.32 acp - Page 2

Kreyzhorse · November 23, 2012, 07:29 AM

The frame cracking issue seems to have been a problem with early versions of the Tomcat. I would not allow that to keep me from buying one if that is what I really liked.

That said, my buddy has a Tomcat that is pretty much his constant carry gun. Reliable and accurate although a little thick for my tastes.

Thespis · November 23, 2012, 11:26 AM

Years back, a friend told me that he loved his Seecamp but that it was a tad picky when it came to ammo. I lucked into an NAA Guardian in .32 acp, got a complete (free!) tune-up from the NAA folks in Provo, UT, found the little pistol both accurate and 100% reliable with any ammo, and have never regretted my choice. As I write, the little Guardian is holstered in my right-hand jeans pocket.

bonefamily · November 26, 2012, 04:58 AM

Thanks for the replies and experiences, everyone. To sum it up, I ended up getting the P-32 yesterday - early Christmas present from the wife! No range time yet but plan to do so next weekend...

lamarw · November 26, 2012, 10:01 AM

I am not going to try to sway anyone one way or the other on this subject. I just want to interject the fact the stainless Tomcat and the later wider blued Tomcats do not have the issue with cracked slides. I have forgotten the dimensions for the wider slide, but I have posted it on this forum in the past.

I believe the Tomcat is the only one of the pistols mentioned having the break barrel for loading a round. This helps some out there with limited strength to rack the slide.

The only other thought I will add is the .32 ACP is a pain to reload.

weblance · November 26, 2012, 12:16 PM

I wanted a .32 for a BUG. It was between a Beretta Tomcat or a P32. I have a Beretta 21a Inox, and really would have liked a Tomcat, but would have had to order it. My LGS had the P32 in stock, and based on reviews, and comments, I bought the P32. I liked the idea of factory 10 shot magazines, and the weight, and size of the P32. I will get to shoot it in the next couple days. I also ordered an ArmaLaser For my P32. Now I need to find some ammo locally that is reasonably priced.

RJay · November 26, 2012, 12:38 PM

The reason the small Berettas have a break open system is quite simple. It is not to load the first round, that is a nice feature , I guess, the small Berettas don't have an extractor. If you have a round in the chamber and want to unload the gun ( to put it away or what ever ) you can't rack the slide to expel the round in the chamber, you have to unlock the barrel to remove the round. The same with a rare misfire or defective cartridge, you can not rack the slide to remove the round, you must unlock the barrel and remove the round. close the barrel and then rack the slide ( or reach into your pocket for a loose round, insert it into the barrel and then close the barrel, all this while the bad guy is waiting for you finish ). If the gun is clean the round will drop out, if the chamber is dirty, the round must be picked out by hand. Not really a good feature, misfire in .25 ACP and .32 ACP are rare but it does happen. I've owned both the Berettas in .25 and .32, never did like the way they felt in my hand, but that is just me.

lamarw · November 27, 2012, 12:37 AM

RJay, I am confused with your comments. Once you break the action and place a round in the barrel and it is fired, the pistol will eject and load the next round or first round in the magazine.

Without having a round in the chamber, you can also cock the hammer and rack the slide to load the first round from the magazine without breaking the action.

It is the shooter's choice. Although the first method allows for an extra round available (the magazine capacity + 1).

I only see all the above as a plus and not a disadvantage.

Possilby, I misinterpreted your thoughts.

weblance · November 27, 2012, 02:23 AM

Not having an extractor can be a problem with a SD gun. I have 2 different Tip-Up barrel pistols, both 22 LR. They have both been very reliable, but... I like the idea of having an extractor. The Tip-Up barrels are great for someone with physical limitations, who, for whatever reason, cant manipulate the slide on an Autoloader. Keep the chamber clean, use good ammo, and pray you dont have a jam. The Tomcat is a beautiful little pistol. I would love to own one. I cherish my Bobcat, and may get the Tomcat some time later, just because I can.

Pianoguy · November 27, 2012, 08:44 AM

The cracked slide issue with the Tomcat seems to be a thing of the past. I haven't read of many cases of it that haven't been several years old. I have a Bobcat and kept clean and with the right ammo it's been very reliable and a great little pistol to shoot. I'm probably going to get a Tomcat in the near future. Although the gun is short it is wide compared to something like a P-32 or LCP and much heavier. I would think it might seem too big as a pocket pistol for some people but I imagine it would be much nicer to shoot (not that a 32acp is much of a handfull in other guns). The issue with the stiff slide is a real one for an small blow-back pistol like this. My Bobcat has the stiffest slide of any semi-auto I have ever tried and given it's so small and hard to get a grip on you really do appreciate the tip-up barrell (it's not so bad if you cock the pistol first so your not fighting the trigger, too).

