After-Action Senario

Sgt.K · July 12, 2000, 07:24 PM

I posted this at a couple of other forums. Received very few responses so far. The couple that I've gotten have just stated that this is the reason they would only defend themselves or a loved one. Hate to tell them but IMO this would play out under those circumstances also. BTW, I don't believe there is an easy or incorrect answer. Here it is.

You made national news because you stopped two BG's robbing your place of employment. Problem is you left them alive. And even if you had killed them, you know they have like-minded "friends" and family.

Are you worried about retribution?

Was your weapon taken for "evidence"?

Would you acquire a substitute weapon? Own another? Borrow one?

Try to purchase one? Buy one from a private party?

What about the safety of your family?

You cannot be with them all the time!!

What if your charged with a crime? Jailed? Large bail?

Certainly you will go to civil court. Whether you killed them or not. Remember they have a family. Their "job" paid Mom's rent.

Just brought this up because we always talk about "what-if" before or during, hardly ever after the smoke clears.

LEO's and others that have experienced this can possibly provide excellent advice.

I've never had to come even close. And war provides no comparison.

My answers. Well I certainly would not become a victim and I would do my best to protect my family. I would hope for pro-bono legal help.

I feel for that McD's employee in TX.

Sgt.K

Ivanhoe · July 12, 2000, 11:03 PM

There's an old adage; "Anything you need, you need two of." Almost certain the gun you used will be taken, possible that others will also. In which case, I'd borrow one unless under a specific court order.

I'd certainly be concerned, particularly if the bad guys had gang affiliations. Maybe send the family out of town for awhile, to a relative or friend. Also, I'd try to have friends around my place as much as possible, so if there is a retaliatory strike, there are more witnesses and/or defenders.

David Scott · July 13, 2000, 03:40 PM

Originally posted by Sgt.K:

Are you worried about retribution?
Concerned, yes. Worried, no. Proper precautions can be taken without hiding in paranoid fear.

Was your weapon taken for "evidence"?
Probably. Standard procedure most places. Get a receipt with the make, model and serial number specified.

Would you acquire a substitute weapon? Own another? Borrow one?
Go to the safe and re-arm.

Try to purchase one? Buy one from a private party?
If I needed another, and could find a decent private deal, I'd do that rather than give the government more paper to play with.

What about the safety of your family?
Same precautions we always take, plus being familiar with the perp's faces and their associates'.

You cannot be with them all the time!!
True, but Thelma's a pretty good shot. Kids don't live at home anymore.

What if your charged with a crime? Jailed? Large bail? Certainly you will go to civil court. Whether you killed them or not. Remember they have a family. Their "job" paid Mom's rent.

You may not go to any court. There have been plenty of defensive shootings where the police declined to pursue charges or a grand jury no-billed it as justifed. IMHO, the threat of a wrongful death lawsuit by the perps or families is not huge if you get no-billed, and you should get no-billed if you stuck to the laws regarding the use of deadly force. That is the best defense you can have, to prove that you knew the law and did as it requires.

I have always felt that the idea of a violent criminal suing someone who defended themselves is almost an urban myth, based on a very few stupid cases. I would love to see how many suits get filed, and how many are won, as a percentage of the total number of incidents.

Ledbetter · July 13, 2000, 08:21 PM

I agree with David Scott.

David Scott · July 14, 2000, 07:34 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ledbetter:
I agree with David Scott.[/quote]

So do I.

Sgt.K · July 14, 2000, 07:13 PM

Me too!!!

Sgt.K

atlctyslkr · March 18, 2006, 11:22 AM

Alot of states now are passing laws preventing these types of civil suits. Florida has one and Georgia has one on the way. If the police rule it's a justified defense shooting, end of story. I would however plan on having your gun confiscated and not getting it back for a long time if ever. Many governments have a policy that any gun used in shooting (legal or not) is confiscated and not returned. Kind of violated private property rights but what can you do.

threegun · March 18, 2006, 03:53 PM

Are you worried about retribution?yes

Was your weapon taken for "evidence"?don't matter

Would you acquire a substitute weapon? Own another? Borrow one? own doubles of all my carry guns

Try to purchase one? Buy one from a private party?make the cops give mine back

What about the safety of your family?#1 priority

You cannot be with them all the time!!wife would be forced to take up the slack or we might have to move

What if your charged with a crime? Jailed? Large bail? probably going to get devirginized but other family members will do the above in my absense.

