri-Ball round manufactured by Dixie Slugs Co.

February 20, 2014, 04:33 PM	#10
JimDandy Senior Member Join Date: August 8, 2012 Posts: 2,556	Are we assuming lead shot, not steel shot? Probably obvious to most, but we might want to cover that.

February 22, 2014, 04:16 PM	#11
B.L.E. Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2008 Location: Somewhere on the Southern shore of Lake Travis, TX Posts: 2,603	With steel shot loads, the only thing that touches the sides of the barrel is the plastic shot protecter cup. This is also mostly true of modern lead birdshot loads also. I never had problems with barrel leading shooting skeet, I did have problems with barrel plasticing, plastic fouling usually building up in the choke tubes from the shot protecter cup style wads. __________________ Hanlon's Razor "Do not invoke conspiracy as explanation when ignorance and incompetence will suffice, as conspiracy implies intelligence and organization."

February 22, 2014, 05:35 PM	#12
Nickel Plated Senior Member Join Date: January 17, 2010 Location: Brooklyn, NYC Posts: 610	I'd guess the spread would be similar between a rifled choke and a fully rifled barrel of the same twist. The length of the rifled section has little bearing on the spin. Once you start it spinning even with a couple inches of rifling. The rest is mostly unnecessary. See Paradox Guns http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_gun It would be nice to see a rifled choke with very slow twist so it opens the patern just a tad at typical HD ranges to improve hit probability but not so much as to have your shot go everywhere. I personally prefer a slightly bigger pattern on my HD loads. That's kinda the point of a shotgun, the spread to improve hit probability. If I wanted a single neat hole, I'd use a rifle or a slug.

February 23, 2014, 12:01 PM	#14
natman Senior Member Join Date: June 24, 2008 Posts: 2,605	Shooting shot from a rifled barrel results in shot going everywhere except point of aim. You're responsible for every one of those projectiles, it's important that they go where they're supposed to. It's a bad idea for just about any use.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search