I'd also like to get a P-32 since I like small mouse-guns like that and have no problem carrying a small caliber gun for self-defense. I would think both of these would be good choices for anyone that wants a really small handgun and doesn't like too much snap of recoil and would rather hit what they aim at without fighting the gun too.

Guv · November 27, 2012, 04:15 PM

I've got a Tomcat, hits like a brick through a plate glass window!

Charlie Fox · November 27, 2012, 05:30 PM

The thinest, lightest .32 on the market is the KelTec. I've carried one in my left front pocket since 2003 and hardly know its there anymore. I only feed it FMJ's for reliability and penetration, but the newer models seem to handle all sorts of ammunition profiles without issue.

Onward Allusion · November 27, 2012, 06:53 PM

Quote:

bonefamily
.32 acp
I'm looking to know of the most reliable, little .32 Auto's currently on the market. So far I have considered the NAA Guardian .32, Kel Tec P32, and Seecamp LWS .32. I have looked into the Beretta Tomcat but read about the cracking issue. What others are out there? Thanks.

Ah, mouseguns... I had done a lot of research on 'em.

I'd stay far away from the Seecamp even though they are put together like fine Swiss watches. I would avoid any gun designed around a specific OAL of its cartridge. Also, there's the draw bar spring issue... Personally, not worth the premium over the NAA or Kel Tec

Then there's the Masterpiece Arms... Nice little all steel gun. Just don't dry fire w/o a mag in it. The hammer spring pops out. Inexpensive, but gotta wonder about the dry firing thing especially for a last ditch gun.

The Beretta Tomcat - No extractor... tip up is good for folks w/o strength to rack the slide, but there are concessions to a gun w/o an extractor. Had one - it's gone now...

NAA Guardian 32 - It's ok. The straight blowback makes this gun seem a lot harsher than its diminutive caliber. It's smaller than the Kel Tec P32 but is heavier and holds one less round. Deeper concealment than the KT P32 and that is exactly why I carry it from time to time.

Kel Tec P-32 - heh, got 3 of 'em. I guess I drank the Kool-aid. Thinnest, lightest 32 ACP out there. It also holds 7+1 and it is with me at almost all waking hours. Eats pretty much anything but I feed it only FMJ.

RJay · November 27, 2012, 09:00 PM

lamarw, reread my post.

Stevie-Ray · November 28, 2012, 09:09 PM

I like the KT P-32 for carry. I've used one for BUG for nearly a decade. It is always on me and even serves as primary once in a while as well, depending on circumstances. First rule of a gunfight and all.....

I like the Geco ball in mine.

bonefamily · November 28, 2012, 10:08 PM

Thanks everyone. Planning on shooting my P-32 for the first time this Saturday. I'll be using FMJ to avoid the rim lock issues I've read about.

Onward Allusion · November 28, 2012, 10:39 PM

Quote:

bonefamily
Thanks everyone. Planning on shooting my P-32 for the first time this Saturday. I'll be using FMJ to avoid the rim lock issues I've read about.

One thing to note about the P-32 and most of the Kel Tec pistols... They have plastic/poly mag catches. This part will wear quickly if you are in the habit of slapping in a loaded mag.

1. Always depress the mag release while holding the empty magazine in the mag well to take out the empty mag.

2. Always depress the mag release while loading a full magazine into the mag well and releasing when the mag is tightly seated.

This will prevent premature wear of your mag catch. A worn mag catch will cause the mag to sit low and will eventually cause FTFeed issues. I always knew about #2 but #1 I'd learned here on TFL.

This is what I've done with my KT's when they were new... Clean 'em, run a couple of hundred rounds of FMJ through it or until you are comfortable with it. These little guys aren't range toys. After the initial break-in, mine are fired once or every other month and even then it is only one mag. Maybe two. I keep Fiocchi 73gr FMJ in mine.

RJay · November 29, 2012, 12:10 PM

In Reference to Rim Lock on the .32 ACP. It must happen because people have said it does. I took 5 .32 ACP pistols ( yes, I like the .32 ), sat down and tried to induce " Rim Lock ", No matter what I did, I could not load any of the magazines with the cartridge rims over lapped, I also used several types of bullets. As a result I don't even consider it a problem ( For Me ). It is curious, in all the years I've been shooting I had never heard of the problem until the last couple of years. If rim-lock is a real or common problem , why has the problem never surfaced before. Even if it real problem , if you load the magazine one shell at a time--- oh, never mind , I've typed enough on the subject .