July 12, 2000, 07:24 PM	#1
Sgt.K Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1999 Location: Kentucky, USA Posts: 198	I posted this at a couple of other forums. Received very few responses so far. The couple that I've gotten have just stated that this is the reason they would only defend themselves or a loved one. Hate to tell them but IMO this would play out under those circumstances also. BTW, I don't believe there is an easy or incorrect answer. Here it is. You made national news because you stopped two BG's robbing your place of employment. Problem is you left them alive. And even if you had killed them, you know they have like-minded "friends" and family. Are you worried about retribution? Was your weapon taken for "evidence"? Would you acquire a substitute weapon? Own another? Borrow one? Try to purchase one? Buy one from a private party? What about the safety of your family? You cannot be with them all the time!! What if your charged with a crime? Jailed? Large bail? Certainly you will go to civil court. Whether you killed them or not. Remember they have a family. Their "job" paid Mom's rent. Just brought this up because we always talk about "what-if" before or during, hardly ever after the smoke clears. LEO's and others that have experienced this can possibly provide excellent advice. I've never had to come even close. And war provides no comparison. My answers. Well I certainly would not become a victim and I would do my best to protect my family. I would hope for pro-bono legal help. I feel for that McD's employee in TX. Sgt.K

July 12, 2000, 11:03 PM	#2
Ivanhoe Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: Virginia Posts: 412	There's an old adage; "Anything you need, you need two of." Almost certain the gun you used will be taken, possible that others will also. In which case, I'd borrow one unless under a specific court order. I'd certainly be concerned, particularly if the bad guys had gang affiliations. Maybe send the family out of town for awhile, to a relative or friend. Also, I'd try to have friends around my place as much as possible, so if there is a retaliatory strike, there are more witnesses and/or defenders.

July 13, 2000, 03:40 PM	#3
David Scott Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2000 Posts: 2,456	Originally posted by Sgt.K: Are you worried about retribution? Concerned, yes. Worried, no. Proper precautions can be taken without hiding in paranoid fear. Was your weapon taken for "evidence"? Probably. Standard procedure most places. Get a receipt with the make, model and serial number specified. Would you acquire a substitute weapon? Own another? Borrow one? Go to the safe and re-arm. Try to purchase one? Buy one from a private party? If I needed another, and could find a decent private deal, I'd do that rather than give the government more paper to play with. What about the safety of your family? Same precautions we always take, plus being familiar with the perp's faces and their associates'. You cannot be with them all the time!! True, but Thelma's a pretty good shot. Kids don't live at home anymore. What if your charged with a crime? Jailed? Large bail? Certainly you will go to civil court. Whether you killed them or not. Remember they have a family. Their "job" paid Mom's rent. You may not go to any court. There have been plenty of defensive shootings where the police declined to pursue charges or a grand jury no-billed it as justifed. IMHO, the threat of a wrongful death lawsuit by the perps or families is not huge if you get no-billed, and you should get no-billed if you stuck to the laws regarding the use of deadly force. That is the best defense you can have, to prove that you knew the law and did as it requires. I have always felt that the idea of a violent criminal suing someone who defended themselves is almost an urban myth, based on a very few stupid cases. I would love to see how many suits get filed, and how many are won, as a percentage of the total number of incidents.

July 13, 2000, 08:21 PM	#4
Ledbetter Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2000 Location: California USA Posts: 4,533	I agree with David Scott.

July 14, 2000, 07:34 AM	#5
David Scott Senior Member Join Date: February 11, 2000 Posts: 2,456	<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ledbetter: I agree with David Scott.[/quote] So do I.

July 14, 2000, 07:13 PM	#6
Sgt.K Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 1999 Location: Kentucky, USA Posts: 198	Me too!!! Sgt.K

March 18, 2006, 11:22 AM	#7
atlctyslkr Senior Member Join Date: March 6, 2006 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 613	Alot of states now are passing laws preventing these types of civil suits. Florida has one and Georgia has one on the way. If the police rule it's a justified defense shooting, end of story. I would however plan on having your gun confiscated and not getting it back for a long time if ever. Many governments have a policy that any gun used in shooting (legal or not) is confiscated and not returned. Kind of violated private property rights but what can you do.

March 18, 2006, 03:53 PM	#8
threegun Junior member Join Date: March 1, 2006 Location: Tampa,Fl Posts: 4,000	Are you worried about retribution?yes Was your weapon taken for "evidence"?don't matter Would you acquire a substitute weapon? Own another? Borrow one? own doubles of all my carry guns Try to purchase one? Buy one from a private party?make the cops give mine back What about the safety of your family?#1 priority You cannot be with them all the time!!wife would be forced to take up the slack or we might have to move What if your charged with a crime? Jailed? Large bail? probably going to get devirginized but other family members will do the above in my absense.