Are Speer bullets lubed?

PolarFBear · November 25, 2015, 09:30 AM

Bought a box of 500 Speer 38's. I did not open the pack of 500, just relied on the factory box photo. When I opened the package the bullets had no lube in the lube grooves! I checked the Speer web site and no real answer. They are Speer 38/158 SWC HP #4628. The box says "swaged", "perfect for plinking" and "triple hard lubed". They are a medium to dark gray in color and definitely seem to have been coated with something. I was just surprised at no lube in the grooves of a factory bullet. Are they good to go as is; or should I lube them? If I do lube it will be with Lee Liquid Alox.

reddog81 · November 25, 2015, 10:26 AM

I've never tried those specific bullets but the pics online would indicate they are the same as the 148 hollow base wadcutters that I have used.
These bullets have a "dry" lube that coats the entire bullet. Hornady has a similar coating for their swaged bullets. These are soft lead meant for target loads.
They will be fine as long as you don't push them too fast.

ligonierbill · November 25, 2015, 10:34 AM

I have fired a bunch of the Speer swaged SWCHP. Never added lube, never had a problem. One of my favorite bullets.

TimSr · November 25, 2015, 11:50 AM

They are lubed, just not wax in the groove type.

FrankenMauser · November 25, 2015, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Are they good to go as is; or should I lube them? If I do lube it will be with Lee Liquid Alox.

They're dry-lubed. Run as-is.

And... Alox isn't a lubricant. It's a corrosion inhibitor. (Or, "anti-corrosion sealant," if you prefer.)
Keep that in mind as you coat bullets with it, and read the praise lauded upon it by bullet casters.

It's about like using a water-displacing compound as a gun cleaner and lubricant....

(That last one is a reference to WD-40.)

PolarFBear · November 25, 2015, 01:33 PM

Thanks to all, I will proceed to the loading bench and the Dillon 550b directly. And spend a pleasurable afternoon in lead therapy; avoiding the T-day preparations from the "head lead".

T. O'Heir · November 25, 2015, 01:45 PM

Swaged means they were formed out of soft, pure lead, wire. Usually with graphite on 'em. No additional lube is required.
Really daft putting a hollow point into a lead bullet. They hit something hard and they expand dramatically anyway.

dahermit · November 25, 2015, 04:12 PM

Quote:

And... Alox isn't a lubricant. It's a corrosion inhibitor. (Or, "anti-corrosion sealant," if you prefer.)
Keep that in mind as you coat bullets with it, and read the praise lauded upon it by bullet casters.

Tallow is not a lubricant either...it is a natural fat that accumulates on animals to store energy and was used to lubricate bullets. So it would seem that what a substance "is", is a moot point...it is a matter of what it can be used as. Note: the NRA formula 50/50 Alox has successfully been used as a cast lead bullet lubricant for many years. Bullet lubricants need not involve rocket science.

Jim Watson · November 25, 2015, 04:18 PM

Can you get Alox 2138F any more? I have read that it was no longer made and you get a different product in your Alox-beeswax bullet lube now.

PolarFBear · November 26, 2015, 09:40 AM

Loaded 150 rounds with no incidents with 4.2 grains of Winchester W-231. I did have a bit of a struggle setting bullet depth. These bullets have two cannelures, one very small one below the shoulder and a "real" cannelure just above the bottom grease groove. If I set to the "real" cannelure COL exceeds 1.550. Perhaps these bullets are for use in a magnum as well. Just seems a soft swaged bullet would not be a match in a magnum load.

Another oddity: I referenced Lee, Speer, Lyman, Winchester and my own diary for a suitable charge of W231. Lee stated never to exceed 3.9 grains. The other three listed 3.9 grains as about their starting load. I was surprised at the disparity. I have heard Lee does not test it's own loads just reprints others' data. I have loaded as low as 3.2 grains and they were really "wimpy". I am not looking for a "killer" load - just a good push back.

Thanks all.

dahermit · November 26, 2015, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Can you get Alox 2138F any more? I have read that it was no longer made and you get a different product in your Alox-beeswax bullet lube now.

I read somewhere on a cast bullet forum that Alox 2138F is no longer made, but another one of the available Alox products could be combined with some kind of wax (some microcrystalline wax? unfortunately I cannot remember which wax it was), could be added to it and arrive at Alox 2138F...and then 50% beeswax could be added to get NRA 50/50 formula.

November 25, 2015, 09:30 AM	#1
PolarFBear Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 2015 Location: NE Tennessee, a "Free State" Posts: 478	Are Speer bullets lubed? Bought a box of 500 Speer 38's. I did not open the pack of 500, just relied on the factory box photo. When I opened the package the bullets had no lube in the lube grooves! I checked the Speer web site and no real answer. They are Speer 38/158 SWC HP #4628. The box says "swaged", "perfect for plinking" and "triple hard lubed". They are a medium to dark gray in color and definitely seem to have been coated with something. I was just surprised at no lube in the grooves of a factory bullet. Are they good to go as is; or should I lube them? If I do lube it will be with Lee Liquid Alox.

November 25, 2015, 01:45 PM	#7
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	Swaged means they were formed out of soft, pure lead, wire. Usually with graphite on 'em. No additional lube is required. Really daft putting a hollow point into a lead bullet. They hit something hard and they expand dramatically anyway. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

November 25, 2015, 10:26 AM	#2
reddog81 Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,634	I've never tried those specific bullets but the pics online would indicate they are the same as the 148 hollow base wadcutters that I have used. These bullets have a "dry" lube that coats the entire bullet. Hornady has a similar coating for their swaged bullets. These are soft lead meant for target loads. They will be fine as long as you don't push them too fast.

November 25, 2015, 10:34 AM	#3
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,456	I have fired a bunch of the Speer swaged SWCHP. Never added lube, never had a problem. One of my favorite bullets.

November 25, 2015, 11:50 AM	#4
TimSr Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Rittman, Ohio Posts: 2,074	They are lubed, just not wax in the groove type.

November 25, 2015, 01:33 PM	#6
PolarFBear Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 2015 Location: NE Tennessee, a "Free State" Posts: 478	Thanks to all, I will proceed to the loading bench and the Dillon 550b directly. And spend a pleasurable afternoon in lead therapy; avoiding the T-day preparations from the "head lead".

November 25, 2015, 04:18 PM	#9
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,543	Can you get Alox 2138F any more? I have read that it was no longer made and you get a different product in your Alox-beeswax bullet lube now.

November 26, 2015, 09:40 AM	#10
PolarFBear Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 2015 Location: NE Tennessee, a "Free State" Posts: 478	Loaded 150 rounds with no incidents with 4.2 grains of Winchester W-231. I did have a bit of a struggle setting bullet depth. These bullets have two cannelures, one very small one below the shoulder and a "real" cannelure just above the bottom grease groove. If I set to the "real" cannelure COL exceeds 1.550. Perhaps these bullets are for use in a magnum as well. Just seems a soft swaged bullet would not be a match in a magnum load. Another oddity: I referenced Lee, Speer, Lyman, Winchester and my own diary for a suitable charge of W231. Lee stated never to exceed 3.9 grains. The other three listed 3.9 grains as about their starting load. I was surprised at the disparity. I have heard Lee does not test it's own loads just reprints others' data. I have loaded as low as 3.2 grains and they were really "wimpy". I am not looking for a "killer" load - just a good push back. Thanks all.