Bill DeShivs · November 29, 2012, 03:36 PM

Ron- After shooting various semi rimmed cartridges for many years I had never experienced rim lock either.
Recently, I was cleaning my wife's P32. As I unloaded it-rim lock. Puzzling, because I loaded the mag in the first place. Since her gun likes Fiocchi hollow points, I ordered and installed the rim lock kit from K/T. I load my gun with Powerballs now.

bonefamily · November 29, 2012, 05:43 PM

Thanks for the replies, guys. Because the P-32 is the first .32 acp that I have owned, I have yet (if will) to have rim lock issues. Over on the Kel Tec forums they mention rim lock with the P-32 a common issue. They say that longer OAL ammunition helps with this - but again, I don't know. I also read about the Flyer Wire mod to help with this. I'm going to start with FMJ's for now and will give some HP's a try later and see how it goes. Thanks!

PSP · November 29, 2012, 07:43 PM

Quote:

If rim-lock is a real or common problem , why has the problem never surfaced before.

Rim lock has been a problem with some pistols ever since the round was created. It isn't a problem caused by faulty loading. You can't "induce" it. It occurs when the rounds are bouncing around and moving in the magazine. Some mags are designed to virtually eliminate the problem and some aren't. Most fixes involve filling up empty, unused space in the magazine. For example; CZ redesigned their CZ83 .32 mags, KelTec and Seecamp use spacers.

Rim lock can be a very serious matter because it renders the magazine useless and therefore a pistol useless unless another mag is handy. The CZ 83 would lock up so tight that the only way to clear it was to disassemble the mag.

Some of my .32s never exhibit the problem. My Walthers, Sig, Llama nor Seecamp ever wavered but others have.

Guv · November 29, 2012, 08:44 PM

Maybe rim-lock is more of a 38 Super or 38 ACP issue?

WyMark · November 29, 2012, 10:01 PM

I've had it happen twice on my P32, both times from FMJ Blazer rounds that had just enough set back to shorten them about the same as the width of the rim. Only way I could clear it was to take the base plate off the mag and drop the rounds out the bottom, then I was able to pull the slide back a bit and clear it. Pain in the butt.

Been shooting Fiochi 73g FMJ since then without any problems.

bonefamily · November 29, 2012, 10:22 PM

Thanks, all.

WyMark - I'll pick up some Fiocchi 73g FMJ's for the weekend. I've heard good results with this ammunition on several posts.

Master Blaster 2 · November 30, 2012, 04:57 AM

I got my Seecamp 32 back when they were the only game in town. Everything small was 25Cal. I Still have it. She will only feed Silvertip or equal length ammo. Was relable but you had to hold onto the gun well and with my big hands it was a pain.I Got a KelTec 32 when they first csme out and never had an issue. Even though the P32 is larger it is however lighter and easier for me to control. With the guns clip i can carry it in my front pocket like a knife.
I got the P3AT too but gave that to my son as I sill prefer my P11 when i need a small pistol.

bonefamily · November 30, 2012, 05:52 AM

^^ My P-32 has the belt clip as well (purchased it with the clip already installed). I don't have my CC permit yet as our class is next month, but I haven't finalized yet about how I want to carry it. Do you feel comfortable carrying yours with the clip only and not in a pocket holster - or do you use both? Thanks.

November 23, 2012, 07:29 AM	#26
Kreyzhorse Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2006 Location: NKY Posts: 12,463	The frame cracking issue seems to have been a problem with early versions of the Tomcat. I would not allow that to keep me from buying one if that is what I really liked. That said, my buddy has a Tomcat that is pretty much his constant carry gun. Reliable and accurate although a little thick for my tastes. __________________ "He who laughs last, laughs dead." Homer Simpson

November 26, 2012, 12:16 PM	#30
weblance Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2012 Posts: 1,229	I also just bought a P32 I wanted a .32 for a BUG. It was between a Beretta Tomcat or a P32. I have a Beretta 21a Inox, and really would have liked a Tomcat, but would have had to order it. My LGS had the P32 in stock, and based on reviews, and comments, I bought the P32. I liked the idea of factory 10 shot magazines, and the weight, and size of the P32. I will get to shoot it in the next couple days. I also ordered an ArmaLaser For my P32. Now I need to find some ammo locally that is reasonably priced.

November 26, 2012, 12:38 PM	#31
RJay Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2005 Location: Arizona Posts: 1,936	The reason the small Berettas have a break open system is quite simple. It is not to load the first round, that is a nice feature , I guess, the small Berettas don't have an extractor. If you have a round in the chamber and want to unload the gun ( to put it away or what ever ) you can't rack the slide to expel the round in the chamber, you have to unlock the barrel to remove the round. The same with a rare misfire or defective cartridge, you can not rack the slide to remove the round, you must unlock the barrel and remove the round. close the barrel and then rack the slide ( or reach into your pocket for a loose round, insert it into the barrel and then close the barrel, all this while the bad guy is waiting for you finish ). If the gun is clean the round will drop out, if the chamber is dirty, the round must be picked out by hand. Not really a good feature, misfire in .25 ACP and .32 ACP are rare but it does happen. I've owned both the Berettas in .25 and .32, never did like the way they felt in my hand, but that is just me. __________________ Ron James

November 27, 2012, 05:30 PM	#36
Charlie Fox Member Join Date: January 25, 2001 Location: Summerville SC Posts: 79	The thinest, lightest .32 on the market is the KelTec. I've carried one in my left front pocket since 2003 and hardly know its there anymore. I only feed it FMJ's for reliability and penetration, but the newer models seem to handle all sorts of ammunition profiles without issue. __________________ "Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he's too old to fight, he'll just kill you."

November 27, 2012, 09:00 PM	#38
RJay Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2005 Location: Arizona Posts: 1,936	lamarw, reread my post. __________________ Ron James

November 23, 2012, 11:26 AM	#27
Thespis Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2010 Location: New England Posts: 125	Years back, a friend told me that he loved his Seecamp but that it was a tad picky when it came to ammo. I lucked into an NAA Guardian in .32 acp, got a complete (free!) tune-up from the NAA folks in Provo, UT, found the little pistol both accurate and 100% reliable with any ammo, and have never regretted my choice. As I write, the little Guardian is holstered in my right-hand jeans pocket.

November 26, 2012, 04:58 AM	#28
bonefamily Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2012 Location: central Ohio Posts: 304	Thanks for the replies and experiences, everyone. To sum it up, I ended up getting the P-32 yesterday - early Christmas present from the wife! No range time yet but plan to do so next weekend...

November 26, 2012, 10:01 AM	#29
lamarw Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2010 Location: Lake Martin, AL Posts: 3,311	I am not going to try to sway anyone one way or the other on this subject. I just want to interject the fact the stainless Tomcat and the later wider blued Tomcats do not have the issue with cracked slides. I have forgotten the dimensions for the wider slide, but I have posted it on this forum in the past. I believe the Tomcat is the only one of the pistols mentioned having the break barrel for loading a round. This helps some out there with limited strength to rack the slide. The only other thought I will add is the .32 ACP is a pain to reload.

November 27, 2012, 12:37 AM	#32
lamarw Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2010 Location: Lake Martin, AL Posts: 3,311	RJay, I am confused with your comments. Once you break the action and place a round in the barrel and it is fired, the pistol will eject and load the next round or first round in the magazine. Without having a round in the chamber, you can also cock the hammer and rack the slide to load the first round from the magazine without breaking the action. It is the shooter's choice. Although the first method allows for an extra round available (the magazine capacity + 1). I only see all the above as a plus and not a disadvantage. Possilby, I misinterpreted your thoughts.

November 27, 2012, 02:23 AM	#33
weblance Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2012 Posts: 1,229	Not having an extractor can be a problem with a SD gun. I have 2 different Tip-Up barrel pistols, both 22 LR. They have both been very reliable, but... I like the idea of having an extractor. The Tip-Up barrels are great for someone with physical limitations, who, for whatever reason, cant manipulate the slide on an Autoloader. Keep the chamber clean, use good ammo, and pray you dont have a jam. The Tomcat is a beautiful little pistol. I would love to own one. I cherish my Bobcat, and may get the Tomcat some time later, just because I can.

November 27, 2012, 08:44 AM	#34
Pianoguy Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2011 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 235	The cracked slide issue with the Tomcat seems to be a thing of the past. I haven't read of many cases of it that haven't been several years old. I have a Bobcat and kept clean and with the right ammo it's been very reliable and a great little pistol to shoot. I'm probably going to get a Tomcat in the near future. Although the gun is short it is wide compared to something like a P-32 or LCP and much heavier. I would think it might seem too big as a pocket pistol for some people but I imagine it would be much nicer to shoot (not that a 32acp is much of a handfull in other guns). The issue with the stiff slide is a real one for an small blow-back pistol like this. My Bobcat has the stiffest slide of any semi-auto I have ever tried and given it's so small and hard to get a grip on you really do appreciate the tip-up barrell (it's not so bad if you cock the pistol first so your not fighting the trigger, too). I'd also like to get a P-32 since I like small mouse-guns like that and have no problem carrying a small caliber gun for self-defense. I would think both of these would be good choices for anyone that wants a really small handgun and doesn't like too much snap of recoil and would rather hit what they aim at without fighting the gun too.

November 27, 2012, 04:15 PM	#35
Guv Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2012 Location: South Texas Posts: 2,126	I've got a Tomcat, hits like a brick through a plate glass window!

November 28, 2012, 09:09 PM	#39
Stevie-Ray Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2007 Location: The shores of Lake Huron Posts: 4,783	I like the KT P-32 for carry. I've used one for BUG for nearly a decade. It is always on me and even serves as primary once in a while as well, depending on circumstances. First rule of a gunfight and all..... I like the Geco ball in mine. __________________ Stevie-Ray Join the NRA/ILA I am the weapon; my gun is a tool. It's regrettable that with some people those descriptors are reversed.

November 28, 2012, 10:08 PM	#40
bonefamily Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2012 Location: central Ohio Posts: 304	Thanks everyone. Planning on shooting my P-32 for the first time this Saturday. I'll be using FMJ to avoid the rim lock issues I've read about.

November 29, 2012, 12:10 PM	#42
RJay Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2005 Location: Arizona Posts: 1,936	In Reference to Rim Lock on the .32 ACP. It must happen because people have said it does. I took 5 .32 ACP pistols ( yes, I like the .32 ), sat down and tried to induce " Rim Lock ", No matter what I did, I could not load any of the magazines with the cartridge rims over lapped, I also used several types of bullets. As a result I don't even consider it a problem ( For Me ). It is curious, in all the years I've been shooting I had never heard of the problem until the last couple of years. If rim-lock is a real or common problem , why has the problem never surfaced before. Even if it real problem , if you load the magazine one shell at a time--- oh, never mind , I've typed enough on the subject . __________________ Ron James

November 29, 2012, 03:36 PM	#43
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,985	Ron- After shooting various semi rimmed cartridges for many years I had never experienced rim lock either. Recently, I was cleaning my wife's P32. As I unloaded it-rim lock. Puzzling, because I loaded the mag in the first place. Since her gun likes Fiocchi hollow points, I ordered and installed the rim lock kit from K/T. I load my gun with Powerballs now. __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

November 29, 2012, 05:43 PM	#44
bonefamily Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2012 Location: central Ohio Posts: 304	Thanks for the replies, guys. Because the P-32 is the first .32 acp that I have owned, I have yet (if will) to have rim lock issues. Over on the Kel Tec forums they mention rim lock with the P-32 a common issue. They say that longer OAL ammunition helps with this - but again, I don't know. I also read about the Flyer Wire mod to help with this. I'm going to start with FMJ's for now and will give some HP's a try later and see how it goes. Thanks!

November 29, 2012, 08:44 PM	#46
Guv Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2012 Location: South Texas Posts: 2,126	Maybe rim-lock is more of a 38 Super or 38 ACP issue?

November 29, 2012, 10:01 PM	#47
WyMark Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2011 Location: Wyoming Posts: 647	I've had it happen twice on my P32, both times from FMJ Blazer rounds that had just enough set back to shorten them about the same as the width of the rim. Only way I could clear it was to take the base plate off the mag and drop the rounds out the bottom, then I was able to pull the slide back a bit and clear it. Pain in the butt. Been shooting Fiochi 73g FMJ since then without any problems.

November 29, 2012, 10:22 PM	#48
bonefamily Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2012 Location: central Ohio Posts: 304	Thanks, all. WyMark - I'll pick up some Fiocchi 73g FMJ's for the weekend. I've heard good results with this ammunition on several posts.

November 30, 2012, 04:57 AM	#49
Master Blaster 2 Junior member Join Date: May 29, 2011 Posts: 895	I got my Seecamp 32 back when they were the only game in town. Everything small was 25Cal. I Still have it. She will only feed Silvertip or equal length ammo. Was relable but you had to hold onto the gun well and with my big hands it was a pain.I Got a KelTec 32 when they first csme out and never had an issue. Even though the P32 is larger it is however lighter and easier for me to control. With the guns clip i can carry it in my front pocket like a knife. I got the P3AT too but gave that to my son as I sill prefer my P11 when i need a small pistol.

November 30, 2012, 05:52 AM	#50
bonefamily Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2012 Location: central Ohio Posts: 304	^^ My P-32 has the belt clip as well (purchased it with the clip already installed). I don't have my CC permit yet as our class is next month, but I haven't finalized yet about how I want to carry it. Do you feel comfortable carrying yours with the clip only and not in a pocket holster - or do you use both? Thanks.